[ARCHIVED] Harbor Garage Redevelopment | 70 East India Row | Waterfront | Downtown

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Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

This will never get built as sketched. Chiofaro ain't got the money, and value-engineering is going to chop the rectangle. Don also spends about six minutes describing the project in a video on the Globe URL below.

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Deconstructing Boston's skyline
Chiofaro's proposal is already sparking debate over design
By Casey Ross, Globe Staff | February 3, 2009

Donald Chiofaro wants to shake up the Boston skyline again.

The brash developer of International Place is proposing to erect near the New England Aquarium a pair of glass skyscrapers connected by a terra-cotta colored rectangle that itself would be taller than the two buildings.

The unusual design, evocative of the bold skyscrapers cropping up in Asia, is sure to set off a debate about Boston's conservative tastes in architecture as well as the kind of development that should accompany the Rose Fitzgerald Kennedy Greenway.

Chiofaro's proposed towers - one for condominiums and a hotel, the other for offices - would be among the tallest in the city, rivaling the Prudential Building and the John Hancock Tower in the Back Bay. The buildings would be constructed on property now occupied by the Harbor Garage along Atlantic Avenue.

"The project, when viewed from the water back toward the city, really is the gateway. It's the centerpiece of the harbor view," Chiofaro said. "The idea of the arch is to accent the opening to the city. It's not just two towers, it's actually three architectural elements."

If built according to preliminary designs by Kohn Pedersen Fox Associates, Chiofaro's development would create a new aesthetic in a city that has been resistant to unconventional design.

But is Chiofaro's vision over the top? The Globe, which obtained a copy of the design in advance, got several architects and urban planners to weigh in.

"It's certainly more modern than anything else you see here, and in that sense it's an important statement for Boston," said Abby Flam, a planner at Steffian Bradley Architects.

But like others, she was ambivalent about the proposal, adding, "I'm not sure it's quite right for this location, so it might be a little problematic for the city."

Architect Alex Krieger said Boston is beginning to welcome more expressive architecture after years of insistence that buildings incorporate traditional New England styling.

"In the 1970s, '80s, and '90s, there was a local sentiment that Boston must maintain its uniqueness," said Krieger, principal at Chan Krieger Sieniewicz, a Cambridge architecture and urban design firm. "The party line was that you had to make it brick, but I think we're over that period."

Chiofaro's buildings, which could be from 50 to 70 stories, will prompt significant talk on how the city should develop parcels along the Greenway parks. Build too many towers that cast shadows and that makes the area less friendly to pedestrians.

Boston's chief planner, Kairos Shen, said Chiofaro's proposal must wait until the city has a chance to set height and density guidelines for that area. Current guidelines limit development to about 15 stories.

"This would really be unprecedented height along the Greenway in a critical location," Shen said. "What we have to study is what would be the public realm impact."

The city expects to complete a study of the Greenway parcels within six months. Chiofaro has notified the city of his intent to build on the Harbor Garage site, which he purchased for about $155 million in 2007. A formal review could take 18 to 24 months.

Chiofaro said that while he respects the city's process, he believes the development will encourage more foot traffic by opening a new connection from the Greenway to the waterfront.

"Right now there is a giant cement block that is the Harbor Garage blocking the way," he said. "The architecture team spent a lot of time thinking about ways to make the pathways inviting for pedestrians."

Ground-floor space between the buildings would allow for several stores, restaurants, and an upscale grocery. His commercial tower, the shorter of the two, would include about 860,000 square feet of office space. The more slender building would include about 120 condominiums above a hotel.

The parking now available in the Harbor Garage would be moved underground.

Jim Batchelor, president of the Boston Society of Architects, said Chiofaro is right to push for a bold, new design, which he said combines elements of massive skyscrapers in cities like Shanghai with the more boxy geometry of Boston.

"He may get some push back, but that's the nature of debate, which is a good thing to have," he said.
http://www.boston.com/business/articles/2009/02/03/deconstructing_bostons_skyline/
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Wow, me like. But I'd be very surprised if we get anything taller than the Harbor Towers there.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Looks like Mr. Chiofaro has been reading along, and agrees that you need to propose something that is 15-25% taller than what you intend to build and have the city review process pare it down to what you really want.

Small rendering, but it appears to be miles ahead of International Place and light years ahead of the Harbor Towers.

Could be slim enough to work along the green way.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

I also like this design from that angle...I'd like to see it from others though and also of course from the ground level, which is just as essential in this case.

I doubt it will ever get built in that location unless there is some serious chopping done.

I say this once a month but 'if only the Harbor Towers could get dynamited and have these buildings go in instead'.....everything would be perfect!
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Is anyone else having a hard time understanding what this building looks like? The rendering needs to be shown at an angle or axonometric... I can't descipher the form...
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

^^ That may be so, but it is tall and will cast shadows so the negatives far, far outweigh any positives.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Personally, I don't think it a good idea to premise design on the continued existence of the Rosie O'Greenway. A new administration with a sophisticated urban vision could very well heal this glorified median strip in the not to distant future. Also, perhaps it is time to cut Chiofaro a little slack. For that great bugaboo, International Place, he hired one of the world's most renowned architects, and gave him a relatively free hand. The resultant design, if not of the highest aesthetic value, certainly represents it's time and culture. Yet Chiofaro is continuously denigrated as The Great Satan. To my mind, there are far worse developers doing far more damage to the city.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Chiofaro does quickly twirl a small model around on his desk. The inner rectangle looks to be solid terra cotta; the rendering suggests that the east facade has glass walls resembling that for the Intercontinental. The north facade in the rendering looks a bit solid as well, but as he twirls the model it looks like there may be lots of glass on the north and south facades as well, but perhaps recessed behind a mostly vertical grill.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

the globe has a larger rendering, don't like the blank walls,this could be so much better IMO,however I am excited about the hieght!
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

I like the tall thin condo one, and the open connection to the other building. Like a giant rowes wharf. Put a restaurant on top and you have quite a view.

Also, how is this zoned for 15 stories when there are two 40 story towers, albeit ugly ones, right there?
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Also, how is this zoned for 15 stories when there are two 40 story towers, albeit ugly ones, right there?
Welcome to the world of inane Boston zoning.

All joking aside, I like it and think it would be great for the city, but I don't see this ever being built, primarily because Chiofro is famously hated by Menino. As other's theorized above, I think this rendering is more of a way for Don to needle the powers that be and less of an actual proposal. He's even quoted in the Globe as saying something along the lines of, "this is for stimulating debate." Personally, I think it's great that a guy with deep pockets and time on his hands can push back against Boston's planning process (or lack there of). He's like a bizaro Ned Flaherty.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Love it......this building won't look right if it is chopped by much....maybe 3-5 stories can come off before the proportions look silly.

I'm not holding out much hope that this is built as is, but it would be a stellar addition.

It really tips its hat to lots of buildings currently on the water (Rowe's, IC, and the Fed. Reserve).
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Amazing looking building. At first glance I thought "What the...?", it took me a couple looks to realize that the middle wasn't actually a third tall building. The video was really nice too. Even though there's a large blank wall on the side, I think the vertical lines coming down the wall make it look really nice. I definitely want to see some more detailed renderings of this thing ASAP.

Unfortunately, I agree with everyone else so far that I doubt this will ever see the light of day.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Welcome to the world of inane Boston zoning.

All joking aside, I like it and think it would be great for the city, but I don't see this ever being built, primarily because Chiofro is famously hated by Menino. As other's theorized above, I think this rendering is more of a way for Don to needle the powers that be and less of an actual proposal. He's even quoted in the Globe as saying something along the lines of, "this is for stimulating debate." Personally, I think it's great that a guy with deep pockets and time on his hands can push back against Boston's planning process (or lack there of). He's like a bizaro Ned Flaherty.
He filed for bankruptcy to avoid Tishman Speyer taking over International Place. Wonder what his credit score is.

Chiofaro on Tishman Speyer, ""The New York crowd is a gang of pirates. They take no prisoners, they give no quarter."

I know Prudential helped him with International Place and with the garage purchase, but Prudential now has had its hand out to the Treasury to help its balance sheet.

I doubt he has paid for other, more detailed renderings. If these existed, they would have been revealed, IMO, especially the Greenway side. The top may look completely bizarro as seen from Memorial Drive.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

I was just reading the comments on Boston.com and I have to say, some of the people are definitely finding ridiculous way to criticize the tower. One person said it was ridiculous to build a tower and enhance the waterfront that way if the best view can only be seen by ducks. The other people then say that it blocks out the skyscrapers behind it so people can't see it. These two statements contradict each other.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Needless to say, if this gets built, Congress St Garage gets built, and the rest of the towers down in the Financial gets underway, Boston skyline will be amazing. Even the 1000ft tower will no longer stick out like a sore thumb anymore.

And one more thing. Why are they complaining about shadows when the center of the arch allows sunlight onto the Greenway.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

^^ Did you notice the Modernist v Red Brick debate going on there as well?
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Chiofaro on Tishman Speyer, ""The New York crowd is a gang of pirates. They take no prisoners, they give no quarter."

He's totally right about TS. Do some searches to see the shit they've pulled at Stuyvesant Town.

Re Tower: Well, I want to hate it but I don't. After watching that video the model shows more clearly the design. I don't know if it is really in the right place, as Abby Flam said. The "arch" is an interesting idea but I can see that being dropped. If I knew that this is exactly what was going to be built then maybe I'd feel better but this being Boston (and with this economy) I am not so optimistic.
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

Is anyone else having a hard time understanding what this building looks like? The rendering needs to be shown at an angle or axonometric... I can't descipher the form...

I think it was based on this model:

devil%27s+fork.jpg
 
Re: New tower at Aquarium parking garage.

^^ Did you notice the Modernist v Red Brick debate going on there as well?

Yeah. It's a dumb argument. Brick buildings can bring variety to the city. I know only three towers (if you can call them towers) that have bricks. 45 Province, The Clarendon, and Archstone. Terracotta is the better looking of the two bricks and would definitely bring some diversity at the waterfront.
 
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