MA Casino Developments

TheRifleman said:
Yeah....That industry is such a positive influence on Detriots society that it is growing and flourishing the community with other businesses like HardcorePawn which has become a TV SHOW.

The citizens of Detriot pawn their possessions to take a shot at the Downtown Detriot Casino.

Thats Great Innovation from the Casino industry. The domino affect.
Drugs, Rape, Abandoned houses, single mothers........Seriously, Nothing better than Casinos for that area.
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I was referring to the failure of the auto industry and its manufacturing spin-offs...

Yes, the Detroit casino was built with the hope that it would revitalize the downtown. Yes, it failed to do so. Then again, so did the other downtown revitalization project of the time...Ford Field. Downtown Detroit was already a dump before the casino was built, and its ludicrous to blame the city's problems with "drugs, rape, and abandoned houses" on the casino, when you know, 40+ years of economic collapse preceded it.

What will be interesting to see is whether Cleveland's new casino will have a different impact on the city than Detroit's. Similar cities, similar siting of the casino relative to downtown, similar surrounding economic draw, but no attached hotel and limits on the amenities offered in the casino itself...

In any case, Suffolk Downs is a terrible location for a casino that frankly I'd rather do without.
 
underground said:
Sorry, I'm not following. What about the casinos? Seems to me A) they exist and B) those places haven't fallen apart because of them, so what's the big deal?
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You could say the same thing about oil refineries in Houston, but I wouldn't recommend putting one in Eastie.

Saying other cities have survived urban casinos doesn't mean it's the highest and best use for Suffolk Downs. All the casinos that I'm familiar with on the list that I posted are dumps and seem to attract more lower/middle class locals rather than act as a true destination.
 
Saying other cities have survived urban casinos doesn't mean it's the highest and best use for Suffolk Downs.
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Possibly, but generally in a free country it's left up to the land owner to decide what's best. I mean, outside of building a nuclear plant or similar.

All the casinos that I'm familiar with on the list that I posted are dumps and seem to attract more lower/middle class locals rather than act as a true destination.
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Well, luckily it's A) a small sample size and B) not exactly indicative of what any casino will be like in the future. Take a look at New Orleans. That city's got a laundry list of EPIC issues. But their casino, right downtown, is very nice.
 
underground said:
Possibly, but generally in a free country it's left up to the land owner to decide what's best. I mean, outside of building a nuclear plant or similar.

Well, luckily it's A) a small sample size and B) not exactly indicative of what any casino will be like in the future. Take a look at New Orleans. That city's got a laundry list of EPIC issues. But their casino, right downtown, is very nice.
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Because "a nuclear plant or similar" has negative externalities. Just like a casino.

New Orleans is one I haven't been too. If they've done it well there, that gives me some hope.
 
Said it before -- the way to do this is to allow virtually unlimited casinos. We shouldn't be assigning an oligarchy of fat, rich bastards to own 2 or 3 casinos in pre-conceived mega-plot locations. The way this is being set up now is guaranteeing the bad effects.
 
I can understand, although I disagree, why one would not want a casnio nearby b/c of all the comotion. Although Suffolk Downs isn't exactly quite either. But this moral issue is bullshit, as is that Mass economy will now be a gaming based economy. Conn is still the same state it allways was and bars and liquors stores are no more damaging to society than a casino. So if its truely a moral delema, than you better put them and strip clubs on your cross hairs as well. Otherwise your opposition aint changing shit.
 
underground said:
Possibly, but generally in a free country it's left up to the land owner to decide what's best. I mean, outside of building a nuclear plant or similar.
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Its a free country........Gambling was illegal in this state until a small group of dictators decided that they needed union jobs to help for their re-election bids.

(The casino process might be more rigged than the entire Romney GOP nomination against Ron Paul.)

#1 I think the citizens of Mass should be voting if they want casinos in the state, not the political hacks with their own personal agendas.
#2 Seaport would be a better location than Suffolk for the casino. That area has more out of towners than townies living there.
#3 They couldn't even keep Revere Beach open past 9 O'Clock before enforcing people to leave in this area. Now we have 24Hour casino open for all the Lynn, Eastie, Revere, Everett, Saugus, Winthrop Degenerates.

The Pawn Shops will probably clean up when this happens.
Mayor Menino Innovation.
 
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Isn't a press release with new renders supposed to be hitting the internets sometime around now?
 
Suffolk Downs officials unveil plans for $1b gambling resort
By Mark Arsenault and Martin Finucane | Globe Staff June 05, 2012



suffolk_casino1.jpg


http://bostonglobe.com/metro/2012/06/05/suffolk/6rIgpNBMsChDSQiOVWffJL/story.html
 
GW2500 said:
I can understand, although I disagree, why one would not want a casnio nearby b/c of all the comotion. Although Suffolk Downs isn't exactly quite either. But this moral issue is bullshit, as is that Mass economy will now be a gaming based economy. Conn is still the same state it allways was and bars and liquors stores are no more damaging to society than a casino. So if its truely a moral delema, than you better put them and strip clubs on your cross hairs as well. Otherwise your opposition aint changing shit.
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Suffolk downs just had their opening day and attracted 6,000+. More than 80,000 people daily visit Foxwoods and Mohegan Sun (combined). So I don't think it's really comparable.

And your right about Connecticut being the same state that it always was. But Connecticut focused on destination casinos. Specifically away from urban centers. My concern lies with Boston and specifically East Boston.
 
AmericanFolkLegend said:
Underground, pick out the nice one below.
Note, this could be a trick question.

Metropolitan Areas with Urban Gaming
(Greater than 500K people, casino is within 20 miles of geographic center of metropolitan area)

Albuquerque, New Mexico 4 Indian Casinos
Chicago, Illinois 4 Riverboats
Detroit, Michigan 3 Landbased
Ft. Lauderdale, Florida 3 Indian Casinos
Kansas City, Missouri 4 Riverboats
Milwaukee, Wisconsin 1 Indian Casino
Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota 1 Indian Casino
Oakland/San Francisco, California 1 Indian Casino
Oklahoma City, Oklahoma 2 Indian Casinos
Phoenix, Arizona 4 Indian Casinos
Sacramento, California 1 Indian Casino
San Bernardino/Riverside, California 1 Indian Casino
San Diego, California 1 Indian Casino
St. Louis, Missouri 5 Riverboats
Tampa, Florida 1 Indian Casino
Tucson, Arizona 3 Indian Casinos
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What about New Orleans? They have a Harrahs Casino right in downtown.
 
Shepard said:
Suffolk Downs Casino will be terrible for Eastie and Revere, even if it isn't a disaster for Boston overall. If this were conceived for the Seaport as a high-end waterfront casino with high-end entertainment and restaurants targeting tourists and conventioneers, I would see this as far more positive overall for the city's vitality. Sticking this out there at shabby Suffolk Downs is just asking for trouble.
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Shep -- the area around Suffolk is already nicer than the SPID was back in the 1970's when talk of the Megaplex (domed stadium and convention center with giant hotel) was all the rage. Unsolicited at the time Steve Wynn offered to build the Megaplex for no cost to the city if he could have a casino

Thankfully the Megaplex never happened and we will have the SPID instead -- I agree that a casino would still make sense in the immediate proximity to the BCEC - but that will not now happen

Instead I think that in twenty years after some improvements to transportation there could be a whole new entertainment oriented district centered on Suffolk Rev 2.0 -- not a SPID, but nothing like what Riff describes
 
Whighlander,
These are my stomping grounds......Chelsea, Everett, Revere, Malden, Saugus, East Boston, Lynn, Winthrop...... I know what type of people live here. These are the last surviving true Bostonians since the 70's.
#1 Hardworking Very Good-- Blue Collared People
#2 Immigrants w-Families
#3 Drug Dealers/Drunks
#4 Gambling degenerates (We might be the capital)
#5 Gangs
#6 Limited College Kids/some white collar
This type of demographic group will not do well with a Billion dollar casino in Revere/East Boston.
#3,#4 #5 will thrive in this area.......That is why they had to shutdown Revere Beach right before it gets dark. They will not let people hang-out there. Rough crowd.

The Traffic is a nightmare already so I really don't know what they would really improve to make the congestion tolerable.

Will it be that bad? Probably not. But I'm not willing to take the chance.

The Seaport would be more safe because the out-of towners living there are more educated have money already and gambling isn't there solution to their personal problems.
 
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AmericanFolkLegend said:
Suffolk downs just had their opening day and attracted 6,000+. More than 80,000 people daily visit Foxwoods and Mohegan Sun (combined). So I don't think it's really comparable.

And your right about Connecticut being the same state that it always was. But Connecticut focused on destination casinos. Specifically away from urban centers. My concern lies with Boston and specifically East Boston.
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AMF -- various semi-dead cities in CT wanted things like jai lai parlors (Bridgeport) -- the Indians got there first and built on their own tribal lands located well away from most of the citiies - that's the only reason why Foxwoods and Mohegan Sun are in the midest of the woods

Contrary to Riff -- I've seen casinos in several world class cities and I've not found evidence for Riff's silly concerns about zombie-gamblers searching for barrels and bags to cover their naked bodies as they desparately look for another place to sell blood or hair from their armpits. The crowd that just wants to gamble and go broke can do that at Suffolk now or at a local Keno parlor / betting store selling lottary tickets -- which they do.

Build a nice -- high-end casino and the convention crowd will come, some people coming to Boston for history and such might stop in and throw some dice. There just might be few nice restaurants and perhaps some outlet mall shopping as well.

I think that done right -- with proper attention paid to the transportation issues both for vistiors and workers and it can be a winner.
 
Conventioneers and tourists are probably not going to end up here in droves, especially if it's a 10 minute walk from the T (as the site plan shows), out of the way of everything else, and looks like the Natick Mall with slightly better landscaping.
 
Maybe they'll consider extending the Silver Line to the race track. If it'll create that many jobs and attract that many visitors, I suspect it would make smart planning sense to extend the line. And if they ever decide to construct additional hotel rooms onsite, a silver line extension would bode well for BCEC patrons looking to stay/play at Caesar's.
 
dshoost88 said:
Maybe they'll consider extending the Silver Line to the race track. If it'll create that many jobs and attract that many visitors, I suspect it would make smart planning sense to extend the line. And if they ever decide to construct additional hotel rooms onsite, a silver line extension would bode well for BCEC patrons looking to stay/play at Caesar's.
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Unless it is a free exclusive shuttle for conventioneers without all the city riff raff, no one will use it. They would never do that, would they?
 
TheRifleman said:
Whighlander,
These are my stomping grounds......Chelsea, Everett, Revere, Malden, Saugus, East Boston, Lynn, Winthrop...... I know what type of people live here. These are the last surviving true Bostonians since the 70's.
#1 Hardworking Very Good-- Blue Collared People
#2 Immigrants w-Families
#3 Drug Dealers/Drunks
#4 Gambling degenerates (We might be the capital)
#5 Gangs
#6 Limited College Kids/some white collar
This type of demographic group will not do well with a Billion dollar casino in Revere/East Boston.
#3,#4 #5 will thrive in this area.......That is why they had to shutdown Revere Beach right before it gets dark. They will not let people hang-out there. Rough crowd.

The Traffic is a nightmare already so I really don't know what they would really improve to make the congestion tolerable.

Will it be that bad? Probably not. But I'm not willing to take the chance.

The Seaport would be more safe because the out-of towners living there are more educated more a less have money already and gambling isn't there solution to their personal problems.
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Riff the Caersar's folks will be the operartor of the hotel and casino part of the complex -- they are very very good at what they do - dare say World Class

None of 3,4, 5 will play a major role in the operations or inded be on the premises for long

Instead you will see a lot of opportunity for the blue collar -- who don't have much to do these days in a place with of the few blue collar traditional industries. Sure there will be some people who are gambling a significant portion of their disgetionary income -- but they already do such in places closer to home as well as the existing Suffolk (and even more so at the former Wonderland dog track)

the only part of their program which I think is soft so far is how to deal with the transportation issues and also why is the hotel so small. Although I don't think that if this thing is as successful as could be -- there can always be more rooms added in a second hotel on the complex
 
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