Taxes, Government

Justin7 said:
No idea what this means. Anyone able to translate?
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So why is the govt hiring 16,000 IRS agents part of the healthcare bill? If its such a great bill?

Translate that

I think a key to a great bill would be to give our society incentive to have more doctors & nurses which would help with supply & demand in the system. Not overwhelming it with immigrants and additional 30 million non-insured citizens,

How about the govt get control of malpractice lawsuits in which the patients are limited to a certain amount?

How about these facts Justin? And honestly relax with the name calling you wouldn't want me to bitch slap you at the Seaport district infront of the rest of the bloggers.
 
TheRifleman said:
So why is the govt hiring 16,000 IRS agents part of the healthcare bill? If its such a great bill?

Translate that
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I still have no idea what your previous post was supposed to mean, but regarding this one: They're not! As I said before, check your facts. Are you incapable of that? You're just spouting out nonsense you heard on Fox News. I don't know who is worse, those who make up these lies in order to advance their narrative, or the dipshits who mindlessly spread them without taking a moment to see if they contain any truth.

Also, did you actually just threaten me? Are you twelve years old?

(Dear, everyone else: Sorry. I should probably know better, but when someone spreads this nonsense around there is a chance someone will believe it, then pass it on themselves.)
 
Justin7 said:
I still have no idea what your previous post was supposed to mean, but regarding this one: They're not! As I said before, check your facts. Are you incapable of that? You're just spouting out nonsense you heard on Fox News. I don't know who is worse, those who make up these lies in order to advance their narrative, or the dipshits who mindlessly spread them without taking a moment to see if they contain any truth.

Also, did you actually just threaten me? Are you twelve years old?

(Dear, everyone else: Sorry. I should probably know better, but when someone spreads this nonsense around there is a chance someone will believe it, then pass it on themselves.)
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I accept the apology and I'm sorry for the threat, no need for this site to become like that.

I will check my facts on the healthcare bill and re-post my new thoughts.
Stay-tuned Part 2.
 
Justin7 said:
I(Dear, everyone else: Sorry. I should probably know better, but when someone spreads this nonsense around there is a chance someone will believe it, then pass it on themselves.)
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Only a person with shit for brains would support the Obama-Care along with the Fast and Furious program is complete non-sense?

(And our Govt wants to regulate guns on their citizens but sells guns to the Drug Cartel Lords) Basically saying we are SHEEP for Slaughter.



Everything the Govt. touches turns to shit.
Social Security & Medicare are bankrupt.
TSA Security (an absolute disaster)
IRS (has more words in the Tax code book than the bible) It’s basically a sham to game the middleclass
SEC (still waiting to understand why they didn't file charges against the Fannie Mae executives for looting the company with bonuses after not filing financials for 3 years with the NYSE.

Justin: Can you please tell me how these programs up above have helped this Free country evolve into GOVT Bureaucracy?

So how the hell is the GOVT now going to run Healthcare. We are under a complete totalitarianism Regime by our GOVT officials. Republicans & Democrats are sold us out to a select corporate elite.

How do you like that fucking thesis.
 
Question for Rifleman,

What country do you feel gives you a better chance of a successful future than the US?

Explain in detail how and why that country offers it's citizens a better future than the US offers theirs.
 
datadyne007 said:
No, he just believes in the people and future of this country.
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Believing in the people and the future of a free country is not letting GOVT control all aspects of our life.
Its about believing in Freedom and personal choice on what decisions you choose to make. Hold yourself accountable for the choices you have made.

The future of the country is not based on bailing out Failure and controlling who fails and who doesn't. That is not a society of freedom or morality.
What laws apply to certain individuals and not others.

You people are delusional. We have become a culture of entitlement assholes off other peoples hard-work.
 
statler said:
Question for Rifleman,

What country do you feel gives you a better chance of a successful future than the US?

Explain in detail how and why that country offers it's citizens a better future than the US offers theirs.
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Statler, Its about LAWS.......And when laws only apply to middle class and poor thats when a society becomes lopsided.

Wake the fuck up.
People are stealing trillions of dollars from the working class.

So its okay that Fannie Executives steal millions of dollars in bonuses as they never filed with the SEC with their financials for 3-years. These people never go to jail.

But some guy robs a 7-eleven for $100 bucks and this guy goes to jail?

The United States needs to bring back justice
You defintely need govt to enforce the laws and keep people in-line, but they need to get out of most of the economic industries.
cut govt spending to the bone
Get rid of all these useless programs

Let the private enteprise mole the world with the Dreamers and risk takers.
Not a bunch of lazy political hacks that steal from the hard-working class.
 
Well, that was a stupid move on my part.

I thought, maybe, just possibly I could start an actual conversation.

Nope. Not even close.

Have fun shouting at the clouds.
 
^^^^

I still think the U.S is a great country because in the end the people rise to what is right. But sometimes it takes time.
 
I want to know as well. What country do you think best exemplifies how you think healthcare should work?

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Ethiopia where the weak and less fortunate simply die off.
 
People understand your message, even if it could be refined a bit, but what I at least have a hard time understanding is how you balance your beliefs. You seem to be:

1) pro capitalism / privatization because you think the private sector is more efficient

2) pro small government because you think large government interferes with our individual liberties

but,

3) you also express concern about systems that take advantage of the working and middle classes

My issue is how do you reconcile/balance those beliefs?

I think we can all acknowledge that there were incredible social ills resulting from the unrestrained capitalism of the industrial revolution including: child labor, no minimum/livable wage, large numbers of work related deaths, and the beginning of a rising income gap. In an effort to address these ills we, through the government, enacted laws (some better than others). These laws require enforcement/administration and oversight. This has inevitably "grown" the government (whether at state or federal level).

What is the appropriate balance to you? Do we not regulate? Do we hire the private sector to regulate? Can we trust it to do so (Arthur Anderson)? What are the alternatives?
 
datadyne007 said:
I want to know as well. What country do you think best exemplifies how you think healthcare should work?

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Ethiopia where the weak and less fortunate simply die off.
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I don't have the answers on how Healthcare should work in who or what country.

I think one of the major problems for Doctors is Multi-billion dollar Malpractice Lawsuit industry.
I think we need to find a resolution here and get the Insurances rates down. Everybody wants to sue everybody.

(I think in the end people need to take responsibility for selected that doctor in the first place?)

Thats my point. You personally made a relationship to have faith in a person to provide a service. I think in the end you made that decision.
 
I can't decide whether this thread is like a train wreck or actually is a train wreck.

And frankly, I think figuring out a pointless question like the above is a better use of my brainpower than actually trying to decipher this crap.
 
Hutchison said:
My issue is how do you reconcile/balance those beliefs?
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Anarchy.

I don't believe in immediate change overnight, but I do believe that society can move in that direction if we stand up to what is going on right now. I firmly believe that a majority of the countries in this world are straight up fascist regimes, including our own. We need to wake up and stop this insanity. Even this healthcare law is playing right into the hands of insurance companies. Sure, they may throw a bone here and there, but in the end, the CEOs are laughing all the way to the bank and society suffers a deadweight loss.

Now, you may believe socialism works, you may believe capitalism works... Both can work in harmony. Anarcho-syndicalism and anarcho-capitalism can work side by side in an anarchic society, in my opinion. (Note, I'm not suggesting anarchy would even be successful within a century, it will be slow. However, we can work towards a minarchy very swiftly.)




...

Okay. Any statement I was working towards making, I have now completely forgot. I have no idea what I was working towards, and now it just looks like incoherent babbling to me. Time for bed. Goodnight. And remember, folks, fascism is the devil!
 
whoaaa.... just clicked on this thread for the 1st time. I'm just gonna close the door and back out slowly.

But to jump in the fray a little b/c i don't want to be left out of the fun.

In answer to rifleman's questions about what good has come from certain gov't institutions (I mean tyrannical slavery mills)

IRS- Founded by Abraham Lincoln when he instituted the first income taxe to pay for the civil war and prevent rampant tax dodging (i.e. greece today)

TSA- really? waiting in airport lines sucks, I agree. But you send your kid on a plane in the post 9-11 world knowing no one has been searched.

SEC- you don't see the need for it following a global financial collapse? it was created in the great depression. I would submit that its been undermined by all the deregulation that people are setting up financial tools that end around the system and result in major bank failures (also the reason for the FDIC- so you dont have to run to Citizens and take your money out)

Healthcare- Rifle- I would be curious to see how you would solve the problem-- first, do you admit there is one? if so, much fewer employers offer healthcare and it is difficult and expensive for people to buy it on their own. Would you make affordable coverage available to these people? (FYI- in "obamacare" the gov't isn't offering a plan to these people, they are just allowed to be aggregated and offered insurance as a group from private insurers in an exchange) Would you have any provision to care for people that developed an illness, when lets say, they got laid off from their banking job because some guy in london made a bunch of bets that are failing (JP MORGAN)? --Tort reform is not an acceptable answer- because numerous studies and the CBO show it actually adds up to very little.
 
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datadyne007 said:
I want to know as well. What country do you think best exemplifies how you think healthcare should work?

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Ethiopia where the weak and less fortunate simply die off.
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It's better than the cradle to grave welfare states that perpetuate the species.

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Yea, probably a bit harsh. What I should have said is the cradle to grave welfare state that legitimizes society's shortcomings and bad decisions.
 
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choo said:
In answer to rifleman's questions about what good has come from certain gov't institutions (I mean tyrannical slavery mills)

IRS- Founded by Abraham Lincoln when he instituted the first income taxe to pay for the civil war and prevent rampant tax dodging (i.e. greece today)

TSA- really? waiting in airport lines sucks, I agree. But you send your kid on a plane in the post 9-11 world knowing no one has been searched.

SEC- you don't see the need for it following a global financial collapse? it was created in the great depression. I would submit that its been undermined by all the deregulation that people are setting up financial tools that end around the system and result in major bank failures (also the reason for the FDIC- so you dont have to run to Citizens and take your money out)

.
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I will answer a couple of these questions. There is so much that goes into this. Just some ideas.

#1 America's biggest problem is the Private corrupt Federal Reserve Bank.
#2 Lobbyists---Need to GO—No more…We elect the people to represent us they need to be held accountable on what decisions they make.

IRS---Need a complete overhaul, since we have so many immigrants in the system not paying their fair share of taxes. Tax 20 or 30% on everyday Goods & Services (everybody pays into the system for what they consume)
No more individual tax returns on Americans.
IRS agents would only be needed for the corporation’s (with a complete overhaul of the taxcode)
Non-profit CEO’s are capped at 200K salary year.

TSA---Do you really believe TSA agents that make 50-80K a year can stop a major Airport bombing by a group of professionals? I doubt it. I would leave it up to the Corporations to secure their own airlines.

The problem with the
SEC--FDA—EPA-
All the people in charge of these agencies are connected to the private sector corporate CEO's. You need to get rid these relationships at all costs.
Govt does have a role—solid regulations/laws upheld by the most honorable people.

For example: Monsanto: Somebody wants to know what happened to all the Honey Bees? When a group came out and said Monsanto was responsible for killing them. What does Monsanto do?

http://www.naturalnews.com/035688_Monsanto_honey_bees_colony_collapse.html

Are you sure EPA & FDA are looking out for our best interests?
Do you know how important Honey Bees are for our existence?

The entire Federal GOVT needs to be GUTTED....replaced by your average citizens. Not by a bunch of entitle bitches.
 
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