Copley Place Expansion and Tower | Back Bay

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vanshnookenraggen said:
New archBoston drinking game: Every time Scott Van Voorhis says "soar", take 1 shot.

It's getting to the point now where I'm wondering if SVV has someone to proof read his articles...you know like an EDITOR. How the hell can you read the guys work for months and months and not see that he uses the word SOAR as much as other writers use "the". It's annoying as shit and to be honest it takes away from what he writes.

And Scott is also wrong like 8 out of 10 times about how many stories or feet buildings are going to be so I take what he says with a grain of salt.
 
It's the Herald, what idiot doesn't know to take their news with a can of salt.
 
Yes

I think you'll find less opposition to the Simon Tower than you did to Columbus Center, for many reasons, some obvious,some not.

It's a good location.

And, as others pointed out, outside the control of NAGG and its like.
 
Not sure if this really belong here but I assume they were discussing this project so...

Bankers & Tradesman said:
Reporter Barred From Prudential Project Advisory Meeting
By Thomas Grillo
Reporter

Shut out. A reporter from a neighborhood newspaper was barred from a city advisory panel meeting last week in an apparent violation of the state?s Open Meeting Law.

Ted Siefer, who writes for The Boston Courant, a weekly newspaper distributed to 35,000 households in the downtown neighborhoods, was ejected from a meeting of the Prudential Project Advisory Committee (PruPAC) on Wednesday.

The 41-member group was established by former Mayor Raymond Flynn in the 1980s to advise City Hall on development projects near Boston?s Prudential Center. Flynn told Banker & Tradesman that he was disappointed that the press and the public were banned from the meeting.

?It was never my intention to keep the public or the press from attending any meetings,? he said. ?The reason we appointed these groups was to open up the windows and make the process wide open.?

On Wednesday afternoon, Elliott Laffer, PruPAC?s vice chairman, assured Banker & Tradesman that reporters would be allowed to cover the session as long as questions were reserved until after the meeting. He also asked that members not be quoted. The meeting was called to hear a presentation by Boston Properties on a pair of buildings the company plans to construct at the Prudential Center.

On Thursday, Laffer declined to say who raised the objection to the public being present. He also refused to say how he voted on that presence and said only that the vote was overwhelmingly against having the public in the room.

Siefer said Richard Kiley, a representative of the Fenway Civic Association on PruPAC, raised the objection to the media?s presence and made a motion to evict him. Kiley is a schoolteacher who no longer lives in the Fenway area. He could not be reached for comment.

William Richardson, president of the Fenway Civic Association, said he did not support the move to keep the press out. ?I have never run a meeting that kept the press out,? he said.

?A Different View?

Siefer said at least four members voted to keep the press in the room, including state Rep. Martha M. Walz; Marc Lederman, who represented the Fenway Community Development Corp.; Walter Salvi from NSTAR; and Meg Mainzer Cohen of the Back Bay Association.

Laffer defended the vote to keep the meeting private. ?Over its 20-year history, PruPAC had not been public and not had allowed reporters in the room,? he said. ?The downside to having reporters in the room is that it inhibits discussion. Frankly, we worry about saying something that might be perceived as stupid.?

Betsy Johnson, the PruPAC chairman, also defended the panel?s vote to keep the public and the press out. She said even during the Flynn administration, the ?working sessions? were private.

?The private sessions were the policy when Flynn was mayor and no one from the Boston Redevelopment Authority or the administration spoke up at that time. It?s not like we?ve been open for 15 years and now this meeting was closed,? she said. ?We are very proud of our accomplishments, but our work has been compromised by untimely references and quotes in the press. We?ve had a process that is not broke, and why change it at this point??

Siefer said John O?Brien, the BRA?s project manager who attended the meeting, advised PruPAC that an understanding had been reached with the Courant and other papers that such meetings are open, but the ground rules are that no one should be quoted during the session.

?He also said these meetings are not covered by the Open Meeting Law,? Siefer said. ?But I said the [district attorney] has a different view of that.?

Jake Wark, a spokesman for Suffolk District Attorney Daniel F. Conley, said while his office has not ruled on PruPAC meetings, he noted that the office previously has offered on an opinion on a case that involved the Harvard Allston Task Force. In that case, the public was barred from a session.

In a letter to the BRA in June, Conley wrote, ?Where members of a governmental body meet to discuss public business in private ? this action constitutes a meeting under the Open Meeting Law.?

In a prepared statement, the BRA said, ?Because the BRA encourages groups like PruPAC to allow members of the public to observe their meetings that address development proposals, we are disappointed with PruPAC?s recent actions. As part of the BRA?s review process, there will be an opportunity for all members of the public to participate in the discussion about this project.?

David Jacobs, the Courant publisher, said he plans to contact the Massachusetts Attorney General Martha Coakley?s office and Conley?s office to advise them that PruPAC is violating the state?s Open Meeting Law.

?I have declared jihad on these closed meetings,? Jacobs said. ?I understand the need for working group meetings, but we?re talking about $100 million projects that impact all of us and the decision-making leading up to proposals are vital because projects have a way of building momentum and by the time the public hears about them they have a life of their own.?

Siefer noted that as he was being tossed out of the meeting, he was offered a treat.

??Take a brownie on the way out,? someone said to me,? he said. ?I declined.?
Link
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

A shadow of a doubt
Gloomy concerns about Copley tower

By Scott Van Voorhis

A proposed Back Bay tower, already controversial for its height, now faces a related hurdle: fears it will cast shadows over one of Boston?s landmarks, Copley Square.

Plans for a new high-rise that could soar as high as 585 feet above Copley Place are raising concerns among some community leaders, who warn the project would darken one of Hub?s centerpiece parks.

Project executives are now waiting until early next year to formally file plans with City Hall, in part to tweak the tower design to minimize any shadow impacts, according to Lynne Kortenhaus, a spokeswoman. Those plans were to have been unveiled this fall.


At stake is a major expansion of Copley Place by national mall owner Simon Properties. The project calls for a condo tower that could rise anywhere from 500 to 585 feet above a revamped Neiman Marcus store that could nearly double in size.

?It is a concern,? Kortenhaus said. ?It is part of the reason we have not filed anything. We are doing additional shadow studies to really minimize the shadows.?

One possibility being reviewed is how the tower is angled in relation to nearby Copley Square, which in turn could have an impact on shadow it would cast. The development site in turn is fairly narrow, leading to a more slender tower that could also help reduce any shadows, Kortenhaus said.

Still, the prospect the new tower might darken Copley Square and its popular urban park is emerging as a make-or-break issue.

?We have enough shadows,? said Jackie Yessian, chair of the Neighborhood Association of Back Bay, speaking of Copley Square. ?It already has shadows during the day. Enough is enough.?

State Rep. Marty Walz (D-Back Bay) said how much of a shadow the tower casts over Copley Square, and for how long, will be key.

?If the park is put into shadow, that obviously makes a material difference to the users of the park who go there to be in the sunshine,? Walz said.

http://www.bostonherald.com/business/general/view.bg?articleid=1049509
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

And NABB's opinion matters why?

The property isn't in the Back Bay.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

The homeless guys go there for the sunshine?
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Don't worry.. Simon Properties will pacify the masses by reducing the tower to a comfy320 feet. To make up the difference, it will be as wide and stumpy as possible. Then they will clad it with prefab brick and concrete panelling with fiberglass Victoriana to 'blend' their building to the South End and Back Bay.. it's very simple really.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

SOAR!!!
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Soar, shadows and calling copley square a "centerpiece park" (vs a plaza) all in one article

Amazing
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

I wonder, since Post Office Square park is plunged in shadow for a good part of the day, does that diminish its utility? Plenty of people still use it. There is a creative solution to every problem that doesn't involve truncating a building. Back Bay is a good location for a tall, slender, elegant tower. Shadows on Copley should not be a deal breaker.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

And NABB's opinion matters why?

The property isn't in the Back Bay.

If I'm reading the Boston precinct map correctly it's not even in Walz's district. It appears as though Boylston is the divider between wards 5 and 6, thus placing this in Brian Wallace's district.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Taken from Google Earth. Note the Hancock's shadow.
COPLEY.jpg
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Obviously, which building is going to cast a shadow depends on both the time of day and the time of year.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

I think Briv makes a great point. The Hancock tower already makes a shadow, so the shadow argument seems very shallow to me.

Think about where the sun would be to have the shadow line up with the plaza. I dont see how it would be low enough to cast a shadow that far. Plus, the new tower wouldnt be close to the height JHT. This is just crying wolf because people don't want a little more congestion on their streets and sidewalks. What's the difference? There's already alot, its an urban environment. Hopefully the postponement is just the developer covering his ass, preparing for the NIMBY's argument so he can push this through as quickly as possible.

Are there any renderings for this by the way?
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

I am not an expert on this, but I cannot see how this would cast a shadow on the plaza? Maybe this time of year, in winter, when the sun is at it's lowest point, it would for a short time, but when it's 20 degrees, not many people are out in the plaza's. And most importantly, you live in a major US city. It has tall buildings. It has had them longer than most of these people complaining have lived here, and they will be here long after. And cities grow. If you don't want growth, move to the mountains!
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Slightly of topic, but there very few sites in the Back Bay where new office buildings can be built. Is it concievable to replace one of Copley Place's 4 office buildings with a tower?

PS the MBTA talked about developing the Back Bay train station about 10 years ago.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

There's one remaining vacant lot on the north side of Newbury Street, but I doubt a tower would ever be allowed there.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

The Hancock garage needs to be replaced eventually; I could see a sizeable tower rising there.
 
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