General MBTA Topics (Multi Modal, Budget, MassDOT)

[winstonoboogie]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

A couple questions on the disabled trains on the Red Line this winter, these came to me while delayed on various trains and platforms these past few weeks:

* Is there a particular part or system that is breaking, or is it a different problem every time?
* I would guess that the older 1500 and 1600 series cars are the ones failing. Is that right?
* Is there any interim solution that could make existing service more reliable before the new cars are delivered in 2018-2019?
* Would delivery be faster if CNR were to build them in existing factories in China rather than setting up the new plant and training new workers in Springfield?

Blown motors are the big problem. It's not just the oldest Red and Orange Line cars, 1994 Red Line cars and 2007 Blue Line cars also having problems. Snow gets blown in, melts, refreezes, causes problems.

They are going to rebuild the trucks (the wheels/motor/brake) on both the oldest Red Line cars and the existing Orange Line cars before they are replaced. The are also overhauling some other sub-components on the older cars.

It takes awhile for a rail car builder to order and assemble all of the sub-components required to complete an order. I don't think the assemble in Mass requirement is going to delay the order.

 

[winstonoboogie]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

The Boston Globe has a story on the T's recent issues:

Sluggish commute today on roads, MBTA





Okay, new cars are coming, and there is nothing we can do for the next few years, while we watch service deteriorate each winter. That sucks. I want to see a plan to avoid this from being a recurring cycle when cars get so old. The 1700's are less than 20 years younger than the 1500's and 1600's. They are not due to be replaced with the new order. We clearly can't have them turn 45 while still in use.

So, an order to fully replace the 1700 series should be placed by their 35th birthday (2023), with extra cars for an increase in frequency. By then, the T management will probably say, "the last brand new cars from our recent order are still entering service today. There is no need for another order!"

But, in reality, the second this order is complete, they should be placing another order to immediately replace the 1700 series. This should be a part of T's annual budget! They will always need to be at some stage in the procurement of replacement cars, so budget for that! I don't know who this ire should be directed at: the MBTA, MassDOT, Charlie Baker, but new cars should stop being treated as an exception, and start being treated as a necessary and routine part of maintenance.

The 1700s are being replaced by the new order, its 152 Orange Line cars and 132 Red Line. The original bid request for the Red Line cars was 74 to replace the 1500/1600s and an option for 58 more to replace the 1700s. Because the bid price came in so low, they picked up the option with the base contract.Everything on the Red except the 1800s will be replaced by the new cars. The are planning a mid-life overhaul for the 1800s.

 

[bigeman312]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

The 1700s are being replaced by the new order, its 152 Orange Line cars and 132 Red Line. The original bid request for the Red Line cars was 74 to replace the 1500/1600s and an option for 58 more to replace the 1700s. Because the bid price came in so low, they picked up the option with the base contract.Everything on the Red except the 1800s will be replaced by the new cars. The are planning a mid-life overhaul for the 1800s.

Thank you!

EDIT: Aren't there exactly 132 1500/1600/1700 trains in service? I thought they were planning on increasing their fleet? Is that out the window now?

 

[mass88]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

^ As much as the raging against the T is stupid, the political solution should involve a full audit of MBTA financials. The state won't just give the T more funding, no matter how much it's the state's fault for fucking it up. Pension reform or something will have to be in the mix to get anything passed.

Why is it that a full financial audit has never been done, or if one has been done, have the results been made public?

 

[HenryAlan]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

I just waited 30 min for a BL train that never came. Called my husband to come back to get me at Beachmont, drove to the airport and caught a SL right away. THE SILVER LINE IS LITERALLY THE ONLY THING WORKING RIGHT NOW.

I was on the Orange Line at about the same time, it seemed to basically be okay. There was some delay leaving Forest Hills, but otherwise, it moved along fairly well. At any rate, that's two things that were working.

That said, I recognize that I was probably somewhat lucky, and am mindful that the route I rode included some of the newest infrastructure in the system (SW corridor). The significant failures throughout much of the rest of the system demonstrate clearly that we have gone too long with "good enough" maintenance and upgrades.

 

[jass]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

5 dead on Metro North tonight.

Makes a delayed commute seem ridiculously trivial in comparison

 

[datadyne007]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

5 dead on Metro North tonight.

Makes a delayed commute seem ridiculously trivial in comparison

Actually at least 6 and at least 12 injured. An SUV ended up on the tracks at a crossing.

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/6-dead-least-12-injured-fiery-metro-north-train-crash

And yes, I had the same thought. It really puts our delays into perspective.

 

[deh74]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Actually at least 6 and at least 12 injured. An SUV ended up on the tracks at a crossing.

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/6-dead-least-12-injured-fiery-metro-north-train-crash

And yes, I had the same thought. It really puts our delays into perspective.

I was actually rendered speechless for a moment upon seeing this, holy shit those poor people. I hope nothing like that happens again as a result of this weather, in New York or Boston. On another note, comments on news sites really are the worst thing...

 

[George_Apley]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

data -- you are entitled to your own opinion of course

However -- you are not entitled to your own facts -- do a bit of investigation and you will see that nearly an average years snow fall has descended on Boston in the past week

It has also been substantially colder than the typical early February for the past week -- so cold and snow stresses are going to greater than normal on people and equipment

How do you always manage to completely change the subject?

Why is it that a full financial audit has never been done, or if one has been done, have the results been made public?

I don't know that it hasn't ever been done, but I think that an audit being part of the deal is the only way that a political solution to MBTA funding will be found.

 

[winstonoboogie]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Thank you!

EDIT: Aren't there exactly 132 1500/1600/1700 trains in service? I thought they were planning on increasing their fleet? Is that out the window now?

It's equal to the number of #1s and #2s that exist, but four of the #1s and six of the #2s are out of service long term, so the available active fleet will be slightly larger than what it is now. Hopefully, the new cars will also be more reliable, so the percentage of active cars out of service for minor repairs will be smaller as well. The 58-car option of the Red Line order was always to replace the #2s.

 

[datadyne007]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Winston, all the news channels tonight that are talking about today's mess are also mentioning a lawsuit that's "holding up" the order of RL & OL trains and that Charlie Baker is allegedly trying to "speed it up." What is going on with this lawsuit? Are the cars still on track to begin to be delivered in Q1 of 2018?

 

[winstonoboogie]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Winston, all the news channels tonight that are talking about today's mess are also mentioning a lawsuit that's "holding up" the order of RL & OL trains and that Charlie Baker is allegedly trying to "speed it up." What is going on with this lawsuit? Are the cars still on track to begin to be delivered in Q1 of 2018?

CNR already received the notice to proceed, the losing bidders filed protests, but from what I understand, everything will continue to proceed during the review of the protests. It is only the pilot cars that will arrive in 2018 if they remain on schedule, the bulk of the deliveries will be 2019-2021, if there are no delays. I doubt much can be done to speed up the process, pilot cars are usually tested for an extensive period of time before production deliveries begin.

 

[jass]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Winston, all the news channels tonight that are talking about today's mess are also mentioning a lawsuit that's "holding up" the order of RL & OL trains and that Charlie Baker is allegedly trying to "speed it up." What is going on with this lawsuit? Are the cars still on track to begin to be delivered in Q1 of 2018?

In the history of rail car ordering, have any ever been on time?

 

[Riverside]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

When it rains, it pours: Kingston/Plymouth train hits tractor-trailer in Braintree. Thankfully, it seems that no one was hurt.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2015/02/04/commuter-rail-train-strikes-tractor-trailer-in-braintree/

 

[atlantaden]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

It's unbelievable, no matter how many crossing gates/lights/bells/whistles, etc. the railroads place at crossings, drivers still seem to ignore it all and drive in front of trains. What the hell are these drivers thinking?

 

[George_Apley]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

It's unbelievable, no matter how many crossing gates/lights/bells/whistles, etc. the railroads place at crossings, drivers still seem to ignore it all and drive in front of trains. What the hell are these drivers thinking?

"I'm so skilled, I can manage it" , "I'm in a rush, fuck it" , etc.

 

[Arlington]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

"I'm so skilled, I can manage it" , "I'm in a rush, fuck it" , etc.

It is tragic how people grossly-underestimate the risks compared to the value of saving a few seconds. There was a study done (mid 1990s) about the compensation value of a human life. The lowest, of all possible valuation schemes (future earnings, cost to family, invested cost, etc.) was the value imputed to how much time savings drivers were willing to (and did) die for at RR crossings.

Time savings for "beating the train" are on the order of 2 minutes. At any valuation of one's own time ($18/hr is "normal" and $1200/hr is "lawyer") people had forfeited their lives (and passengers') (for which the RR might be sued for $100k to $10m) to save the equivalent of 60 cents to $40. A complete evolutionary-perceptive fail.

You'd think it'd be obvious that your life should not be risked for less than most people had in their wallet, but that's what happens.

 

[jass]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

When it rains, it pours: Kingston/Plymouth train hits tractor-trailer in Braintree. Thankfully, it seems that no one was hurt.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2015/02/04/commuter-rail-train-strikes-tractor-trailer-in-braintree/

WMATA has a fire in their subway
Boston follows with three
MTA has a storm disaster
Boston follows with 3 days of storm disaster
MTA crashes into car
...Boston follows with 3 grade crossing crashes...?

Past month has been a disaster for transit in the northeast.

 

[djimpact1]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

It's unbelievable, no matter how many crossing gates/lights/bells/whistles, etc. the railroads place at crossings, drivers still seem to ignore it all and drive in front of trains. What the hell are these drivers thinking?

"I'm so skilled, I can manage it" , "I'm in a rush, fuck it" , etc.

When interviewed by NECN, the driver said as he was driving over the tracks the cab of his truck got stuck in snow on/around the tracks. He did try to reverse & proceed forward a few times but had no luck doing so. After some time, the crossing gates lowered & bells rang, at which point he knew the train was coming (and kept attempting to move his truck until a few seconds before the train hit it)...quite a valiant effort if I do say so.

So atlantaden & BussesAin'tTrains, I say it's unbelievable that no matter how many wrong assumptions have been posted & proven wrong in the history of personal internet use, people still seem to know exactly what happens in the world from behind their keyboard. What the hell are you thinking? "I'm so presumptuous, I already know what happened without being there...f**k it, etc."

 

[Matthew]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

There is a phone number printed in large type on a prominent sign next to every grade crossing: to help notify the dispatcher whenever a situation like this develops. Before it gets worse.