Boston 2024

West said:
So even a smaller, 60K capacity stadium that is wide enough for t&f is useless to the most likely users post-Games. If you want to implement the partial re-use idea, like has been bandied about for the Revolution, I think you'd want to not just lower the upper reaches, but move one whole side in closer. That's probably a half-demolish and rebuild job, unless it's actually practical to have half a 60K seat stadium be movable. That sounds like a stretch.

The IOC, at least in their official rhetoric, has clued in to this problem, hence their new guidelines for a smaller main stadium, not to mention temporary stadiums or the stadium-reduction concept. It isn't about t&f's relative draw during the Games, it's about the avoidance of white elephants after the Games. the 20K delta is a tiny sliver of the TV audience anyhow.
Click to expand...

Alternatively, a post-games conversion for the Revolution could involve lowering the field and simply filling in the sides. If the stadium in Olympic mode has a (spitballing numbers here) 20,000 seat lower section and a 40,000 seat upper section, then the upper decks can be removed, and about 13-14 rows of seats can be filled in along the sides and the ends to up the legacy-mode capacity to around 30,000. If there's any will to host national track events in Boston (or even just a Beanpot-type meet), then those lower seats could theoretically be made retractable and the track re-installed.
 
tklalmighty said:
Alternatively, a post-games conversion for the Revolution could involve lowering the field and simply filling in the sides. If the stadium in Olympic mode has a (spitballing numbers here) 20,000 seat lower section and a 40,000 seat upper section, then the upper decks can be removed, and about 13-14 rows of seats can be filled in along the sides and the ends to up the legacy-mode capacity to around 30,000. If there's any will to host national track events in Boston (or even just a Beanpot-type meet), then those lower seats could theoretically be made retractable and the track re-installed.
Click to expand...

Again, IOC rules pertaining to temporary stadia make this simply a non-starter. Unless the IOC changes its policy to allow convertible facilities or reduced capacity prior to 2017, the Olympic Stadium cannot be used for the Revolution unless Bob Kraft is ready to pay both the initial cost (much higher if permanent facilities such as luxury boxes are involved) and the conversion cost.
 
Equilibria said:
Again, IOC rules pertaining to temporary stadia make this simply a non-starter. Unless the IOC changes its policy to allow convertible facilities or reduced capacity prior to 2017, the Olympic Stadium cannot be used for the Revolution unless Bob Kraft is ready to pay both the initial cost (much higher if permanent facilities such as luxury boxes are involved) and the conversion cost.
Click to expand...

Where is this rule? I thought that was the original plan for London's stadium. And I say this not to challenge you, I'm just curious.
 
tklalmighty said:
Where is this rule? I thought that was the original plan for London's stadium. And I say this not to challenge you, I'm just curious.
Click to expand...

I don't know where to find the official guidelines, but the general principle is that the Olympics is not in the business of building venues with Olympic revenues and then giving them away to private organizations afterward. I suppose in theory a partnership with the private entity is possible, but apportioning the cost between the Olympic operating budget and the post-Games owner would be extraordinarily challenging. Setting a sale price would be just as challenging. The parties have different wants and needs and motivations. That may be a can a worms the IOC is willing to open if they continue to have trouble attracting host cities in respectable countries, but I do not believe their 2020+ guidelines allow it.
 
Equilibria said:
Again, IOC rules pertaining to temporary stadia make this simply a non-starter. Unless the IOC changes its policy to allow convertible facilities or reduced capacity prior to 2017, the Olympic Stadium cannot be used for the Revolution unless Bob Kraft is ready to pay both the initial cost (much higher if permanent facilities such as luxury boxes are involved) and the conversion cost.
Click to expand...

I think that is what is happening with the London stadium. West Ham will play there in less than 2 years. They even have a countdown page:

http://www.olympicstadium.whufc.com/

What have they done that cannot be done here?
 
Schorschico said:
I think that is what is happening with the London stadium. West Ham will play there in less than 2 years. They even have a countdown page:

http://www.olympicstadium.whufc.com/

What have they done that cannot be done here?
Click to expand...

They spent $780 million in public money to build the stadium, and they are currently spending $325 million to convert it. For reference, a temporary stadium would cost about $300-$400 million to build - of private money.
 
Edit - Im double linking this to a more appropriate history thread (Then and Now).

The EGE said:
The loop track itself was in place by the late 1930s (on a 1938 aerial) though not too far before then. Use of the space inside for business happened between the 1955 and 1969 aerials.
Click to expand...

Bringing it back to Widett and some tangential historical geography which I doesn't fit neatly into any particular thread (yes, there really needs to be several different subtopics for these Olympics) - those historic aerials (here) are pretty cool. I always forget how recently it was that South Bay got filled in. In the 1942 aerial, the bay is still pretty big and there's even the stub of the canal that paralleled Albany St, running down to Mass Ave. (which, long ago in I think pre-industrial revolution times, the city's industries - turpentine, paint and leadworks were located, roughly around Albany & Melnea now). Also something I didn't know - if you look at pre-Melnea, Southampton crossed Mass Ave and hit Northampton in what appears to be a sort of large square, that now is covered up by that Hampton Inn and a much bleaker Northampton St.

Anyway, assuming those USGS maps are correct, the land for Widett was filled between 1943 and 1944, with the rail loop immediately constructed upon it. On this post from 2012, you can see the patch of land that became Widett, sandwiched between the main canal of the much-filled in South Cove, and a small "tributary" channel that ran all the way to south of Southampton St (shown on 1938 aerial, truncated to the now-Fairmount Line in 1955, shown on the USGS topo for 1967 but gone in the 1969 aerial - which is also when the roads and businesses of Widett are shown for the first time. I would guess that this photo below is from the mid 50's, since the New York Streets area has been just cleared.

chinatown.png
 
Equilibria said:
Again, IOC rules pertaining to temporary stadia make this simply a non-starter. Unless the IOC changes its policy to allow convertible facilities or reduced capacity prior to 2017, the Olympic Stadium cannot be used for the Revolution unless Bob Kraft is ready to pay both the initial cost (much higher if permanent facilities such as luxury boxes are involved) and the conversion cost.
Click to expand...

White Stadium in Franklin Park is suggested as the site for Pentathlon

The plan would be to rebuild it to modern athletic stadium design standards, add some temporary seats for the 2024 Games -- and then remove the temporary seats and gift the rebuilt stadium to the City of Boston for high school and possible some collegiate uses
 
well, here's something interesting:

https://archive.org/stream/proposaltocommon00bost/proposaltocommon00bost_djvu.txt

It's a 1992 proposal from the BRA and Mayor Flynn to the Commonwealth, proposing a stadium complex at Widett Circle. Though it's called the "professional sports complex", the justification is partly to increase the City's chances for landing an Olympics Games. it doesn't specify which Olympics they'd have been angling for, but if they were tossing the idea around in 1992, they'd presumably have been eying either the 2000 or (more likely) the 2004 Games.

I had once seen an article that Boston tossed out the idea of hosting an alternative Games to the boycotted Moscow Games in 1980. To be the "freedom games" or some such. I had not heard of prior discussions about an Olympics stadium at Widett.
 
whighlander said:
White Stadium in Franklin Park is suggested as the site for Pentathlon

The plan would be to rebuild it to modern athletic stadium design standards, add some temporary seats for the 2024 Games -- and then remove the temporary seats and gift the rebuilt stadium to the City of Boston for high school and possible some collegiate uses
Click to expand...

Yeah, Ive been wondering when we'd hear about this - Fish had plans to fix this stadium up a couple years ago. I'd certainly be all for fixing up White Stadium, regardless, not sure what happened with Fish's proposal from back then.

West
Re: Boston 2024
well, here's something interesting:

https://archive.org/stream/proposalt...0bost_djvu.txt

It's a 1992 proposal from the BRA and Mayor Flynn to the Commonwealth, proposing a stadium complex at Widett Circle. Though it's called the "professional sports complex", the justification is partly to increase the City's chances for landing an Olympics Games. it doesn't specify which Olympics they'd have been angling for, but if they were tossing the idea around in 1992, they'd presumably have been eying either the 2000 or (more likely) the 2004 Games.

I had once seen an article that Boston tossed out the idea of hosting an alternative Games to the boycotted Moscow Games in 1980. To be the "freedom games" or some such. I had not heard of prior discussions about an Olympics stadium at Widett.
Click to expand...

Funny how when it comes to planning, governments the state, country, probably world over just keep on recycling the same old plans, good ones and bad ones alike.
 
West said:
it doesn't specify which Olympics they'd have been angling for, but if they were tossing the idea around in 1992, they'd presumably have been eying either the 2000 or (more likely) the 2004 Games.
Click to expand...

I worked at a major consulting firm in '92 that was doing a pro bono study to bring the 2012 Olympics to Boston, so it was probably part of that bid process.
 
Too bad they cant dig back up some of the land and bring back the canal to where it was supposed to be before it was stolen from Boston forever. Wont happen though.
 
Globe article from eve of the storm, I missed it until today.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...ympic-costs/iuo29sfglioN57sE9KMKuO/story.html

Headline is "Boston lawmakers elevate concerns over Olympic costs". Describes a Monday meeting between backers and some legislators.

Sample quote:

"In bidding documents submitted to the US Olympic Committee, and made public last week, Boston 2024 played up support from major political players and said it “could envision proposal of comprehensive Olympic legislation to facilitate venues and transportation in a unified manner.”

Monday’s session provided the latest, and perhaps loudest, reminder from state officials that — with the Olympic organizers planning on state money, new laws, and the creation of a new public agency — the road to Boston 2024 runs through Beacon Hill." [end of quote]
 
Shoulda gone for Winter Olympics, with the downhill event on Breed's Hill.
 
Matthew said:
Shoulda gone for Winter Olympics, with the downhill event on Breed's Hill.
Click to expand...

Jon Keller actually asked the Governor that yesterday, jokingly. "Do you think we went for the wrong Olympics?"
 
stick n move said:
Too bad they cant dig back up some of the land and bring back the canal to where it was supposed to be before it was stolen from Boston forever. Wont happen though.
Click to expand...

The canal was filled in due to pollution. In fact most of the smaller bays around Boston were filled in because they were so heavily polluted. Having a train yard on top of it would mean years of environmental cleanup. It's a fun idea until you realize just what's down there. Even if the Olympics come it won't be worth it to recover the canal. Hell, the Fort Point Channel is still here and totally underutilized for anything!
 
Globe: Olympics group calls on wealthy executives
Bank of America Corp., for instance, did not originally appear on the [Boston 2024 donors] list, but the banking giant has provided $500,000 in support, at the direction of its Boston-based marketing chief, Anne Finucane.
Click to expand...

I wonder if BofA could take a special interest in a Boston Olympics given their rumored interest in moving to Boston and desire to shift from being a domestic retail bank to a global capital markets bank. Wild speculation, I know, but still interesting...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top