Bulfinch Crossing | Congress Street Garage | West End

[datadyne007]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

I don't understand how this CBT proposal (that actually went through the BRA process) and the Pelli proposal go with each other. Perhaps we were all caught up in the beautiful curves of the Pelli tower and didn't question how it fits into the plan. Does the Pelli tower actually replace the two ~12-15 story buildings with the retail corridor nearest to the Greenway?

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Edit: Meddle, great minds think alike.

This plan looks entirely different:

 

[type001]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

Awards and talk are cheap. Just get rid of the damn garage already!

 

[Equilibria]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

The Cesar Pelli tower is no more?

Maybe not. The office tower is in phase 2, and it's entirely possible that they had Pelli design a concept for a tower that didn't fit into CBT's existing site renders. Remember how artsy those Pelli renders are - the design is not well developed at all, and I doubt Pelli wants CBT hypothesizing what his tower would look like from different angles.

The award is for the site plan, and that may be all the render represents.

 

[TheRifleman]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

I love the renderings (Still need to see more detail and angles of this development) but any shadows over the NorthEnd will be some serious issues.

North End Residents have more clout in the city than Harbor Towers.

 

[fattony]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

CBT's Government Center Garage Redevelopment has been nominated for the 2015 AIA Institute Honor Awards for Regional & Urban Design.



ArchDaily had a render that I don't recall seeing:

This design is no slouch either. It is not as sexy as the other, but its a leap ahead of 95% of of what we see proposed.

 

[datadyne007]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

My main concern is that if Pelli's tower is proposed to go where I think it is, it completely replaces something that was master planned to be a urban retail, pedestrian-only zone into nothing but a sterile massive office lobby. Pelli's plan seemingly obliterates CBT's.

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01/13 Edit: I was wrong. See post 1722.

 

[Equilibria]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

My main concern is that if Pelli's tower is proposed to go where I think it is, it completely replaces something that was master planned to be a urban retail, pedestrian-only zone into nothing but a sterile massive office lobby. Pelli's plan seemingly obliterates CBT's.

Based on the articles that accompanied the Pelli images, I'm pretty sure we're talking about two designs for the same tower. There has only ever been one office tower in this project, and the project was approved by the BRA with two towers - one residential and the other office. They couldn't add a third one without going back to the BRA.

 

[fattony]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

My main concern is that if Pelli's tower is proposed to go where I think it is, it completely replaces something that was master planned to be a urban retail, pedestrian-only zone into nothing but a sterile massive office lobby. Pelli's plan seemingly obliterates CBT's.

I agree with that, but you don't have to scrap the whole tower to reprogram the ground floor, do you? Can we have our cake and eat it too?

 

[whighlander]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

This design is no slouch either. It is not as sexy as the other, but its a leap ahead of 95% of of what we see proposed.

#1

This tower wraps around the western part of the garage which is to be retained and whose access is to be restructured -- [on the extreme right -- sort of ghostly -- in the 2 lower renders][#2, #3]

#2

#3

The Peli Tower is on the eastern side of Congress St. after the part of the garage which bridges the street today is removed

#4

[/QUOTE]


I think the top render [#1] replaces just the place holder blocks[WP1,2,3]shown in the original concept [#4] of wrapping up the retained part of the garage -- the Peli replaces the blocks on the other side of Congress [EP1,2,3]

The Net is two buildings instead of 6 + the retained garage

 

[fattony]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

The stuff on the eastern side of Congress is 10-12 stories, not 40.

Render #1 shows 2 towers, both angular/rectilinear.

The render in data's post above shows 2 towers, both round/curvy.

There are only 2 tall towers in the plan, so I see no way to reconcile the discrepancy.

 

[datadyne007]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

The stuff on the eastern side of Congress is 10-12 stories, not 40.

Render #1 shows 2 towers, both angular/rectilinear.

The render in data's post above shows 2 towers, both round/curvy.

There are only 2 tall towers in the plan, so I see no way to reconcile the discrepancy.

Exactly. And to respond to your earlier point: No we really can't have our cake and eat it too in this case. Filling the base of the office tower with retail (which would never happen anyway because office tower bases are monuments to corporate egos) is not the same as creating this vibrant pedestrian only zone between 15 story buildings. Pelli's proposal is a massive downgrade from the standpoint of urbanism.

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01/13 Edit: I was wrong. See post 1722.

 

[lexicon506]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

The Pelli tower is the new design for the tall tower in CBT's site plan. There is only one office tower in this development, Pelli will be replacing that CBT amorphous design. It's really not that hard to figure out.

 

[Equilibria]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

The Pelli tower is the new design for the tall tower in CBT's site plan. There is only one office tower in this development, Pelli will be replacing that CBT amorphous design. It's really not that hard to figure out.

Agreed. Remember, no one ever said this CBT render was newer. We just saw it later.

 

[type001]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

Actually we saw CBT in 5/2014.

http://www.archboston.org/community/showpost.php?p=205221&postcount=1592

 

[whighlander]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

The Pelli tower is the new design for the tall tower in CBT's site plan. There is only one office tower in this development, Pelli will be replacing that CBT amorphous design. It's really not that hard to figure out.

If that is the case -- where is the remnant of the parking garage hidden in the Peli?

 

[fattony]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

Exactly. And to respond to your earlier point: No we really can't have our cake and eat it too in this case. Filling the base of the office tower with retail (which would never happen anyway because office tower bases are monuments to corporate egos) is not the same as creating this vibrant pedestrian only zone between 15 story buildings. Pelli's proposal is a massive downgrade from the standpoint of urbanism.

OK, now I'm confused again. Pelli's tower is the taller tower on the West Parcel (WP B2 in Westy's render #4). The ped-only zone is down the middle of the East Parcel. Is this not correct?

This from a Globe article does not suggest there has been any alteration of the site plan:

Developer HYM Investment Group said it wants to begin construction next year. The project, estimated to cost well over $1 billion, would start with a 42-story residential tower planned to contain 450 units of rental and ownership housing. That would be followed by removal of the part of the garage that hangs over Congress Street and the construction of the 47-story office building. (the Pelli tower)

In all, the project would result in six buildings containing 2.3 million square feet of commercial and residential space. Three high-rises would be built on the western portion of the site, and three smaller buildings would be built along the Rose Fitzgerald Kennedy Greenway. A retail plaza would create a new connection between the Greenway and Canal Street.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2014/10/01/govcenter/9rmaCLs89fRlTlM713LRAN/story.html

 

[datadyne007]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

My apologies. I've re-evaluated the renders and realized I was wrong. The close-up Pelli renders (just the tower) are so out of context that they confused me into thinking the Pelli tower was on the EP site. The way it was rendered makes it look like the tower is on an island, not part of a complex which lead me to believe it was on the EP and not the WP. Additionally, the Pelli render from afar makes it look like the Pelli tower was on the other side of the street because it looks incredibly detached from the complex.

I was wrong, but damn, those renders, while shiny, are just an awful distortion of reality. Thank you for providing the clarifying article.

 

[whighlander]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

#1

This tower wraps around the western part of the garage which is to be retained and whose access is to be restructured -- [on the extreme right -- sort of ghostly -- in the 2 lower renders][#2, #3]

#2

#3

The Peli Tower is on the Western side of Congress St.which is exposed after the part of the garage which bridges the street today is removed

#4

I think the top render [#1] replaces just the place holder blocks[WP1,2,3]shown in the original concept [#4] of wrapping up the retained part of the garage -- the Peli then replaces the part of the Top Render [#1]




I think that I've found the answer to my own question -- from the Globe story about Peli's Tower:

If architect Cesar Pelli has his way, Government Center’s brutish concrete buildings will be getting a fashionable new neighbor.
A glass skyscraper designed by Pelli would bring 528 feet of curvy glass to the corner of Congress and New Sudbury streets, where developers are preparing to build a cluster of high*rises to replace portions of the Government Center Garage.
….“It’s very important for this building to be unusual for Boston,” said architect Alex Krieger, a principal of the firm NBBJ. “People often complain how tall buildings here tend to be more dour. This could be a chance to enjoy something else.”
Developer HYM Investment Group said it wants to begin construction next year. The project, estimated to cost well over $1 billion, would start with a 42* story residential tower planned to contain 450 units of rental and ownership housing. …
That would be followed by removal of the part of the garage that hangs over Congress Street…
and the construction of the 47*story office building.
In all, the project would result in six buildings containing 2.3 million square feet of commercial and residential
space.
Three high*rises would be built on the western portion of the site, and three smaller buildings would be built
along the Rose Fitzgerald Kennedy Greenway. A retail plaza would create a new connection between the Greenway and Canal Street.
While the portion of the garage above the street would be demolished, the core of the building at Congress and New Sudbury would remain, preserving 1,100 parking spaces. That part of the garage would be hidden behind the new high*rises.

the Peli is one of the 3 boxes on the West side of Congress

BUT -- while the overall plan has been approved -- the BRA has yet to weigh-in on any of the details

HOWEVER -- Brian Golden seems to be "Wowed" by the Peli

The development has received approval from the Boston Redevelopment Authority, but plans for each building
must also be approved by the agency’s design commission. BRA acting director Brian Golden offered strong
support for the project Wednesday. … “The redevelopment of the Government Center Garage site will
reshape the downtown skyline in a way that few projects can,” he said. “We welcome a creative approach to its design and look forward to working with the architecture team to review their proposal more carefully.”

 

[fattony]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

My apologies. I've re-evaluated the renders and realized I was wrong. The close-up Pelli renders (just the tower) are so out of context that they confused me into thinking the Pelli tower was on the EP site. The way it was rendered makes it look like the tower is on an island, not part of a complex which lead me to believe it was on the EP and not the WP. Additionally, the Pelli render from afar makes it look like the Pelli tower was on the other side of the street because it looks incredibly detached from the complex.

I was wrong, but damn, those renders, while shiny, are just an awful distortion of reality. Thank you for providing the clarifying article.

Ok, that's good then. The office tower lobby should open onto New Chardon St, maybe just wrapping around a bit to the corner with Congress.

 

[TheRifleman]

Re: Congress Street Garage Development

Is slide 3 and 4 the same development just different angles?