General Thoughts/State of Southeast Expressway

Signage in the Boston area sucks

So do people who don't know where they're going!

You'd be surprised how many brain-dead tourists, after consulting a map, hop onto 93 South to try to find Quincy Market! (If Quincy does does have a market, it isn't what they're looking for.) Happened to my wife's family when she was a kid!
 
So do people who don't know where they're going!

You'd be surprised how many brain-dead tourists, after consulting a map, hop onto 93 South to try to find Quincy Market! (If Quincy does does have a market, it isn't what they're looking for.) Happened to my wife's family when she was a kid!

Better off going to South Shore Plaza anyway. Better shopping and food you dont have to take out a second mortgage to pay for. Ending up on 93S would be a happy accident.
 
I like the providence exit. Its like a magic road into the mall.
 
I like the providence exit. Its like a magic road into the mall.

I was stuck in a traffic jam on it for over 2 hours. It's just weird because it goes so freaking far away from the mall only to loop back. It does dump you right at the garage though, which is nice. At least exit 20 on 93 has you heading in the right direction, albeit in your own private viaduct.
 
Yes. And it is still a tangled mess with sharp curves, utterly pathetic construction quality, and poor signage. Sure it is better than what was there before. Does that make it good? Not in the slightest.

Traffic flow in the downtown area is substantially better, they built it out as much as possible without expanding the footprint of the highways. However, the substandard interchange at 128/93 in Reading, the poorly designed tolls in Allston and 128, and the SE expressway in general just resulted in those problems being exported outside of the city.

My fav part of the Big Dig is Exit 20 North Sta/Storrow Drive. The exits are legit their own freaking highways and bypass the Zakim for some reason.

It reminds me of Exit 22C - Providence Place on 95 in RI, which is perhaps one of the most ridiculous exits in the country.

There's a tremendous amount of traffic that takes that exit and if the area weren't so space constrained, it would justify a full two lanes for the entire length.
 
You were stuck for two hours on an exit ramp in Providence? How did that happen? (Accident that blocked the ramp?)
 
In Massachusetts you'll never see an elevated center carpool lane. Too many NIMBY's and shortsighted, corrupt politicians.

I must give kudos to Connecticut in terms of how many special (dedicated) on/off ramps they built just for their centre HOV lanes. You don't even have to leave their HOV lanes in most cases to exit the highway. In some cases, their HOV lanes have a separate off-ramp at a major interchange that can deposit you directly into the far left-hand HOV lane of the next highway you're getting on to. Kinda nice not having to re-join the traffic filled lanes just to change highways.

The dreamer part of me wonders if S.E. expressway would be better embarked upon as part of the below-ground Ted Williams and O'Neil Tunnels extension.
Since the Boston Harbor has been cleaned up, the land above might make for a nice location of some less congested ocean-front boulevard areas. I'm envisioning down to say Neoponset / Gallivan Blvd. underground. The nice part, is there's no sky scrapers around to make it as complex as the Big Dig nor likely the same amount of utilities to untangle. Some portions of this stretch are actually elevated as well. (Anyone who has ever been to the JFK station may have noticed that the expressway is elevated high above at that location. Residents in the area would also benefit from less noise of the traffic. I wonder if elevated portions could use a cheaper cut and cover method? Not sure if soil conditions (marshy) would allow for all this either. I envision Condos with kind of a hanging-gardens style theme along this tree lined street.
 
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I've seen a couple proposals using the Harbor Islands. There was one back in the 80s as an alternative to the Big Dig and another one more recently which incorporated a sea dam.

The problem with that is that most traffic is going INTO Boston, not around or through it.
 
I must give kudos to Connecticut in terms of how many special (dedicated) on/off ramps they built just for their centre HOV lanes. You don't even have to leave their HOV lanes in most cases to exit the highway. In some cases, their HOV lanes have a separate off-ramp at a major interchange that can deposit you directly into the far left-hand HOV lane of the next highway you're getting on to. Kinda nice not having to re-join the traffic filled lanes just to change highways.

The dreamer part of me wonders if S.E. expressway would be better embarked upon as part of the below-ground Ted Williams and O'Neil Tunnels extension.
Since the Boston Harbor has been cleaned up, the land above might make for a nice location of some less congested ocean-front boulevard areas. I'm envisioning down to say Neoponset / Gallivan Blvd. underground. The nice part, is there's no sky scrapers around to make it as complex as the Big Dig nor likely the same amount of utilities to untangle. Some portions of this stretch are actually elevated as well. (Anyone who has ever been to the JFK station may have noticed that the expressway is elevated high above at that location. Residents in the area would also benefit from less noise of the traffic. I wonder if elevated portions could use a cheaper cut and cover method? Not sure if soil conditions (marshy) would allow for all this either. I envision Condos with kind of a hanging-gardens style theme along this tree lined street.

Look at the JFK in Chicago. You have dedicated exits for the HOV lane.

CT has a terrible highway system, too many left on/off exits.
 
CT has a terrible highway system, too many left on/off exits.

Preach it! Try growing up in that state and commuting to a department store job on I-84 in Farmington 4 months after getting your license. If there's any saving grace in that childhood trauma, switching lanes there was excellent training for becoming an over-aggressive Masshole driver as an adult.

The 84/91 HOV lanes east and north of Hartford are excellent design. They just for 20 years have never ever been able to convince people to use them. They need to find a wholly different selling point for them and recast it totally because they fall victim to low motivation. I wouldn't change a thing about the design because they work very well, but it needs a compelling 'hook'.
 
Look at the JFK in Chicago. You have dedicated exits for the HOV lane.

IIRC the express lanes have several exit/entry point to/from the mainline, but no direct access to local roads. They are also open to all traffic, not just HOVs. Still a great design, especially when the express lanes are open in the direction you are traveling!

I could see this set up working well on I-93. Keep the current 8 lanes but build (and in some places elevate) two reversible express lanes to help with rush hour traffic. The right of way exists along most of the stretch, just a few places where things would be tight and some slight land taking would need to occur.

I-93 isn't going anywhere so we might as well make it safer with full-width shoulders and some additional express capacity, right?
 
The 84/91 HOV lanes east and north of Hartford are excellent design. They just for 20 years have never ever been able to convince people to use them. They need to find a wholly different selling point for them and recast it totally because they fall victim to low motivation. I wouldn't change a thing about the design because they work very well, but it needs a compelling 'hook'.

I take this HOV lane every time I drive into Hartford. The only issues I have are when I get stuck behind a Greyhound/Megabus/Lucky Star bus, going slower than the other traffic. The other issue I have is that when traffic is slow/stopped in the regular lanes, people don't think twice about flying over the buffer pavement into the HOV lane, completely ruining the benefit to people using it correctly.
 
I take this HOV lane every time I drive into Hartford. The only issues I have are when I get stuck behind a Greyhound/Megabus/Lucky Star bus, going slower than the other traffic. The other issue I have is that when traffic is slow/stopped in the regular lanes, people don't think twice about flying over the buffer pavement into the HOV lane, completely ruining the benefit to people using it correctly.

Rumble strip or a few of those collapsible stand-up reflectors in the median deters the illegal activity well enough. And I think for backups 1 or two lane-change opportunities en route would probably be appropriate. But bending too much for people exceeding the speed limit isn't too wise an idea. Rush hour is when it works best, so doing constant 55 in the HOV is a whole lot better than 35 stop-and-go if more people could wrap brain about that being an option.

I agree, though, about BRT. CTTransit has 2 express bus routes each on the 91 and 84 HOV's, but the headways are pretty pathetic and don't put a dent in the need. They've pretty much blown 20 years of opportunity to take advantage of it meaningfully. Now the 91 express routes are only a few years away from becoming pretty useless when full commuter rail goes online in 2016 with 1-per-town station stops everywhere north and south. Where HOV's would've made the biggest difference are Farmington-Hartford between Route 9 and the bus station exit, but they nixed that entire idea in 'favor' of quite possibly the worst single transportation project in the nation--the billion-dollar Hartford-New Britain Busway--instead. Which is seeing the projected traffic Level of Service on every intersecting road of the route decrease with every ham-fisted design revision. To point where it's not far off from making everything WORSE than before on the corridor because of how many roads it's screwing up and how much the headways and ridership keep getting revised down.

But I'm not sure HOV's inherently are a solution. Because in Hartford's case, both the 91 and 84 ones are ripe for commuter rail cannibalization. They're still considering a future Hartford-Waterbury route, albeit with longer detour because of the stupid busway and probably 15-year delay because of the busway $$$ drain. And Hartford-east out to about where the HOV lanes start on the Vernon/Manchester line has a truncated former intercity line next to it that would make for a fast 4-stop train trip, especially if they did DMU's or something. There much need for HOV buses if they cover both the E/W and N/S crosshairs with fixed transit on their equivalent of the 128 region? After all, the highways were built next to the old intercity routes for a reason.

Lesson, as always, is that good movement inside the metro area is only possible with multimodal planning. Hartford's its miniature example. We're the one where rapid-transit on twice as many spokes is required. We've known this since 1945. Not like dragging feet for two-thirds a century and hoping for a different result has miraculously made the problem go away. There's only so much you can do to asphalt when it's 100% maxed out and has no margin for error.

They know this. They always have. It's not sway of the car lobby, it's denial that a magic bullet isn't a magic bullet.
 
I haven't read what you're talking about but let me say, I don't think electric cars should get to go in the HOV lanes. They do in some cities, right?

The main goal of having HOV lanes is to speed traffic and reduce congestion, by requiring drivers to double up.

Yes, the HOV lanes help reduce emissions, but I've never seen that as the primary reason.

They're still cars. Let them sit and wait like everyone else. Sorry, Ed Begley, Jr.
 
The SE Expressway at rush hour, with contraflow zipper lanes wide open:

RitaHoustonEvacuation.jpg
 
The section from Mass Ave to Braintree was originally built as 3 lanes plus a breakdown lane. It was converted to 4 lanes with no breakdown lane. I agree, it should be widened to 4 lanes plus a breakdown lane. The carpool lane could be one of the four lanes, or an additional center "zip" lane.

The problem is, for several hours of the day you are not only legally allowed to drive full speed in the breakdown lane, this is considered acceptable and even encouraged behavior.

At least, it was on 128 the one time I tried to take the train in from Woodland instead of Quincy Adams.
 
The problem is, for several hours of the day you are not only legally allowed to drive full speed in the breakdown lane, this is considered acceptable and even encouraged behavior.

At least, it was on 128 the one time I tried to take the train in from Woodland instead of Quincy Adams.

That practice mercifully ends in Dedham this Summer when the 4th lane opens between Route 109 and Route 24. They finished all but a couple hundred feet of roadbed grading before ground freeze and just have touch-up work to do in Spring. That ends breakdown lane travel on a little over half the road, with Needham taking another 2-1/2 years because of all the bridge work.

Feds have banned that practice now so we'll never see a new instance of breakdown lane travel. Existing ones are still grandfathered, though. MA also does it on Route 3 on the 4-lane stretch from 3A in Duxbury to 18 in Weymouth. Widening and induced demand considerations be damned they're going to be confronted with a tough decision on how to get rid of it because grandfathering may not last forever if it's got any impact on availability of fed highway funding for roads. 3 isn't an interstate, but they were definitely under some pressure to put the kibosh on that under the 95 shield.



I think that only applies to expressways, though. Norwood asked Westwood last year to cooperate with them on a plan to open up Route 1 breakdown travel, apparently seeing no issue whatsoever with curb cuts + 50 MPH traffic barrelling through all those turnouts. Westwood voted it down.

Egad.
 
That practice mercifully ends in Dedham this Summer when the 4th lane opens between Route 109 and Route 24. They finished all but a couple hundred feet of roadbed grading before ground freeze and just have touch-up work to do in Spring. That ends breakdown lane travel on a little over half the road, with Needham taking another 2-1/2 years because of all the bridge work.

Feds have banned that practice now so we'll never see a new instance of breakdown lane travel. Existing ones are still grandfathered, though. MA also does it on Route 3 on the 4-lane stretch from 3A in Duxbury to 18 in Weymouth. Widening and induced demand considerations be damned they're going to be confronted with a tough decision on how to get rid of it because grandfathering may not last forever if it's got any impact on availability of fed highway funding for roads. 3 isn't an interstate, but they were definitely under some pressure to put the kibosh on that under the 95 shield.



I think that only applies to expressways, though. Norwood asked Westwood last year to cooperate with them on a plan to open up Route 1 breakdown travel, apparently seeing no issue whatsoever with curb cuts + 50 MPH traffic barrelling through all those turnouts. Westwood voted it down.

Egad.

Do you know how they are going to handle the 24 interchange? Coming on 93 north, you would go from 4 down to 3 for a short stretch, then back up to 4 again with north merging onto 93 north. There is an overpass bridge that is only wide to handle 3 lanes during this short stretch.
 
Do you know how they are going to handle the 24 interchange? Coming on 93 north, you would go from 4 down to 3 for a short stretch, then back up to 4 again with north merging onto 93 north. There is an overpass bridge that is only wide to handle 3 lanes during this short stretch.

Widening project stops on 93N at the 24 split, starts on 93S at the 24 merge. Southbound they're going to be doing work on the 138 interchange to corral the wild weaving from entering 24 traffic to exiting 138 traffic by blocking it from 24N/93S into a combined collector/distributor with the lightly used Ponkapoag exit, because that's a total roadkill zone with the weaving. Means you'll no longer be able to get from 24N to 138 for time being. On the other side they'll eventually be lengthening out the 28-to-93S merge so nobody does a death-defying cut from 28 onto 24. 93N/24S and 24N/93S remain the same. New 4th lane ends here in orderly fashion at the 24 exit. TBD whether any tweaking needs to be done with the quick merge and quick 28 exit.

At some point years after that, and well behind fixing Braintree split, they're considering a project to bridge the two left ramps over 93S so there's a normal right-handed exit here restoring access to Ponkapoag/138 and 28. But that's way down the line. Lower-impact Alternative B is keeping the lefts as is but grafting on a 24N exit-only/24S entrance-only at Canton St. so 138 and 28 have nearby replacement access to/from 24 offsetting the weaving prohibition on 93S.


Exit re-spacing on the 93 stretch makes a bigger difference than the number of lanes. Brutal stretch of 5 exits in close succession with a lefty expressway interchange smack in the middle. And then rinse/repeat the same exact thing at Braintree split with 37/split/Furnace Brook on the 93 side and split/Burgin/Washington on the 3 side. All of those ramps are going to get elongation and consolidation to back the lane changes further away from the split. That's the thrust of the Braintree Split project. The actual split isn't going to change much because it physically can't, but the exit respacing is what'll save it.
 

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