Winthrop Center | 115 Winthrop Square | Financial District

bakgwailo said:
Also the air rights parcel 12 that just broke ground over the Pike is office...
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With a tenant and pre-COVID financing in place. Stoweker's point is you won't see office projects that don't have financing/tenants come out of the ground for a while, which is what we're seeing here at Winthrop Square. Their self-imposed financing deadline is quickly approaching, and there's no indication they'll reach it unless construction starts soon.
 
stefal said:
With a tenant and pre-COVID financing in place. Stoweker's point is you won't see office projects that don't have financing/tenants come out of the ground for a while, which is what we're seeing here at Winthrop Square. Their self-imposed financing deadline is quickly approaching, and there's no indication they'll reach it unless construction starts soon.
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His point seems to be that we won't see central business district office towers ever again. It stands to reason any project that loses financing because its being built on spec won't go up until the Covid threat passes but my take from stoweker is that there's a more permanent and severe shift going on to low cost places where just about everyone can work remotely. I think that's more of the source of the pushback.
 
Rover said:
His point seems to be that we won't see central business district office towers ever again. It stands to reason any project that loses financing because its being built on spec won't go up until the Covid threat passes but my take from stoweker is that there's a more permanent and severe shift going on to low cost places where just about everyone can work remotely. I think that's more of the source of the pushback.
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Nicely said. Allow me to buttress the subjective pushback with some objective CBD vacancy stats. I did some Googling; turns out Colliers has available for free download basically every single Boston office market research report its done since 2011... so:

For "Financial District" Boston, 33.5 million commercial sf, Colliers report the following vacancy numbers (class A, B, sublets included), for the 1st quarter of each year:

2011: 20.2%
2012: 19.2%
2013: 14.3%
2014: 15.1%
2015: 12.2%
2016: 9.2%
2017: 11.6%
2018: 11.9%
2019: 10.9%
2020: 9.1%

Now, vacancy in Financial District did rise from 9.1% to 11.6% per Colliers, from end of March--end of July.

But vacancies will still have rise by another 74% to match the ghastly figure at the start of 2011... of course it can happen. But at this point, I'm adopting a wait-and-see attitude...
 
Do they really not have guaranteed financing lined up for this? Is that typical for towers like this 2+ years into construction? When does the rest of the financing close, when the tower is 20 floors built? Does the $ come in tranches as the project progresses with no guarantees it is advanced? So many questions! Seems rather odd to get this far along without closing on all the project financing.
 
I remember after 9-11, they predicted there would NEVER be another tall building built in America. However, that proved very false. It almost went the complete opposite. So it may take time to recover, but I think dense CBD locations will be fine in the long term. People need and also enjoy other human contacts. Maybe companies won't lease as much space as pre-COVID, but I think places like downtown Boston, Kendall Square, Longwood, etc. will be very desirable vs. suburban locations. Maybe they will become less office-only and more live-work-play areas? I think that might be a good thing for the downtown Boston financial district.
 
Java King said:
I remember after 9-11, they predicted there would NEVER be another tall building built in America. However, that proved very false. It almost went the complete opposite.....
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Good comment. NYC now has 5 buildings taller than the old WTC towers either completed or T/O (although 1 needed a spire, but still 4 to the roof), and at least 2-3 more are currently on the way. Many US cities have also built new tallest's since then, including SF, LA, OKC, Austin, Cincinnati, Miami, and Philadelphia, plus a few others. Memories only last so long. By the time we are 2 years removed from the pandemic, cities will be thriving again, with little residual evidence of the current conditions.
 
stoweker said:
i mean in fariness actual CBD vacancy right now is probably like 75% when you account for the number of firms actually using the space. would love to know vacancy today with sublet availability / actual corporate shadow vacancy. it's also not all that crazy to thin that you could see 3mm sf of negative absorption in the near term if (1) you start to see some corporate BK (2) CFOs who haven't signed leases for renewals are taking a wait and see right now and end up giving back space. keep in mind most office leases are like 5-7 years so any given year ~15% of the occupied market is up for churn anyways.
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Good clarifications--and you might even be a little conservative, "true" occupancy these days is around 10%, I've heard, so flesh-and-blood vacancy (distinct from what's on paper, landlord cashflow derived from leases) is at 90% or so right now apparently...
 
Some activity on site today but hard to tell whats going on. Small excavation going on alongside the TransNational building and saw some guys walking out from under the foundation first floor.
 
I searched for news from the past week, and the one thing I found is that Divco West (same group doing the North Point stuff) just purchased 1 Winthrop Square. So yeah, not only do I not have good news, but we might be in the fight of our lives to preserve another historic building downtown. Divco West is among the most unimaginate, pathetic developers I have seen anywhere. I still can't believe they're happy building a shorter Seaport-like neighborhood in an area with a 1000' FAA limit and a highway next door.


1598034393055.png
 
I thought a Hong Kong based company just bought this in March ? Life science focused.
 
DZH22 said:
I searched for news from the past week, and the one thing I found is that Divco West (same group doing the North Point stuff) just purchased 1 Winthrop Square. So yeah, not only do I not have good news, but we might be in the fight of our lives to preserve another historic building downtown. Divco West is among the most unimaginate, pathetic developers I have seen anywhere. I still can't believe they're happy building a shorter Seaport-like neighborhood in an area with a 1000' FAA limit and a highway next door.


View attachment 6805
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DivcoWest has owned One Winthrop Square since the end of 2013. The building is listed with the Massachusetts Historical Commission and is safe. Nothing to worry about.

EDIT: per 617's post it looks like yes, there were reports that it was sold earlier this year to a Hong Kong-based company.
 
1 Winthrop Sq. has gone through a succession of owners in relatively quick time (without necessarily being caught up in "speculative froth"? Not sure how to objectively measure that):

--GLL sold it to DivcoWest in 2013 for $36 million ($351 psf)
--DivcoWest sold it to MAPFRE (yes, the car insurance dudes, go figure) in 2015 for $55 million ($536 psf)
--MAPFRE sold it to the aforementioned Nan Fung Life Sciences days before COVID hit here, for $75 million ($731 psf):

https://bostonrealestatetimes.com/n...uires-one-winthrop-square-in-downtown-boston/

P.S. Not to lecture (but of course it is lecturing): If you're unsure of a property's owner (ahem, asserting someone owns a property they sold 5 years ago), it's always wise to go on Suffolk Registry of Deeds to check out the actual flow of transactions. The site is very user-friendly, I think...
 
I see what happened, although don't totally get it. I serached for "winthrop square boston" and set the time to just THE PAST WEEK. Saw this article, but didn't click it, which would have told me this was actually from 2014. No idea why it comes up on a search for THE PAST WEEK when it's from 6 bleeping years ago!
crenews.com

DivcoWest Pays $36Mln for Boston Office Building - Commercial Real Estate Direct

Commercial Real Estate Direct Staff Report DivcoWest has paid $36 million, or roughly $315/sf, for One Winthrop Square, a 114,257-square-foot office building in Boston's Financial District. The San Francisco investment manager purchased the property from GLL Real Estate Partners in a deal...
crenews.com crenews.com



DivcoWest Pays $36Mln for Boston Office Building ...
crenews.com › divcowest-pays-36mln-for-boston-offic...

IT SAYS IT WAS POSTED 9 HOURS AGO!!!
9 hours ago - Commercial Real Estate Direct Staff Report DivcoWest has paid $36 million, or roughly $315/sf, for One Winthrop Square, a 114,257-square-foot office building ...
You visited this page on 8/21/20.

7th item down on this search
 
stoweker said:
not sure what y'all are on about, this is live from RCA as of 30 seconds ago

also not to continue to harp on the death of the CBD but green street advisor's had a great piece for Wednesday's nights article saying that essentially downtowns are dead coming out of COVID due to suburban flight for companies, downsizing of office footprints, and potential for spiking crime rates in cities as a result of reduced tax base....
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First piece was a mistake related to the google search timing being... unintelligent.

Second piece - When they mention "downtowns" they are talking about all cities in the US. Boston is in better shape than 99% of cities out there. It's safer, more desirable, and has had a long sustained revitalization. I'm sure places like Baltimore, Detroit, St. Louis, etc will suffer greatly, but we are basically the great American city at this point. If Boston fails, 100% of US cities are going to fail because we are as fail-proof as they come.
 
also to add in the last 6 months there have been 9 residential properties sold in the city of Boston for more than $5mm against inventory of 56 -there’s a 3 year + supply on the MLS, and that figure excludes all of the st Regis / echelon / Sudbury / Raffles condos (did I miss anything...?). Crazy demand imbalance while high End homes are flying in the wealthy suburbs. Woof.
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The last 6 months aside, the supply of luxury condo's in Boston has been 1-2 months tops. No doubt there's a flight to the 'burbs and open space right now, that will correct itself.
 
If Condo prices were able to drop to more affordable price points I'm sure there would be plenty of demand for condo living in the city.
 
From the Raffles thread:

Vivanna said:
BPDA already approved the reduction in residential here, Millennium must be trying to line up financing now, hope they get it done!
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We're in the final 1-2 week stretch to see where financing stands, from the self-prescribed (?) deadline by Joe Larkin:

jdrinboston said:
BPDA unanimously approves the project change. I will say - listening to the stream - Joe Larkin didn't give me the "warm and fuzzies" about the prospect of this iteration going forward. A lot of use of the term "cautiously optimistic." Hoping to close on funding in the next 60 days with a mid-September restart. (Site was also confirmed to be shut down).

I would have felt better if MP indicated they had a committment to finance provided this change was approved.
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60 days brings us roughly to ~September ~13-15. If they secured some financing, work should begin in two weeks or so. (keep your eyes open, fingers crossed)
 
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