Logan Airport Flights and Airlines Discussion

Massport has a history with paying not overwhelming sums of money to make things easier for people - remember their defense of getting rid of the WiFi fee? I think he said that they just didn't think the added income was worth the inconvenience to passengers, so they dumped it (for a sponsored system that still brought some ad money, but still).
 
Peterborough said:
Work in the aviation field (sorta), doubt that airlines will end up paying for the Silver Line fare in the end, more likely is that MassPort is just eating it in the meantime with the idea that easier to get into and our of Logan, more desirable the airport is, the more money they make off departure/landing fees regardless.

With Southwest/AirTran combo TF Green will probably have 50% fewer flights into it 5 years from now even with the Commuter Rail connection. Logan actually now has almost as many flights as it did in the early 2000s pre-bankruptcies and 9-11, so MassPort itself is doing fairly well in terms of Logan. JetBlue continues to grow, and although US Air and American have pulled down capacity, Delta is adding some back now in addition to even more international flights.

Peterborough
http://www.bostontipster.com
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PeterB -- Welcome to the Forum

I think the motivation is too many complaints of people fumbling while boarding the Silver Line -- looking for money or a Charlie Card, etc. -- delaying everything

The kiosks apparently were not working out -- perhaps because of travel fatigue

This also allows all the doors to be used for boarding -- just like the shuttle between terminals and to the Blue Line -- I think it is a win for eveyone
 
whighlander said:
PeterB -- Welcome to the Forum

I think the motivation is too many complaints of people fumbling while boarding the Silver Line -- looking for money or a Charlie Card, etc. -- delaying everything

The kiosks apparently were not working out -- perhaps because of travel fatigue

This also allows all the doors to be used for boarding -- just like the shuttle between terminals and to the Blue Line -- I think it is a win for eveyone
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Thanks for the welcome,

Yeah it makes sense and the silver line was always such a mess that I usually took the blue to avoid the lines and delays.

As somebody else pointed out though there is now no reason to take the blue line shuttle anymore since the Silver line will be free and deliver you directly into South Station where the subway will be free as well. Sure maybe the blue line is more efficient, but if I can save the $2.00 by taking the silver line I'll do that all day long.

I know recently the Silver Line was free from the convention center to Logan, I'm wondering who was paying for that. Did the MBTA do that and just make it free to ease the ability of the convention traffic to get to the airport, or is the convention center subsidizing all of those trips? It seems that is a similar situation and I'd be interested in knowing the economics and whether it's a MBTA expense or covered by the other party (ie Massport and Convention Center).

Peterborough
http://www.bostontipster.com
 
Peterborough said:
Thanks for the welcome,

Yeah it makes sense and the silver line was always such a mess that I usually took the blue to avoid the lines and delays.

As somebody else pointed out though there is now no reason to take the blue line shuttle anymore since the Silver line will be free and deliver you directly into South Station where the subway will be free as well. Sure maybe the blue line is more efficient, but if I can save the $2.00 by taking the silver line I'll do that all day long.

I know recently the Silver Line was free from the convention center to Logan, I'm wondering who was paying for that. Did the MBTA do that and just make it free to ease the ability of the convention traffic to get to the airport, or is the convention center subsidizing all of those trips? It seems that is a similar situation and I'd be interested in knowing the economics and whether it's a MBTA expense or covered by the other party (ie Massport and Convention Center).

Peterborough
http://www.bostontipster.com
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PeterB -- Massport is the likely candidate for that one also -- as Massport is the only one of these various Alphabet Soup of Authorities with an independent source of money not directly involving a hand-out from the legislature -- the rest run at a deficit or at best break even
 
whighlander said:
PeterB -- Massport is the likely candidate for that one also -- as Massport is the only one of these various Alphabet Soup of Authorities with an independent source of money not directly involving a hand-out from the legislature -- the rest run at a deficit or at best break even
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Yeah that's true, judging by their tagline at the end of this article: http://www.massport.com/news-room/News/LoganPassengersRideFareFreeontheSilverLine.aspx

Which says:
The Massachusetts Port Authority (Massport) owns and operates Boston Logan International Airport, public terminals in the Port of Boston, Hanscom Field and Worcester Regional Airport. Massport is a financially self-sustaining public authority whose premier transportation facilities generate more than $8 billion annually, and enhance and enable economic growth and vitality in New England. No state tax dollars are used to fund operations or capital improvements at Massport facilities.
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Doesn't spell it out but pretty much the lack of MBTA mention means MassPort/MassDOT is footing the bill. Which is good, hopefully it does increase Silver Line usage. Maybe a good side effect of this will be to dramatically increase the number of SL1 buses at peak times. More ridership will force more buses. Often on Friday and Sunday evenings the buses are packed and you have to wait until another comes due to the number of people going to and from the airport.

Peterborough
http://www.bostontipster.com
 
When I first came here in the 1970s, the MBTA ran the bus service between the airport terminals and the Blue Line, and you had to pay a fare to board it (I think 25 cents).
 
Tombstoner said:
Thanks for this report. I am a bit disappointed that the experience wasn't any more significant improvement over the status quo. :(

My butt is on these planes in cattle class so often I really need to hang on to the illusion that the experience might be getting better.
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Yeah, not a major upgrade, but certainly an upgrade. To be fair, the long haul flights tend to be much better, even in economy, then domestic flights. Especially the longer domestic flights (east-west and vice versa). I fly Boston- Bay Area nonstop quite a bit and I'd almost rather spend more than double the time in economy going from Boston to Japan than Boston to San Francisco.


As far as the Blue Line Shuttle, I think more highly of it now than I used to. I fly into Oakland occasionally and they charge more than $3 for their airBART shuttle to the station. Big ripoff. However, free Silver Line to S.S. will certainly get my business as well.
 
Lrfox said:
As far as the Blue Line Shuttle, I think more highly of it now than I used to. I fly into Oakland occasionally and they charge more than $3 for their airBART shuttle to the station. Big ripoff. However, free Silver Line to S.S. will certainly get my business as well.
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Even worse is flying into JFK in NY and it's $5 for a 10 minute air shuttle ride so you can pay either another $2.25 for the subway into Manhattan or $7 for the LIRR into Penn.

Peterborough
http://www.bostontipster.com
 
The stats are out for April. Through the first 4 months of the year, passenger numbers at Logan are up over 4% to over 8.9 million.
 
Has there been any talk on when construction will begin in earnest on the Terminal B renovation? It looks like there's been some work going on at that end of the building lately however my understanding is that it's just very preliminary light demo.
 
Peterborough said:
More ridership will force more buses.
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Eh, that's not good. The Transitway buses are one of a kind, to the degree that the R&D on them helped bankrupt the manufacturer.

Nobody currently makes them, and good luck getting anyone to agree to do a custom run of a dozen or so buses that don't exist on any drawing board.

I doubt diesel would work all that well in the cramped Transitway, CNG buses wouldn't fare much better, and they have the added bonus of not being allowed in the Ted Williams (fears of CNG collecting at the ceiling). Nobody is going to let the T string wire to the airport.

The only certain thing is that more Silver Line traffic will ensure the roadway breaks down even more rapidly than we've already seen.
 
Didn't know that about the designer/manufacturer that's pretty interesting. I guess in an ideal world they would replace the silver line SL4 and SL5 that goes through Chinatown and Dudley Sq area with an actual subway system rather than the silver line but that's asking a lot of the MBTA which can't even pay for essential maintenance.

The one thing that probably would be better and what they should have done in the first place is instead of the silver line and the blue line shuttle buses would be to add a monorail/train system within Logan that connects all the terminals together and the blue line. Spruce up the blue line station at the airport, and suddenly you have a world class system that works best for everybody.

Of course who knows what that would have cost vs. the cost of the silver line.

Peterborough
http://www.bostontipster.com
 
I use the Silver Line every time I fly into Logan! Silver Line to South Station then commuter rail to Bridgewater! Can't beat it! And now Silver Line is gonna be free to SS from Logan? WooHoo! Free is my favorite 4-letter F word!
 
Peterborough said:
Didn't know that about the designer/manufacturer that's pretty interesting. I guess in an ideal world they would replace the silver line SL4 and SL5 that goes through Chinatown and Dudley Sq area with an actual subway system rather than the silver line but that's asking a lot of the MBTA which can't even pay for essential maintenance.

The one thing that probably would be better and what they should have done in the first place is instead of the silver line and the blue line shuttle buses would be to add a monorail/train system within Logan that connects all the terminals together and the blue line. Spruce up the blue line station at the airport, and suddenly you have a world class system that works best for everybody.

Of course who knows what that would have cost vs. the cost of the silver line.

Peterborough
http://www.bostontipster.com
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PeterB -- that's all ancient history:
The ideas-- Considered originally by various entities -- but lack of coordination between the Alphabet Soup of Authorities connected with transportation doomed anything integrated
The discussion within this and other threads in the forum

By the way -- the Blue Line Station is brand-new circa the completion of the Big Dig -- you should have seen its predecessor -- big mistake was where it ended-up being located

The other problem with the Blue Line connection is that lacking a Red/Blue interconnect -- it would still be ineffecient for most Red Line potential users
 
atlantaden said:
I use the Silver Line every time I fly into Logan! Silver Line to South Station then commuter rail to Bridgewater! Can't beat it! And now Silver Line is gonna be free to SS from Logan? WooHoo! Free is my favorite 4-letter F word!
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AtlantaD -- Silver Line could be ideal -- its not bad now

What it needs is to [in order of importance -- not necessarily immediate feasibility]:

1) Dig under D Street to connect South Station to Silver Line Way with a Tunnel
2) Connect Silver Line Way to the Ted Williams Tunnel without requiring any travel on streets -- that enables South Station to a terminal at Logan without having to deal with local traffic
3) New Logan Special Silver Line buses -- specifically designed for effecient hauling passengers with baggage to/ from Logan, South Station and the rest of the T System
4) Make Silver Line Way and Court House into real stations much like Harvard2 with multiple Silver Line branches
5) Provide a mostly underground SL link to BCEC -- as part of the proposed enhancements
 
Note -- Legislature seems ready to dump the ferry service to Boston from the south shore into the hands of Massport

Under the bill, the Department of Transportation would be required by July 9 to report back to the Legislature on the time required to prepare for sale to the port authority in fiscal 2013 of ferry properties in Quincy, Hingham and Charlestown, including commuter boat service piers.

MassDOT would also be required to report by August 13 on the procedural requirements to transfer operation and ownership of the commuter boats “Lightning” and “Flying Cloud” to Massport during fiscal 2013, and Massport would have until August 31 to develop and present a plan to take over ferry operations.
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Massport Budget for new FY

Exemplifies the clear distinction between Massport and MBTA

From the Massport website press release
Massport Sets Fiscal Year 2013 Operating Budget of $380.4 Million

Revenues of $578 Million Will Also Fund $197 Million in Debt and in Maintenance Programs

BOSTON – The Massachusetts Port Authority (Massport) today voted to approve a Business Plan and Operating Budget for Fiscal Year 2013 of $380.4 million. The budget represents a 1 percent decrease from the current year’s FY 12 operating expense budget.

After operating costs – which include more than $18 million in payments in lieu of taxes to Boston and Winthrop – the Authority will spend $101 million on debt service and $60 million maintaining its facilities in a good state of repair. Massport is required by its trust agreements to budget one percent of the value of its assets for maintenance. The Authority also added $37 million to the FY12-16 capital program approved in February.

“This budget and business plan recognizes the critical operating and infrastructure investment needs for Massachusetts citizens, businesses and customers,” said Richard Davey, Chairman of the Massport Board and Secretary of Transportation for the Commonwealth. “It mixes the fiscal caution needed in an uncertain economy with a bedrock commitment to providing excellent customer service, safety and security and new ways to promote high occupancy vehicle trips to and from Boston Logan International Airport.’’...

“This fully funded spending plan reflects the steady but very modest growth as the airline industry works through some consolidations, bankruptcy filings, and the sluggish national economy,” said Interim CEO and Executive Director David S. Mackey. “Despite these headwinds we expect passenger levels will reach a new all-time high, setting yet another record at Logan Airport. This budget also adjusts to the lower container volumes at Conley Terminal as contractions in world shipping cause a global slowdown and is fully funded without any state tax dollar support.”

Budget reductions include the elimination of nearly $20 million in planned expenses from last year due to the loss of Suez service at Conley terminal and commercial activity at Worcester Airport. Massport also eliminated operating costs to manage airport parking during the recently completed Terminal B garage rehabilitation program, and lower utility expenses due to favorable natural gas prices.
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Bottom Line -- they had more revenues than sum of both operations and debt service -- enough to set aside money for maintenance and improvements

and presumably through the "free Silver Line" and the aquisiton of the T's Ferry business -- money to help the T as well
 
ConRaC main building has topped-out


401904_10150902618537981_1887743955_n.jpg


Garage to come

Whole thing to open next year -- somehow that timetable seems more consistent with the private sector than a gov't agency
 
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