Seaport Neighborhood - Infill and Discussion

[odurandina]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

150 Seaport is pretty cool because of the way it joins 2 underutilized parcelettes, including City land with underground power lines. the problem seems to be not allowing Cronin to just make the dock bigger. That's just totally stupid. No reason the City, State and developer can't accommodate everyone.

 

[Rover]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Just to be clear I can't stand NIMBY's in case that wasn't coming across in my postings. However, I would get their bitching about this project due to all the exceptions and variances required to put a buildable lot together. But, what I think they and their enablers in the local media are missing is the replacing the existing structure argument. Too many brainless wonders claimed that Chiofaro paid too much for the garage for example, and now he needs to build high to recoup his investment. Some guy out here even kept making that argument. Time and factual analysis has disproven that theory. The garage stays forever as long as it keeps making money, which it has been doing. Likewise to this specific proposal I don't know the financials of Whiskey Priest but if the place makes money it'll stay right where it is blocking the view of the harbor for the foreseeable future. It would be nice if that point was brought up more often in coverage of the issue.

 

[jl326]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Just to be clear I can't stand NIMBY's in case that wasn't coming across in my postings. However, I would get their bitching about this project due to all the exceptions and variances required to put a buildable lot together. But, what I think they and their enablers in the local media are missing is the replacing the existing structure argument. Too many brainless wonders claimed that Chiofaro paid too much for the garage for example, and now he needs to build high to recoup his investment. Some guy out here even kept making that argument. Time and factual analysis has disproven that theory. The garage stays forever as long as it keeps making money, which it has been doing. Likewise to this specific proposal I don't know the financials of Whiskey Priest but if the place makes money it'll stay right where it is blocking the view of the harbor for the foreseeable future. It would be nice if that point was brought up more often in coverage of the issue.

I may be misinterpreting your comment here, so please excuse me if that is the case, but I thought the condo proposal came from the same owner of Whiskey Priest and next door Atlantic Beer Garden. There's no dispute or conflict amongst ownership.

 

[jl326]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Also when I walk through the Boston Common at times: I find it very uninviting seeing all the Drug Addicts, Homeless People all camped out like the Boston Common is there HOME.

Very depressing and Uninviting to bring your kids or animals around that type of activity.

I actually would rather the areas be un-inviting but knowing that anybody can actually use them by law.

Yes, it is indeed nicer than having to scan your surroundings for dog poop or used syringe needles before plopping down on the grass.

 

[Brad Plaid]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

No surprises here, typical Boston development drama queenery. Blockhead, virtue-signaling green ideologues pretending to stand up for the little guy against the big, bad capitalist pig when they are really just trying to extort an undeserved payoff for themselves. Multiple city and state agencies with overlapping jurisdictions, created by a politically motivated regulatory machine, at one another's throats like lions trying to chew off a bigger chunk of zebra. Nope, nothing to see here, just classic MA dysfunction.

 

[atlantaden]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

What more do you want from someone who has rights to their own property and has pumped millions of dollars into converting a desolate (former industrial wasteland) parking lot into something that is NOT A DESOLATE PARKINGLOT / WASTELAND.

Another perfect and very recent example of this is the Lovejoy Wharf development! Not only did the developer rehab one beautiful old building for Converse, and then built a new condo building, but they totally rebuilt an ancient pier into a beautiful public space/walkway!

 

[TheRifleman]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Yes, it is indeed nicer than having to scan your surroundings for dog poop or used syringe needles before plopping down on the grass.

The reality is these types of people are endangering the innocent children that want to run around a public park as they take squatter rights for the summer times.

As an investor if I'm investing 200Million in my development I do not want to attract those types of individuals around the development surroundings along with overall yearly maintenance costs.

The more and more I rationally think about Shelley Comments about see you in court. The BRA should Identify right away about the validity of the argument concerning the development before this ever even gets to court.

 

[Rover]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I may be misinterpreting your comment here, so please excuse me if that is the case, but I thought the condo proposal came from the same owner of Whiskey Priest and next door Atlantic Beer Garden. There's no dispute or conflict amongst ownership.

I didn't think there was a conflict between those two businesses either. My point was separate from that but apparently not very well made.

 

[odurandina]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Too many brainless wonders claimed that Chiofaro paid too much for the garage for example, and now he needs to build high to recoup his investment. Some guy out here even kept making that argument. Time and factual analysis has disproven that theory. The garage stays forever as long as it keeps making money, which it has been doing....

i did get some guidance from Chiofaro Co to make damn sure to include this point in BOLD text per my advocacy up on Skysc City, and in da Globe... as it was a poor attempt to slander Don, and totally untrue. ....You do what you can to encourage the proletariat not to buy into every lie that fits their agenda.

overstated, faux opposition...

....alleging that Don Chiofaro grossly overpaid for the Garage; and is seeking permitting from the BRA to redevelop the site in order to avoid the consequences of his poor investment decision.... This is not true. The Garage is a self-sustaining investment acquired at a price reflecting it's true market value. This fact is proven by recent sales of other such properties in the Boston marketplace.

 

[stellarfun]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Interesting this discussion about the riff-raff etc, --the neighbors to this proposed park I am reviewing want the park closed at night, so the homeless and the riff-raff won't hang out. And as the park is private property, relatively easy to do. (As the condos haven't been sold yet, those voices are silent.)

Just out of curiosity, has anybody walked the Harborwalk on the harbor side of Harbor Towers?

 

[TheRifleman]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Interesting this discussion about the riff-raff etc, --the neighbors to this proposed park I am reviewing want the park closed at night, so the homeless and the riff-raff won't hang out. And as the park is private property, relatively easy to do. (As the condos haven't been sold yet, those voices are silent.)

Just out of curiosity, has anybody walked the Harborwalk on the harbor side of Harbor Towers?

Yes. The HarborWalk area is nice not very open or wide enough, I would be worried about a few drunken fools falling into the ocean late at night but overall its very quiet. They do have movie nights behind Rowes Wharf.
That entire area is caters to Harbor Towers Residents since the Pool Area prevents anytype of openesss from the Greenway to the Harbor for the public.

On the other side from Harbor Garage is so active near the outdoor bar called (the Landing --along with towards the North End) The energy is very vibrant and exciting, great city life.

There are like two sides of the Harbor Garage:
Left side from the Aquarium is for the PUBLIC LIFE (Energy, fun, vibrant)
Right Side is catered to the NIMBYS (Quiet, No need to check out this private area)

This part of the GREENWAY is screaming to be --WIDE OPEN--For the public

 

[odurandina]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Rifleman,

Consider the U/C or currently-leasing in the Bulfinch Triangle to the West End construction or what's getting ready to commence. .... Then add the Seaport, Harborfaro Tower and Hook Lobster.

The whole area is going to be ALIVEEEEE....... and with that, more people will be seen on the Waterfront to the Greenway more than evaar, and long after the summer months.

Then the floodgates will open with curiosity visitors spilling over from Faneuil Hall market district. i'm switching to decaf and vegan diet because i want to be around to watch my grandkids playing under the Pagans on the Greenway..... and then jump at Central Station and head up to Newburyport for Yankee Homecoming.

The amazing thing in all of this is when you hear all these bitter people moaning about Marty Walsh's so-called woeful housing and economic development plan (wtf).

btw, a state official who shall remain nameless tells me, if we all knew what Marty has planned for the West End + the Kenmore areas–some of us might need oxygen.

 

[falcon42]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

If Marty is involved, make sure its union!

 

[FK4]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Uninviting signage?? Are you serious?! I am pretty sure that even sections of Boston Common and Public Garden, amongst the riff-raff and the homeless who occupy its maintained grounds, have signage that restricts dogs/pets from certain areas.

As others have mentioned, this is an example of something that was actually executed well. It is a publicly accessible green space on the harbor walk paid for and maintained by condo owners. It even has a nice area for toddlers. Whereas, previously, it was a "mud" parking lot that you had to pay to get into.

Which one is more uninviting?

Meddle is right. The signage on these parks IS uninviting and makes it quite clear that you are not on public property. This is a classic example of the insidious ways that power is concentrated and then cloaked in pretty things. It's a very slippery slope and while nobody would argue that it doesn't look nicer than a parking lot, it is incumbent on all of us to remember that public lands are for everyone and despite the risk of tragedy-of-the-commons scenarios where homeless people sleep on benches and heroin addicts shoot up on public property, the power to exclude and kick people off private property is a very terrible power indeed... and I, and I hope all of you as well, would take public property shared in common by and for all people over corporate, well-maintained but subtly restricted private pseudo-parks any day.

 

[TheRifleman]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

If your talking about access to the overall public. The planning for the Seaport was never really focused on the overall public interest because its more geared towards cars not accessible transit for the masses. This is part of the reason for the failure right off the start concerning the overall public. Menino and the BRA should be in jail for this type of incompetent planning. Then tack on the percs they gave these companies and developers for the Seaport prime real estate.

How many Homeless, Junkies and everyday workers are going to walk or drive their cars from Downtown to Cronin's little park? Not many Junkies or Homeless folks. Seaport entire development was geared for the RICH and the Upper Class individuals.

Harbor Garage is a different animal the goddam garage is right off the Blue Line---connected to both the Greenway and the Harbor. Everybody that has a $1.25 to take the Blue line into town can hang out at the water fountain and enjoy the waterfront.

Why do you think the NIMBY'S (Harbor Tower Residents) are throwing the kitchen sink at Chiofaro/Pru and their idea.

CLF, Barr Foundation: Yeah--- they have the best interest of the public more like the Billionaire's interest.

 

[akmags]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I find it interesting that many of you think that this area is void of pedestrians or difficult to walk to. It really isn't that far of a walk from downtown - just over a bridge and bam! your in the seaport!

I wanted to get a glimpse of this first hand, so I walked over there from my office on Franklin Street this afternoon. I was able to essentially walk along the harbor all the way from the Seaport Blvd bridge to the new condos still under construction. Once built, you can walk uninterrupted to the ICA -- and I presume further but everything was bound by construction fencing.

I can understand the argument of where public/private ends, as you cannot necessarily delineate between the two, but at no point did I ever feel as I was imposing on private property during my stroll. Streets that ended along the harbor walk provided easy access, so I'm curious to understand how or why people feel that there is no public connection to the water.

Edit: I will say that this experience will change once everything is done. As of right now, I'm in agreement that it is not pedestrian friendly due to all of the construction.

 

[odurandina]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

^^Thank you. btw, the coming so-called Harborwalk bottleneck at 150 Seaport could be shaped into a tunnel, full of vines with the party/dining deck on top.... done right, it could be something ranging from nice to fully epic and badass. ....The nimby's would say this idea is 'totally the worst yet'–which would make me like it all the more.

 

[stick n move]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Whats the bottleneck at 150 seaport?



You walk down here along the water

Past the entrance

Take a right between pier 4 and 150 seaport.

Then continue along the harborwalk here.

Noone said you have to go behind the tower. Its more for the restaurant seating and you walk in front of the tower. You cant walk along the water behind whiskey priest today so nothing is being lost here. If you so choose you can walk behind this tower along the water. Something is being gained but no harbor walk frontage is being lost here.

 

[cca]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Oh good, I was wondering when we would get a resource wasting tower that twists because of fashion trends. That will make us cooler ...right ... right?

cca

 

[stick n move]

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Whats wrong with it here? People complain if we get a box, people complain if we get twists, people complain if we leave parking lots, people complain if we don't have enough parking lots, people complain if we don't get enough retail, and people complain if theres too much retail. Which is it lol? What resources are being wasted? If it was a box it would use more glass overall. This is a short tower its not like the world is going to be out of steel after this goes up. I think we all need to agree to disagree and realize that nothing is going to make everyone happy. Just be thankful that Boston is getting a brand new neighborhood that was previously a waterfront parking lot. To me, I think this is a nice tower and it seems like they put a lot of thought into the design.