Herald Square | 385 Congress St | Portland

Good god. Combined with the Chestnut Street Lofts and the back of the Merrill Auditorium, that's going to be an awful stretch when viewing this the I-295 side of the peninsula.

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nomc said:
I'm confused by the elevations - why is the Cumberland view shorter than the Pearl/Myrtle elevations? Is Lot 3 not the one the stretches along Cumberland?
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It looks like this would only occupy the corner of the block, and not extend all the way to Pearl Street. That would explain why the "Pearl" elevation is a big blank wall, which otherwise wouldn't be allowed in Portland's zoning code.

Similarly, the blank ground-floor wall on the "Congress" elevation of the building will probably abut the ground-floor garage of the hotel that's been approved for the southern corner of the block, although it's odd that they're not showing any connection between the two garages through that wall (which IIRC was part of the master plan approval, and would allow for a more efficient parking layout inside).

Judging by the third-floor doors on these elevations, it looks like they might be planning an extension of the hotel's rooftop courtyard.

This "break up the massing with some random fake bay windows" kind of design is beginning to feel very dated.
 
They received a "framework plan" approval, which allows some wiggle room but still requires some additional review for specific projects inside that framework before they break ground. My hunch is that if this proposal were bigger than the building in the framework plan it might be an issue, but since this proposal is smaller, it's probably in conformance.

The Portland Co. project did something similar – the approved framework plan from 5-6 years ago proposed more housing units than the specific building proposals that have come out more recently, although it was a less dramatic difference in appearance than there is in this case.
 
Cosakita18 said:
Had to dig a bit for this, but found some elevations.

Some words I'd use are: "exceptionally average" and "breathtakingly nondescript"

View attachment 46674
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So this is for the back corner facing Cumberland?

And so the blank walls are what will be built against by the Hotel and Condos facing Congress?

What is going where the Portland Pay and Spray is in the top corner (Cumberland & Pearl)?
 
DanielPWM19 said:
So this is for the back corner facing Cumberland?

And so the blank walls are what will be built against by the Hotel and Condos facing Congress?

What is going where the Portland Pay and Spray is in the top corner (Cumberland & Pearl)?
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This is what I'm wondering - originally Lot 3 was 1/3 of the block and fronted Cumberland, Pearl and Myrtle. The red box above is to scale based on dimensions on the elevations, so how does the latest hotel plan fit with this?
 
Cosakita18 said:
Had to dig a bit for this, but found some elevations.

Some words I'd use are: "exceptionally average" and "breathtakingly nondescript"

View attachment 46674
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Uninspired architecture, straight out of an application. No one went to architectural school for this. This is a re-use from Anywhere, USA, saving some money. Market Square Architects from TX/NH/MO? Maybe they should have hired a company from ME that cares about Portland. What a missed opportunity.
 
I have a growing feeling that this project is a mess behind the scenes.

about a month ago , Fathom quietly applied for an extension of their Site Plan approval for the Phase 1 hotel...


Now, the entire MDP has changed to accommodate this new affordable housing project.
Looking into the timeline a bit, the affordable housing project needs to have FULL site plan approval by the end of March in order to meet the deadline for MaineHousing LIHTC financing....(Bear in mind, they just submitted their application to the planning office this week....probably 2 months after they should have submitted if they had such a hard deadline)

It seems like the applicant team is scrambling through site design because this wasn't actually part of th plan. They've made this change to the MDP at the 11th hour because Joe Dasco decided he'd rather meet inclusionary zoning by providing the units rather than doing fee-in-lieu.
 
Perhaps Dasco was able to get a Fed subsidy for this affordable housing part. Mills just promised to pay rents for up to two years for migrants to live in a new housing project that was finished in Brunswick, and so that is from federal or state money. It was all over the wire reports and Fox News, with some of the new "renters" embarrassed by the lavish conditions. Even 50 Cent on his Instagram was peeved over it.
 
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TC_zoid said:
Perhaps Dasco was able to get a Fed subsidy for this affordable housing part. Mills just promised to pay rents for up to two years for migrants to live in a new housing project that was finished in Brunswick, and so that is from federal or state money. It was all over the wire reports and Fox News, with some of the new "renters" embarrassed by the lavish conditions. Even 50 Cent on his Instagram was peeved over it.
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"I saw it on Fox News" is quite a self-own, so here's some more credible information about the MaineHousing program in Brunswick:
https://www.pressherald.com/2023/05/15/hundreds-of-asylum-seekers-apply-for-brunswick-housing/

The reason the state financed the project this way is because they'd been spending much, much more money on hotel rooms during the pandemic. Paying rent is a lot cheaper (and more useful) than paying for a new homeless shelter. Beyond that, there's a robust body of economic evidence that asylum-seekers pay back more considerably more in taxes within 20 years than they receive during their first few years of arrival. In a state with severe labor shortages, this is one of the strongest economic development investments that Governor Mills can make.
https://www.nber.org/digest/aug17/what-happens-when-refugees-come-united-states

I follow housing finance pretty closely and there's been no public discussion of any similar kind of subsidy for this project here in Portland. IIRC the state used pandemic relief funds for the Brunswick project, and those are pretty much tapped out by this point.

As @Cosakita18 said, there's an upcoming deadline for tax credit applications at MaineHousing, so developers are putting in applications now. Because this project has a Framework Plan approval in hand it stands a better chance of getting its approvals in time to meet the MaineHousing deadline, but we'll see.
 
cneal said:
"I saw it on Fox News" is quite a self-own, so here's some more credible information about the MaineHousing program in Brunswick:
https://www.pressherald.com/2023/05/15/hundreds-of-asylum-seekers-apply-for-brunswick-housing/

The reason the state financed the project this way is because they'd been spending much, much more money on hotel rooms during the pandemic. Paying rent is a lot cheaper (and more useful) than paying for a new homeless shelter. Beyond that, there's a robust body of economic evidence that asylum-seekers pay back more considerably more in taxes within 20 years than they receive during their first few years of arrival. In a state with severe labor shortages, this is one of the strongest economic development investments that Governor Mills can make.
https://www.nber.org/digest/aug17/what-happens-when-refugees-come-united-states

I follow housing finance pretty closely and there's been no public discussion of any similar kind of subsidy for this project here in Portland. IIRC the state used pandemic relief funds for the Brunswick project, and those are pretty much tapped out by this point.

As @Cosakita18 said, there's an upcoming deadline for tax credit applications at MaineHousing, so developers are putting in applications now. Because this project has a Framework Plan approval in hand it stands a better chance of getting its approvals in time to meet the MaineHousing deadline, but we'll see.
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I don't think this will be a justification when the buses start arriving. I was working and living in Manhattan not long ago, and my friends there say the situation is untenable. It's also not a good idea with so many Mainers on affordable housing lists, to do this. I didn't see the Fox News piece, though there is a valid point in it, I would assume. The dumb thing about this program is not allowing the men to work because a man's self-worth and confidence largely comes from that. Sitting in a nice apartment for much of the time without anything to do perhaps compels someone to use drugs, and that kind of lifestyle is conducive to "finding" money to keep it going.
 
cneal said:
"I saw it on Fox News" is quite a self-own....
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Not necessarily. Go on something like msn and you'll typically see stories from all sources. Different sources often report things that others won't. If you insist on only getting your news from the far left, you eventually lose the balance and suddenly become "surprised" about things like the migrant crisis. Here's a screenshot of what I'm talking about.

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TC_zoid said:
I don't think this will be a justification when the buses start arriving. I was working and living in Manhattan not long ago, and my friends there say the situation is untenable. It's also not a good idea with so many Mainers on affordable housing lists, to do this. I didn't see the Fox News piece, though there is a valid point in it, I would assume. The dumb thing about this program is not allowing the men to work because a man's self-worth and confidence largely comes from that. Sitting in a nice apartment for much of the time without anything to do perhaps compels someone to use drugs, and that kind of lifestyle is conducive to "finding" money to keep it going.
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Just to see how shameful this all is, I looked up the group that I believe should be first on EVERY list for housing like this. Estimated 243 of them in Maine. They should be the ones to get the Brunswick housing, not non-Americans. Non Americans should go to the very back of the line until we take care of our own. Those who came in illegally should be sent back where they came from. Americans can't support the rest of the world when we can't even support our own citizens. It's not just a slap in the face, it's a literal betrayal.

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Another point to make in the immigrant crisis is what compels them to leave their homes of birth and come here literally with the clothes on their backs. It must be horrible there, because when push comes to shove, it's that. We probably can take some blame in this, allowing these countries to create de facto political dictatorships and thus disallowing freedom, like opening your own business and making a decent living (Venezuela). We all know some of these people, and I for one, can sympathize, but we will be brought down too if the floodgates aren't raised or monitored. You can't save the world, but you can do a part.
 
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