Seaport Neighborhood - Infill and Discussion

[393b40]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

The Seaport is what you get when your mayor thinks he is playing SimCity and the BRA and state agencies are asleep at the wheel.

 

[jl326]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

There is a ton of new housing, but for the majority of people its pretty un-affordable.

This is true. The Seaport is being built up to be a high end area though, with highly sought-after locations near or on waterfront, so that should be fairly expected. The residences are still being filled up at the current prices though, so I think it's just the market forces at work here.

 

[SeamusMcFly]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

There is a ton of new housing, but for the majority of people its pretty un-affordable.

Won't get an argument out of me on that. I don't consider much if any housing in Boston to be affordable.

But, the whole trickle down is supposed to help ease burdens. I'll believe it when I see it.

However, the housing not being affordable, doesn't mean people don't live there and start making it a real neighborhood. Just maybe a super yuppie neighborhood. Which is pretty much what we're getting. It doesn't end up being for everyone. But, then again that's not much different than many of the other popular neighborhoods in town.

 

[TheRifleman]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

The seaport/innovation district mostly likely won't be family friendly.
Too expensive even for an upperclass to raise a family in this area.

The area is more geared to the college grads with family money to spend, rich international students, high paying jobs, accountants, lawyers, scientists. Good place for the single people.

 

[bigpicture7]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

New NYTimes article just out about Boston's Seaport Innovation District:

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/15/r...-boston-seaport-ge-was-just-a-start.html?_r=0

 

[odurandina]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Seaport is not natural progression:

The BRA should have focused the development in the core city along with pushing & planning for rapid expansion of the transit out towards the seaport so it evolved and developed into a neighborhood and businesses.
These garages would have benefitted the overall public to be developed instead of have all the tax incentives given to the Fallon and other company's and developers concerning the seaport area.
Winthrop garage
Harbor garage
Congress garage
South station

focusing on the core of the city were the hardrails are located would have made sense.
The problem was all the tax incentives went to buildout a sprawling office park that created more useless traffic in the city instead of focusing on city core development.

1 Congress office (not helped by the ample Seaport supply) and Harbor Garage could still happen.

 

[jl326]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

In 30 years maybe. Anytime soon? No.

Put me in the incredibly pessimistic camp for the Seaport. It's not Boston. It's some sort of weird 128 + conventioners w/ corporate credit card paradise by the sea. It's shiny, flat, fake, inhuman by design. It's a playground for people with more money or no common sense to throw 3-4K at a studio or 1B. It's not designed for families.

It's just an absolute waste of space. Boston took one of it's crown jewel assets and shit all over it with poor planning and execution. I live 15 minutes from it by foot in downtown and I never go there unless someone from out of town drags me there. I don't know anyone else who lives in the city who also willingly goes there unless they work there.

Fuck the Seaport.

I think this just shows that no one area will make everyone happy, but that's OK. For every individual with like-minded pessimism (or outright hatred, it seems) for the Seaport, there are also many others who love working and living here. I hear it almost every day from neighbors and the like. By the way, many of the people who have happily moved into the area were previously Boston residents or from the surrounding suburbs.

You're right that it's not family-centric. I believe the majority of residents are younger professionals, DINKs (double income no kids), or empty nesters. But then again, they all chose to live/relocate from suburbs to be here so many people do see the appeal of being here.

I'm not trying to change your mind about it. In fact, I appreciate the candor (can't get more direct than "Fuck the Seaport" ). I'll only repeat a sentiment shared multiple times by another poster (Stick-n-Move, I believe?) in that the Seaport does nothing to change the parts and areas of Boston you already know and love. The Seaport only adds to Boston and, yes, it's a little different. For someone like me who has lived in Boston and the surrounding suburbs for over 30yrs., I'm liking that the Seaport offers a different feel.. and it's no where near being done.

 

[JeffDowntown]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I think this just shows that no one area will make everyone happy, but that's OK. For every individual with like-minded pessimism (or outright hatred, it seems) for the Seaport, there are also many others who love working and living here. I hear it almost every day from neighbors and the like. By the way, many of the people who have happily moved into the area were previously Boston residents or from the surrounding suburbs.

You're right that it's not family-centric. I believe the majority of residents are younger professionals, DINKs (double income no kids), or empty nesters. But then again, they all chose to live/relocate from suburbs to be here so many people do see the appeal of being here.

I'm not trying to change your mind about it. In fact, I appreciate the candor (can't get more direct than "Fuck the Seaport" ). I'll only repeat a sentiment shared multiple times by another poster (Stick-n-Move, I believe?) in that the Seaport does nothing to change the parts and areas of Boston you already know and love. The Seaport only adds to Boston and, yes, it's a little different. For someone like me who has lived in Boston and the surrounding suburbs for over 30yrs., I'm liking that the Seaport offers a different feel.. and it's no where near being done.

I think I can also echo this sentiment. I am not a fan of the Seaport, but clearly there are people who are. From that standpoint is is additive to Boston, as a new type of work/live/visit destination.

If it draws in more high-end talent and good jobs, and high-end visitors who drop cash, more power to it!

Now we just have to fix the transportation infrastructure before it has a traffic and transit coronary.

 

[TheRifleman]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Now we just have to fix the transportation infrastructure before it has a traffic and transit coronary.

Usually this type of thinking and planning begin before they start building out the area. But what do I know.

 

[whighlander]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

^ nice take on the seaport. I'm not a huge fan either but as you said, out of towners seem to really like it. It's not really for you or me, the average Bostonian. It's for the suburbanites afraid to drive in a real city, afraid to take the T, afraid to walk 15 minutes to get somewhere for fear something will happen to them.

Suffolk -- Jeff -- likes it enough to pot that GE logo visible from mars on the edge of the Fort Point Channel

the other Jeff [2]--Bornstein the Senior Vice President and Chief Financial Officer for GE Company likes it because there are no deer running lose outside the GE HQ

Of course Uber Jeff bought a condo on the edge of the Public Garden -- wave to him when he walks by on the way to his HQ

Jeff 2 -- we don't yet know his new home address -- perhaps Fan Pier or Pier 4?

 

[whighlander]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

The Seaport is what you get when your mayor thinks he is playing SimCity and the BRA and state agencies are asleep at the wheel.

Meddlepal -- had you lived in the area for a bit longer -- you would realize that the Seaport / Innovation District is what you get when:

You had an abundance of non-functional infrastructure lying around about 1970 -- e.g. the Port Facilities. Over the decades since private enterprise has had an opportunity that is "virtually clean sheet" with a few governmental interventions: [Federal Court House, Massport, staging for the Big Dig, BCEC]

Each of those posed challenges and offered opportunities -- not all of the challenges have been met and some of the key opportunities are still unharvested

The rest is as you would expect [Not] -- first parking lots came with some quiet land acquisitions and then finally a bonafide boom, spurred by Vertex. However, there were Boston-peculiarities built-in to the mix such as limiting housing so as not to dilute the voting power of "Old Southy"

The key is that nowhere in the window of time from 1985 [Conversion of Commonwealth Pier into Word Trade Center Boston] to 2005 [McCourt Exit] could anyone have anticipated what 2016 would look-like -- the real question is how well can we anticipate what it will look like in 2035

 

[TheRifleman]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I think this just shows that no one area will make everyone happy, but that's OK. For every individual with like-minded pessimism (or outright hatred, it seems) for the Seaport, there are also many others who love working and living here. I hear it almost every day from neighbors and the like. By the way, many of the people who have happily moved into the area were previously Boston residents or from the surrounding suburbs.

You're right that it's not family-centric. I believe the majority of residents are younger professionals, DINKs (double income no kids), or empty nesters. But then again, they all chose to live/relocate from suburbs to be here so many people do see the appeal of being here.

I'm not trying to change your mind about it. In fact, I appreciate the candor (can't get more direct than "Fuck the Seaport" ). I'll only repeat a sentiment shared multiple times by another poster (Stick-n-Move, I believe?) in that the Seaport does nothing to change the parts and areas of Boston you already know and love. The Seaport only adds to Boston and, yes, it's a little different. For someone like me who has lived in Boston and the surrounding suburbs for over 30yrs., I'm liking that the Seaport offers a different feel.. and it's no where near being done.

The problem with the seaport/innovation district is its not Boston. It's a corporate political shitshow it's not unique.
Back bay
Northend
Downtown
South i.e.
Charlestown

All have history of evolving from something.
Fenway area turned into a disaster with that stupid hotel commonwealth.

The ex mayor and the BRA just copied the Kendal square model which evolved because of MIT which runs directly on the redline which is why Cambridge rents are more than Boston.

#1 survey concerning a commercial tenant needs: location and transportation. If you don't live in the seaport but happen to work there your screwed.

My question is when they buildout pier 4 retail besides the silver bus most people have to drive down there.

The mayor and the BRA roles should be offering and preparing solid infrastructure so companies and neighborhoods have the opportunity to grow.
We should just be able to cast a vote concerning developments instead of letting our leaders drive the arguments for political bullshit on what gets done in this city. We are in the Information Age now.

If Boston was so innovative then why is Cambridge mass have higher commercial rents?

 

[bigpicture7]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

^
Silver line needs to be converted to light rail if Seaport grows to anywhere near the employee, resident, and shopper volume suggested by plans/proposals/construction-in-progress.

(not to mention the freakin' silver line bus gets stuck in traffic trying to take you 2.2 miles to the airport from south station).

The Kendall Sq. model depends heavily on the following:
Massive parking facility at the end of the line (e.g., Alewife station). Employees in Kendall either live in NW suburbs and park/ride, or they live along the redline itself (either end of the line - braintree, quincy, etc). I pity those Kendall workers who do neither (and there are some).

But that model can work: massive transit station/parking at the extremities of a rapid transit line, coupled with residences along the transit line itself.

Building up the seaport without investing in light rail to the seaport is BS politics.

**Edit: I should say: I have nothing (yet) against the seaport itself, the design elements employed, etc - I agree it is not in conflict with the core of Boston, and exists as an add-on that people can explore (or ignore) as they wish. My main beef is transit**

 

[whighlander]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

The problem with the seaport/innovation district is its not Boston.....

The ex mayor and the BRA just copied the Kendall Square model which evolved because of MIT which runs directly on the redline which is why Cambridge rents are more than Boston....

If Boston was so innovative then why is Cambridge mass have higher commercial rents?

Riff -- you blew right past it

MIT

You don't see an MIT in the Seaport do you?

from MIT's back door you can see outposts of more companies in the innovation business than in most of the rest of the world combined

And now MIT is building some more in Kendall which will provide a proper back-door as well as some opportunities for the Nanotech revolution to get going

However, GE -- might just be for the Seaport / Innovation District the same kind of boost that MIT provides to Kendall and Harvard is hoping to deliver to Western Ave.

 

[Shepard]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

New NYTimes article just out about Boston's Seaport Innovation District:

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/15/r...-boston-seaport-ge-was-just-a-start.html?_r=0

Some new and informative stuff in here, actually. For example: did you know that the Seaport was specifically planned to "avoid megablocks"...? And that the area is booming with new and planned transit options? I didn't. Apparently, though, if your hard-hitting reporting is based on nothing but a slew of phone calls to real estate speculators, that's what you would find.

 

[stick n move]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Cities change. Someone who moved away in the 90s could feel like the greenway isnt boston, someone who grew up in the 20s could feel like the central artery wasnt boston, if someone from the 1600s came to the future they would think scollay square wasnt Boston and the city was completely ruined. Its all relative, the seaport is Boston. If I can walk over there and touch the concrete with my hands its Boston. We just have to live with it as it evolves and choose not to go there if u dont like it. Its not a big deal and at the very minimum its adding much needed office space and labs whether it sucks or not.

 

[Tombstoner]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I'm sure the Beacon Hill-ites were appalled when that crappy McNeighborhood was built on swampland in the Back Bay.

 

[fattony]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

the Seaport was specifically planned to "avoid megablocks"...?

To be fair, the Seaport doesn't have mega blocks. The old New York WTC was a mega block. Government Center. The Pru complex.

The Seaport proper - along the water and Seaport Blvd - doesn't have anything that big. The large-ish blocks are parceled up with pretty decent internal pedestrian ways. The convention center... that is big, but it also predates any attempt to urbanize the place.

They easily could have dropped a South Bay Center on the Seaport and called it a day. They didn't and that is no small victory for urbanism. I'm not saying it is the ideal urban layout, but don't cry wolf right?

 

[statler]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I'm sure the Beacon Hill-ites were appalled when that crappy McNeighborhood was built on swampland in the Back Bay.

If my Boston history is correct, it was in fact built by the Beacon Hill-ites looking to get away from the poors who were crowding them on the 'wrong side' of the Hill.

 

[JeffDowntown]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

If my Boston history is correct, it was in fact built by the Beacon Hill-ites looking to get away from the poors who were crowding them on the 'wrong side' of the Hill.

Correct, most of the Back Bay mansions were built for Brahmins fleeing Beacon Hill.