What to do about Government Center

To complete the hodgepodge, the design should add some Mayan ruins and a full scale reproduction of a Kamchatkan fishing village.

All this wasted thinking. Why not just repurpose this building for all citizen-facing activities, put the back office workers somewhere else, and build something contemporary and realistic on city hall plaza, maybe even repurpose city hall as the Greater Boston Intercollegiate Museum of Art... oops, thinking too hard here.
 
I think the simplest/best solution to solving the barren wasteland that is Government Center would be a required field trip by all the necessary powers/planners that be to the Piazza del in Siena. By surrounding and enclosing the current wasteland of a space with appropriately scaled, contextual buildings lined with ground level retail, the plaza would dramatically transformed and activated, finally creating a sense of place. unfortunately, such an obvious solution with such a fantastic existing template to follow has no chance with the current regime.

Campo http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piazza_del_Campo
 
I think the simplest / best solution to solve the barren wasteland that is Government Center is to assemble all the important and distinguished architects from private industry along with city planners and university scholars

and then drown them all and let normal people decide what should go there.
 
That is a pretty bad idea when you think about just how ridiculous some ideas can be. Did you ever see all the citizen proposals for the rebuilding of the WTC back in the day?
 
JohnAKeith said:
I think the simplest / best solution to solve the barren wasteland that is Government Center is to assemble all the important and distinguished architects from private industry along with city planners and university scholars

and then drown them all and let normal people decide what should go there.
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See: Greenway, Rose Kennedy, The
 
A cheaper solution would be to give a bunch of commentators on an architecture, planning, and development web-forum a few cases of alcohol, catered food, paper, and some markers for a legally binding evening design session.
 
Lurker said:
A cheaper solution would be to give a bunch of commentators on an architecture, planning, and development web-forum a few cases of alcohol, catered food, paper, and some markers for a legally binding evening design session.
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A coalition that would fall apart after spending three hours arguing over what pizza topping to order.
 
statler said:
A coalition that would fall apart after spending three hours arguing over what pizza topping to order.
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Ha! We'd just need to have to ask Beton what the best bets are from Santarpio's.
 
they should do what they exactly intended to do with the space, except with much nicer architecture... the space was modeled after a space in italy that i have been to-- the Piazza del Campo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piazza_del_Campo) which is enclosed by beautiful buildings. you could only get into the space through random arches that some of these buildings had. and in the center there was a wonderful fountain.

imagine if all around in city hall plaza there were a dozen restaurants and shops-- no cambridge street-- and the northeast arch led to faneiul hall.

Il_campo_view_from_torre.jpg
 
Enough magical thinking. Look how empty the Siena piazza is inside. Everyone still sticks to the edge. And that's the ideal.

Nicer architecture is not going to solve a serious urban design flaw. It's not going to make the plaza more intimate. It's not going to make Boston's climate comparable to Siena's. Surrounding the plaza with activated edges just isn't going to happen when there are government buildings with inane security requirements on at least two sides of the thing. It's not going to draw people when Faneuil Hall is right there, and when the Greenway and Common, not to mention the waterfront, are only blocks away. There is such a thing as too much public space, and Boston has this problem. So why bother trying to make this one work when it could just be eliminated or forgotten about entirely?
 
czsz said:
Enough magical thinking. Look how empty the Siena piazza is inside. Everyone still sticks to the edge. And that's the ideal.

Nicer architecture is not going to solve a serious urban design flaw. It's not going to make the plaza more intimate. It's not going to make Boston's climate comparable to Siena's. Surrounding the plaza with activated edges just isn't going to happen when there are government buildings with inane security requirements on at least two sides of the thing. It's not going to draw people when Faneuil Hall is right there, and when the Greenway and Common, not to mention the waterfront, are only blocks away. There is such a thing as too much public space, and Boston has this problem. So why bother trying to make this one work when it could just be eliminated or forgotten about entirely?
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can't say i agree with you my friend-- on multiple fronts. oppressive architecture in that area has a lot to do why that space is poorly utilized. in fact from a traditional urban planning standpoint i think boston is extremely poorly laid out-- but thats what we love about it right? strange spaces made beautiful with exceptional architecture.... those are the places ppl want to be. i dont know a single space in the world that is well liked and functions well, but has terrible architecture. but i know a million places that are extremely well liked because they have exceptional architecture but function extremely poorly from an urban planning standpoint.

the siena plaza like trafalgar square and other open spaces like it have been famed for the activities on the edges of these plazas but also because they are excellent for rallies, demonstrations, fairs etc. just because you dont see it in that picture, the plaza hosts hundreds of activities everyday. i do think though that the city hall space is a little too expansive and could do with a large fountain or something in the middle.

i would envision the plaza more of an extension of fanieul hall and vice versa. people who want to hang out at one would hang out at the other. i dont really believe these places dont compete with each other... they kind of feed off each other. and in that vein an improved city hall plaza would be more directly adjacent to the common and downtown crossing so as to allow people from either one to be more connected with the city hall/faneiul hall/ waterfront area.
 
eljusticiero67 said:
can't say i agree with you my friend-- on multiple fronts. oppressive architecture in that area has a lot to do why that space is poorly utilized. in fact from a traditional urban planning standpoint i think boston is extremely poorly laid out-- but thats what we love about it right? strange spaces made beautiful with exceptional architecture.... those are the places ppl want to be. i dont know a single space in the world that is well liked and functions well, but has terrible architecture. but i know a million places that are extremely well liked because they have exceptional architecture but function extremely poorly from an urban planning standpoint.

the siena plaza like trafalgar square and other open spaces like it have been famed for the activities on the edges of these plazas but also because they are excellent for rallies, demonstrations, fairs etc. just because you dont see it in that picture, the plaza hosts hundreds of activities everyday. i do think though that the city hall space is a little too expansive and could do with a large fountain or something in the middle.

i would envision the plaza more of an extension of fanieul hall and vice versa. people who want to hang out at one would hang out at the other. i dont really believe these places dont compete with each other... they kind of feed off each other. and in that vein an improved city hall plaza would be more directly adjacent to the common and downtown crossing so as to allow people from either one to be more connected with the city hall/faneiul hall/ waterfront area.
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excuse me, i meant: i dont really believe these places compete with each other... (remove one of the "don't"s)
 
I've worked at City Hall Plaza numerous times and I've had occasion to experience its daily "events" fairly often. Even on the nicest days, and given some of the most compelling causes, maybe like a quarter or a sixth of the space will be taken up with people; the rest given over to its usual windswept or sunbaked emptiness. I vividly remember walking through on Colombian independence day or something and seeing the celebrants crouched in the shadows of City Hall itself because the rest of the plaza was too hot and, well, they didn't need all that space anyway.

The thing is, there was nothing wrong with the city planning - or lack thereof - of this area before City Hall Plaza was built. Scollay Square was an extremely lively place and a natural traffic junction. City Hall Plaza slaughtered that, and the best we can do to justify it is to say that it offers a platform for the occasional protest / celebration / ice cream tasting extravaganza or whatever (and vastly exceeds the needs and requirements of these anyway).

Major events don't even make use of the plaza when they can get a bigger, better, more central venue - like the Common.

BTW, Trafalgar Square works not just because of its pretty backdrop and the doodads in the middle - the fountain and sculptures. It also works because it's a natural center. Various important roads and vistas converge there; there's a major rail station adjacent, etc.
 
czsz said:
Enough magical thinking. Look how empty the Siena piazza is inside. Everyone still sticks to the edge. And that's the ideal.

Nicer architecture is not going to solve a serious urban design flaw. It's not going to make the plaza more intimate. It's not going to make Boston's climate comparable to Siena's. Surrounding the plaza with activated edges just isn't going to happen when there are government buildings with inane security requirements on at least two sides of the thing. It's not going to draw people when Faneuil Hall is right there, and when the Greenway and Common, not to mention the waterfront, are only blocks away. There is such a thing as too much public space, and Boston has this problem. So why bother trying to make this one work when it could just be eliminated or forgotten about entirely?
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siena-piazza-21.jpg


While people often stick to the periphery of the Siena piazza, the scene is so perfectly serene and fluid, that in itself necessitates the need for the expanse. Notice how people congregate on the slopes of the piazza, soaking it all in like a beach front. Urbane...
 
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...and looks like there's shit to do there.
 
czsz said:
Enough magical thinking. Look how empty the Siena piazza is inside. Everyone still sticks to the edge. And that's the ideal.

Nicer architecture is not going to solve a serious urban design flaw. It's not going to make the plaza more intimate. It's not going to make Boston's climate comparable to Siena's. Surrounding the plaza with activated edges just isn't going to happen when there are government buildings with inane security requirements on at least two sides of the thing. It's not going to draw people when Faneuil Hall is right there, and when the Greenway and Common, not to mention the waterfront, are only blocks away. There is such a thing as too much public space, and Boston has this problem. So why bother trying to make this one work when it could just be eliminated or forgotten about entirely?
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OK, you want more people, is this enough?!



PHO-09Aug17-174563.jpg


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palio_di_Siena

Seriously though, there are always plenty of people/activity going on at the Campo and if you were there you would never think or feel that there is so much empty/wasted space. Even if you were the only person in the whole plaza standing in the middle (not a very likely scenario by any means) I promise that you that looking around, being surrounded by the beautiful, almost magical architecture and piazza scape, you would have a feeling and satisfaction that couldn't be more different than being in that same predicament in Government Center. Like I said before, you simply need to see it in person to even come close to fully appreciating.
 
^^^IAM thinkin I see. thIS peeple and horsepictura befores. WITH MURRAY Roth and der HOREsHEAD in BED. With the MOST MESSY silky shets. AND. All because he NOT hire Frankie Sinastra.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HintH3dxBo

WEARE even alredy having the MOST USEFUL balcon at C. Ity Hall
 
czsz said:
I've worked at City Hall Plaza numerous times and I've had occasion to experience its daily "events" fairly often. Even on the nicest days, and given some of the most compelling causes, maybe like a quarter or a sixth of the space will be taken up with people; the rest given over to its usual windswept or sunbaked emptiness. I vividly remember walking through on Colombian independence day or something and seeing the celebrants crouched in the shadows of City Hall itself because the rest of the plaza was too hot and, well, they didn't need all that space anyway.

The thing is, there was nothing wrong with the city planning - or lack thereof - of this area before City Hall Plaza was built. Scollay Square was an extremely lively place and a natural traffic junction. City Hall Plaza slaughtered that, and the best we can do to justify it is to say that it offers a platform for the occasional protest / celebration / ice cream tasting extravaganza or whatever (and vastly exceeds the needs and requirements of these anyway).
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I don't think there is any point in crying about what Scollay square used to be, when trying to think about what its bastard incarnation should become. yes scollay square looked awesome and should have remained, but we have to deal with what we have and it could be anything. i personally like the idea of having a mediterranean style plaza. but it kinda needs to go the rest of the way... and get rid of the oppressive arcitecture.

if we want to talk about restoring an area to a pre-urban renewal greatness... lets start with the west end... bring back the original federal reserve building and also roll back before 93 r*ped the north end and left its useless greenway for us to barely remark at as we go from faneiul hall to the n' end.
 
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