General MBTA Topics (Multi Modal, Budget, MassDOT)

[Arlington]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Arlington -- Arlington Virginaia is a "Ward of the State" writ large ...85% of the workers in that entire region are either Federal employees, contract employees, ...

Even if all true (I think you're stretching) How is this relevant? (I don't see the point you've stretched to). Is this meant to excuse the communities along the MBTA subways from their failure to create dense, walkable neighborhoods and accommodate new housing units and attract new employers?

No matter who their employer is or how the employer takes in money to pay them, all employers have to consider access to pools of labor. This often means siting in a "competitive cluster" of similar companies to be near similar employees. Boston has Higher Education, Medical Devices, Biotech and specialty Tech. DC has Gov't, Law, Media, Aero-Defense, and MCI-AOL tech spawns. They attract nearly the same young, affluent, educated ladder-climbers.

These yuppie employees have to balance home, commute, and quality of jobs the same way in either place. But that Boston has de-populated its Arlington (and lost population, generally) is in part due to the lack of (comparatively) affordable close-in housing--something DC is relatively-better at creating and Boston stinks at.

 

[Matthew]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Uhhh, did someone tell the Herald that the back-door ban only started getting enforced in June on the "B" and "C"?

Amazing, really.

 

[Arlington]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Uhhh, did someone tell the Herald that the back-door ban only started getting enforced in June on the "B" and "C"?

The article says:

The MBTA launched a pilot program on the E branch of the Green Line in January requiring all riders to enter and exit only through a trolley’s front door except during rush hour periods. The policy was expanded to the C branch in February, the D in April and finally the B in May, the first month when the back door ban was in full effect across all four branches.

Acting T General Manager Jonathan Davis told the Herald that the policy likely contributed to ridership on the light rail system rising 9.1 percent last month over the same period last year.

 

[Matthew]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Yes, it was "officially" implemented. But it was not actually enforced until the beginning of June or so. I am saying this as a rider. I even asked a driver about it on the day of implementation, and he said it was in effect, but I did not see or hear anyone actually enforce it for weeks. I kept wondering every day.

 

[whighlander]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Even if all true (I think you're stretching) How is this relevant? (I don't see the point you've stretched to). Is this meant to excuse the communities along the MBTA subways from their failure to create dense, walkable neighborhoods and accommodate new housing units and attract new employers...

These yuppie employees have to balance home, commute, and quality of jobs the same way in either place. But that Boston has de-populated its Arlington (and lost population, generally) is in part due to the lack of (comparatively) affordable close-in housing--something DC is relatively-better at creating and Boston stinks at.

Arlington -- That's an overly symplistic analysis

Bostons's belts were the product of innovation and private investment --perhaps fertilized by gov't contracts - -e.g. Raytheon, DEC, RCA, GE, etc.. -- these eventually spawned spin-outs and spin offs and complementary growth (e.g. Data General, Prime) and today Intel, Cisco, IBM, EMC

DC's belt was entirely the creation of the Federal Gov't that began to site things such as Medical Centers (Bethesda), the Weather Bureau (Suitland), Air Force, Army, Navy, Census, IRS, etc., etc., etc. Only much later did MCI and the Discovery Channel have much to do with anything. Eventually all of these fostered lots of private investment to house entities supporting or directly benefiting from the Feds and the other foundation co's.

Today, there is a superficial similarity between the two regions (education, affluence) -- but there are also fundamental differences:

1) Boston basically grows its own (e.g. DEC, EMC, Staples, Biogen, Genzyme, Vertex, etc.) or attracts complementaries (e.g. Google, Microsoft, Amazon, Novartis, Pfizer, Merk, etc.)
2) DC still mostly either poaches or feeds off somewhere else (all of the defence contractors offices), or depends on the Feds directly (Federal Installations), and the "beltway bandits" and of course the tens of thousands of Federal Employees who need to shop and live somewhere.

 

[omaja]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

While clearly not responsible for all that 9% lift I bet they have the tools (and incentive) to show the policy works.

I think the e-fareboxes can tell them *when* (the time of day) all "new" (i.e newly-fareboxed) boardings occurred. They may be seeing extra growth at times the policy is in effect, and even at other times, they may be seeing a switch from cash to Card and from Card to Pass.

Both the new ridership during the front-door time and the payment-method shift can show that the new policy may have made the hit-or-miss "fare beating discount"s unattractive.

Depending on your ridership pattern, paying cash only when you're "caught" can be a bargain compared to carrying/using a Charlie Card.

Similarly paying by Charlie Card is better than a monthly pass if you aren't quite a daily commuter and you can exceed (even the) Card discount every once in a while by sneaking in the back door.

As your certainty of paying the fare goes up, it need not go to 100% to encourage you to adopt "more formal" discount programs. That's (probably) what's being measured.

I'm not betting they have anywhere near the sophisticated data collection nor proper modelling or analysis required to truly show that this policy has had any material difference to ridership. And they don't really need to, either.

Implementing the policy was a knee-jerk reaction to the whining of the public at the fare increase hearings. People kept complaining about fare evaders so they provided a zero-sum "solution".

I would think other factors, such as a residual influence from the spike in gas prices in April, would have had a greater impact. The weather in May this year was also much nicer than a year ago which would influence weekend and non-essential travel to a degree as well. Basically - could be anything while they are trying to spin it as "Gee, look, we're still increasing ridership and now it has to be because of our new policy - see, it's working!!"

Arlington -- That's an overly symplistic analysis

Bostons's belts were the product of innovation and private investment --perhaps fertilized by gov't contracts - -e.g. Raytheon, DEC, RCA, GE, etc.. -- these eventually spawned spin-outs and spin offs and complementary growth (e.g. Data General, Prime) and today Intel, Cisco, IBM, EMC

DC's belt was entirely the creation of the Federal Gov't that began to site things such as Medical Centers (Bethesda), the Weather Bureau (Suitland), Air Force, Army, Navy, Census, IRS, etc., etc., etc. Only much later did MCI and the Discovery Channel have much to do with anything. Eventually all of these fostered lots of private investment to house entities supporting or directly benefiting from the Feds and the other foundation co's.

Today, there is a superficial similarity between the two regions (education, affluence) -- but there are also fundamental differences:

1) Boston basically grows its own (e.g. DEC, EMC, Staples, Biogen, Genzyme, Vertex, etc.) or attracts complementaries (e.g. Google, Microsoft, Amazon, Novartis, Pfizer, Merk, etc.)
2) DC still mostly either poaches or feeds off somewhere else (all of the defence contractors offices), or depends on the Feds directly (Federal Installations), and the "beltway bandits" and of course the tens of thousands of Federal Employees who need to shop and live somewhere.

Can we create a thread just for you to respond to whatever post you want with whatever information you want to provide? That way we can keep all of this irrelevancy from cluttering every thread.

 

[Matthew]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

So these plans for GLX Somerville: how tall are the new buildings?

Have you seen the SomerVision plan BTW? Check out page 136.

 

[mass88]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Well, the Red Line picked a great day to have delays during rush hour. The amount of people packed into Park Street was just about at unsafe levels. The fact that two cars could not take passengers on one if the Brain tree trains was nice.

 

[Arlington]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Have you seen the SomerVision plan BTW? Check out page 136.

If Washington St (Brickbottom), Union Square, and Assembly Square are the only places that Somerville is willing to do "Transformational Mixed Use", then I think those are the only places that the Commonwealth should be paying to add transit to.

For every Lowell St and Ball Sq that the state spends $150m putting a station at (and all we get from Somerville is "Urban Residential") there is in some other jurisdiction a place that isn't getting its Transformational Mixed Use (e.g. Lynn Riverworks and Downtown Lynn, if they got the Blue Line, or, say the Rte 128/Amtrak station if it got frequent service the Indigo line)

I don't see why the state should spend big bucks and not get transformational development.

 

[Max Power]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

If Washington St (Brickbottom), Union Square, and Assembly Square are the only places that Somerville is willing to do "Transformational Mixed Use", then I think those are the only places that the Commonwealth should be paying to add transit to.

For every Lowell St and Ball Sq that the state spends $150m putting a station at (and all we get from Somerville is "Urban Residential") there is in some other jurisdiction a place that isn't getting its Transformational Mixed Use (e.g. Lynn Riverworks and Downtown Lynn, if they got the Blue Line, or, say the Rte 128/Amtrak station if it got frequent service the Indigo line)

I don't see why the state should spend big bucks and not get transformational development.

Not all benefits accrue in the area where there are new expansions. It's like a network effect- the more major destinations you're able to serve, the better utilized it will be across the board. Since this reaches an area with no current rapid transit, and a major university, I think this should be significant. Of course, this is impossible to quantify...

BTW I'm not arguing with you about the bells and whistles, I agree that this can be done much cheaper- but I also don't think we should cut short the entire extension because there won't be TOD sprouting at every single station. So long as there will be a decent amount at places like Brickbottom, I think it will be worthwhile.

As for Lynn, I believe an extension to Salem should've been done yesterday... but that's a different story for a different day.

 

[Matthew]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

I think their description of Urban Residential is OK:

Create, maintain, and enhance areas that are appropriate for multi-unit, mid-rise
residential uses in locations with good access to transportation and other services.

Devil's in the details of course, but I'm not height obsessive when it comes to density. Coverage is more important. And their example pictures seem to fit well. So if that's what they envision, things are looking good.

 

[Mark02474]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

What is the lesson to be learned from the existing subway stops which have not stimulated growth? I'm thinking some blue line and orange line stops. Lets fix those places and use the lessons when picking areas for expansion.

 

[Ron Newman]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Ball Square is quite densely built up on the Somerville side. Less so on the Medford side, so I'd expect most growth to occur in that direction. Obviously a Somerville planning document can't cover this.

 

[bbfen]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

What is the lesson to be learned from the existing subway stops which have not stimulated growth? I'm thinking some blue line and orange line stops. Lets fix those places and use the lessons when picking areas for expansion.

I'm hesitant to engage and encourage you but by what measure are subway stops successful at stimulating growth? Wait, when was the last time a new subway stop was added? Let's start there. Over what period should a new stop "return"? 5 years? 10? 30? 50? 100? How do you account for pressures external of the MBTA in your calculation? Should every subway stop have a central business district feel? Can't some subway stops dump in residential areas with a few small necessities nearby (bodega, pharmacy, camera stores) clustered near the stop? Is that less successful or contributatory to the common wealth of the service area?

 

[Mark02474]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

Investment performance standards need to be similar for public dollars. A bridge to nowhere is as wasteful as the same sum on a subway stop with similar usage and cost. I-495 brought great development, the Big Dig, not so much. New T stations at Porter, Davis, and Alewife improved those areas, making the Red Line the busiest. The Alewife parking garage takes cars off the road. Sadly, nothing similar is planned for the GLX to increase its value. In comparison to how added red line stops in the mid 80's, Blue and Orange line stop neighborhoods seem to have unrealized potential.

Adding stops to a subway line where few passengers get on or off has a real cost - it degrades service for everyone and adds to electric and other operational coasts. Longer lines tie up trains so fewer trips are possible with the same number of trains. Nobody wants longer slower rapid-transit for just a few passengers at a stop. The whole service loses its attraction compared to other travel modes.

So, there needs to be performance metrics for people served and economic stimulus when spending transit dollars. Otherwise we make poor use of scare financial resources. The same needs to be done for road projects. Do you first put $4,000 pedestrian scale streetlamps where there is high street crime or a Starbucks? Widen an uncongested sidewalk or widen a congested street?

 

[KentXie]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

What is the lesson to be learned from the existing subway stops which have not stimulated growth? I'm thinking some blue line and orange line stops. Lets fix those places and use the lessons when picking areas for expansion.

The only stop I can think of on the Orange Line is Community College due to the lack of direct bus service and density surrounding this station. The fact that they decided to run this heavy rail through the industrial park is one of my biggest annoyance about the Orange Line.

 

[datadyne007]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

The Quincy Center garage has been immediately closed for an indefinite amount of time due to questions about the structural integrity. The garage is the oldest in the system at 41 years.

 

[Mark02474]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

The only stop I can think of on the Orange Line is Community College due to the lack of direct bus service and density surrounding this station. The fact that they decided to run this heavy rail through the industrial park is one of my biggest annoyance about the Orange Line.

Two reactions:
1. Agreement. With much parking at stations beyond Community College, many riders are inconvenienced by that stop. During heavy commuting hours with more frequent trains, some trains should be designated expresses, skipping low load/unload stations. Starting from stop is what wastes the most energy and produces most pollution in trains, subways, buses, trucks, and cars. Pedestrians and cyclists have insignificant pollution increases from stopping and starting, as measured by CO2 output.
2. Rail lines and industrial parks are a symbiotic pairing. Factory jobs have disappeared faster along other rail lines, that's all.

 

[Mark02474]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

When assessing cities and towns by service provided, I left out parking facilities. License plate studies at parking facilities like Alewife have been done and can be done most places. The cities and towns being served by the parking can be billed. Its unfair to just bill the place with the lot. Parking studies don't have to be costly. Every 10th or 20th vehicle can be looked up, and on a 5 or 10 year basis, unless a reassessment is demanded and funded by a community.

Again, added revenue for the MBTA from parking fees to cities/towns incentivises the MBTA to provide more parking and reduce parking fees directly from users. Lower parking fees and more parking increases ridership, thus reducing cars on city streets. Capitalism can help solve problems. More carpooling to MBTA lots can help too...

If drivers leaving garages are not solo, they could be given a discount! Perhaps also in morning commuter hours - those entering could use a carpool lane next to the exit booth and get their parking ticket electronically notated as serving multiple riders. Parking fee collectors are typically less busy in the morning, so extra staff may not be needed.

My other ides for the T is to have a Gamblin' Charlie card. Every use includes a pull of the slot machine! Prizes are mostly constant per hour so chances go up when riders migrate to non-peak hours. Bells go off to announce a winner to other riders as advertisement. Winnings go to the card. Cards can be cashed out only at discount rates. Minors can't buy the higher trip rate gambling cards. The MBTA becomes the slot machine site for the state, ending political battles. Actual slot machines could be placed on water shuttles and perhaps commuter rail cars (1 car per train). Boston could be a trend setter!

 

[davem]

Re: Driven By Customer 'Service' Parte Dos

I-495 brought great development, the Big Dig, not so much.

I just have to jump in a second - I'm really tired of people knocking on the Big Dig. It was a horribly, horribly mismanaged and blown over budget project, and answers should be sought for its faults and waste. The surface section is still not perfect, but just like the Common has been since its conception, it can be reworked to fit users needs.

But, it was the right thing to do. Just as much as putting it through in the first place was the wrong thing to do. I drove through it end to end for the first time in a while the other day and I was in awe of how great a thing it was.

100 years from now the cost and old issues will be forgotten, but people will look at it as a great thing. Every time I'm downtown and the artery isn't still hulking itself across our city it's a great thing. The people using it this weekend thought it was a great thing, both driving underground and recreating above. I'm mad as hell about the costs and corruption, but in the end the net benefit was absolutely positive.