MBTA Red Line / Blue Line Connector

[George_Apley]

There are lots of rumblings happening right now amongst folks in East Boston, Winthrop and elsewhere along the BL to make this project happen. While cognizant of the project's shelved status, it's believed to have been shelved more due to political reasoning rather than from any lack of merit as a major transportation improvement.

http://www.winthroptranscript.com/20...line-connector

It's bleeding obvious that it was shelved for political reasons (and financial reasons stemming from political budgeting). It's merit as a transportation improvement is self-evident. It's kind of sad that it's even suggested that this project lacks merit...

 

[sm89]

The least they could do is bring the Winthrop buses in-house so that people could use their passes on them (or make them Charlie compatible). It makes no sense that a town that borders the City has to pay twice to use transit.

 

[George_Apley]

The least they could do is bring the Winthrop buses in-house so that people could use their passes on them (or make them Charlie compatible). It makes no sense that a town that borders the City has to pay twice to use transit.

Now that's a reasonable transit pitch if I've ever heard one.

 

[anthonyx26]

It's bleeding obvious that it was shelved for political reasons (and financial reasons stemming from political budgeting). It's merit as a transportation improvement is self-evident. It's kind of sad that it's even suggested that this project lacks merit...

On the financial side, it's always easy for politicians to blame lack of money when it's projects they don't want to see happen, while other projects seem flush with funding despite questionable merit (other than as a vote getting mechanism).

 

[underground]

It's a little strange that the Speaker of the House is from Winthrop, and yet MassDOT's about to drop funding for the study. What's the world coming to when a MA Speaker can't even get some illicit pork for a STUDY?

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

On the financial side, it's always easy for politicians to blame lack of money when it's projects they don't want to see happen, while other projects seem flush with funding despite questionable merit (other than as a vote getting mechanism).

This one is--more than any other--subject to change on the political backing front. The Seaport transit improvements pu-pu platter recently floated is a bunch of little things that don't fundamentally change the situation out there. More a hail-mary to stretch limited funds to cushion the blow of the BCEC's growth against the half-finished and poorly thought-out infrastructure of the area.

BCEC knows this, and knows what kind of congestion it's in for with all traffic still having to run through South Station (which has exploding growth coming from every other angle too) and through the looming paralysis on Red and the overloaded DTX and Park St. transfers. Transitway-Downtown doesn't even have a firm conceptual routing, much less a firm mode of transit, given the infeasibility of SL Phase III. At most deleriously optimistic that's 2 decades and a billion dollars away because of the engineering-from-scratch. So as long as they are dependent on the Red Line threading 80% of the Seaport's transit traffic...Red-Blue is the #1 most dramatic load-reliever that'll save DTX, Park, and SS congestion for the duration of their Red-only dependency.


I would suspect, since the BCEC folks are smarter than the average BRA drone, that they're going to be looking further afield given the slim pickings for short- and mid-term Seaport transit improvements and start focusing more squarely on the Red Line's problems. Especially with them having their finger in SS expansion. If they start barking that this one needs to be picked back up so it can be done sooner...and pounding the desk that it can be done sooner--you'll see a lot more pols a lot closer to the city start talking it up. I'm waiting for Walsh to throw his weight behind it because that'll be the telltale sign that the heavies have thrown down the gauntlet. And it snowballs quick from there because Mass General and others who got shut out last time are going to line up right behind BCEC and start squawking again. From there a reluctant T can be bullied around if the squawking gets heard around Beacon Hill. One growth neighborhood alone can be divided and conquered. Two growth neighborhoods tag-teaming from opposite ends of the biggest areas of downtown impact (and in different council + Legislative districts) is a whole different matter. Then they start getting quickly outnumbered.


I think MassDOT will be walking back that decision to drop it from the TIP. Whether anything actually gets front-burnered is a different story, but the backroom poltics on this one are quite likely to swing back in its favor as it becomes stark just how hard it's getting to be to feed all this explosive development with the worsening bottlenecks downtown on tapped-out old infrastructure.

 

[BostonUrbEx]

I remember writing to state legislators for East Boston, Chelsea, Winthrop, and Revere (maybe Lynn, too?) when the RBC Project was about to go before the MassDEP (I think it was MassDEP?) for a final ruling on whether the project should be canceled. Not a single damn one of them responded to me, nor did they send so much as an assistant or written testimony to the public hearing. Seriously, they don't care.

It's a little strange that the Speaker of the House is from Winthrop, and yet MassDOT's about to drop funding for the study. What's the world coming to when a MA Speaker can't even get some illicit pork for a STUDY?

Even sent the letter and an email to his office, too! Not a word from him.

 

[Deetroyt]

Here's an article by James Aloisi, who is a proponent for Red-Blue. I feel like we need to bring this project more into public discussion to get any movement on it, much in the way that Somerville leaders kept GLX in the public eye.

http://commonwealthmagazine.org/transportation/need-blue-red-connector/

 

[vanshnookenraggen]

I have a feeling this won't seriously be considered until the GLX is close to completion. It's also going to need a strong political booster.

The sad truth about the Blue Line is that as obvious as it is that extensions would be beneficial, each time the money is available other projects get it first. It's the middle child of the system.

 

[George_Apley]

I have a feeling this won't seriously be considered until the GLX is close to completion. It's also going to need a strong political booster.

The sad truth about the Blue Line is that as obvious as it is that extensions would be beneficial, each time the money is available other projects get it first. It's the middle child of the system.

That is a big problem. There's a chicken/egg political issue with Blue Line extensions. The entire downtown transfer system suffers due to there being no Red-Blue connection, but Blue itself is a fairly low ridership line compared to Red or Green. Politically, it could be argued that it's not worth the cost of connecting Red to Blue until Blue has stronger ridership, which it won't get until it's connected to Lynn. But the reverse could be argued just as well that the system can't handle the transfer loads of Blue + Lynn riders without a direct Red-Blue connection.

I tend to believe the latter point. Red-Blue needs to happen first, before the Blue Line can go to Lynn. Park and DTX are going to kill Red with dwell times if crush transfer loads get any worse. Red is already suffering from that now.

 

[kevtron2000]

That is a big problem. There's a chicken/egg political issue with Blue Line extensions. The entire downtown transfer system suffers due to there being no Red-Blue connection, but Blue itself is a fairly low ridership line compared to Red or Green. Politically, it could be argued that it's not worth the cost of connecting Red to Blue until Blue has stronger ridership, which it won't get until it's connected to Lynn. But the reverse could be argued just as well that the system can't handle the transfer loads of Blue + Lynn riders without a direct Red-Blue connection.

I tend to believe the latter point. Red-Blue needs to happen first, before the Blue Line can go to Lynn. Park and DTX are going to kill Red with dwell times if crush transfer loads get any worse. Red is already suffering from that now.

The Blue Line has low ridership because it has a fewer amount of stations compared to other MBTA rapid transit lines. Also, it serves a less populated area than the rest. I think the Red-Blue Connection should be the 1st piority of any MBTA extension. What is the hold up on the construction? Cost again?

 

[George_Apley]

The Blue Line has low ridership because it has a fewer amount of stations compared to other MBTA rapid transit lines. Also, it serves a less populated area than the rest. I think the Red-Blue Connection should be the 1st piority of any MBTA extension.

Oh I agree. But it's circumstance allows politicians to play ping pong with it all day long. It's all politics.

What is the hold up on the construction? Cost again?

Yes. The state dropped it out of the pipeline so it would need re-study as well as a funding source.

 

[Arlington]

Funding source? City of Boston & TIF in East Boston.

Personally, I think this is kinda like an "infill" station that the locality (Boston, in this case) should pay for and quit all the bellyaching about how the state has done 'em wrong. Yes, the State jerked the city around on this, but Boston is absurd/pitiful/stupid in its state of Learned Helplessness on this, for which I blame the Big Dig (Boston got in the habit of other people picking up the check for key core infrastructure, and the Mayor throwing around what should have been TIF funds on non-transport)

The City of Washington DC paid for its NoMA station and the City of Chicago is paying $50m for an infill L station at McCormick Place using TIF.

Where are all these Blue Line riders whose lives will be transformed? Boston. (Maverick, Airport, Wood Island, Orient Heights, Suffolk Downs, and half of Orient Heights). And that's where all the TIF should come from, since that's a whole lotta Boston that'll go up in value.

Did Somerville pay for its infill at Assembly? No. So what do we make of that? I say Somerville won the lottery. A random act of stimulus, and there's no generalizable conclusion except that Boston, if it wants Red-Blue should save its pennies, work hard, and build it itself. Instead, they keep buying scratch tickets and booze with the money that coulda had this thing built.

Would it be cheaper to wait for the state? Sure. Everyone prefers to wait for some other guy to shower infrastructure on 'em. But if it is so rip-roaring beneficial to 5.5 Boston neighborhoods, (6.5 if you count Beacon Hill / Bowdoin / MGH) Boston should man up and pay for it and quit asking for it for Christmas.

The "next Seaport" should be the Maverick/East Boston Waterfront. TIF revenues there should go to toward paying for Red-Blue. Heck, it could be the next biotech hub if connections to Cambridge are easy.

 

[Equilibria]

The City of Washington DC paid for its NoMA station and the City of Chicago is paying $50m for an infill L station at McCormick Place using TIF.

In both of these cases, the municipality holds seats on the board of the agency and is a controlling player in managing it. Boston contributes to the State for MBTA service and has no say in governance.

 

[Arlington]

In both of these cases, the municipality holds seats on the board of the agency and is a controlling player in managing it. Boston contributes to the State for MBTA service and has no say in governance.

Taxation w/wo Representation isn't the problem here, and wasn't the advantage there. This is a plain old case of "money talks" and proving it is all that important by offering some $ to get it done. Somerville found the (fed & developer) cash and got it done, no seat on the board either. So should Boston.

 

[Arlington]

Another example of municipal paying for infill in a "regional" system: Alexandria VA's Potomac Yards station. (design pending)

Alexandria happens to have a current member on WMATA's board (but it is one of 4 that Virginia/the NVTC rotates/appoints). Sometimes it has no seat (and Arlington Co gets it). Right now it is 1/15th of the board.

What Alexandria does have is:
- $274m of bonds Alexandria will float
-- Alexandria tax of $0.20 on special tax district (TIF to pay the bonds)
-- A loan of $50m from the State of Virginia (an advance on the TIF funds)

- $81m contribution from CYPR, the large local property owner

Boom. $350m exclusively from local sources (not regional/state), and talking way louder than a seat on any board ever would.

Boston ought to be able to come up with, say $50m from MGH, and be willing to overlay a little bit of TIF everywhere from Bowdoin to Beachmont. Maybe that's not 100% funding, but it'd have been enough to get it to construction drawings and and a decent share of construction.

There's no "bad precedent" here if Boston said "this is particularly important, we'll pay a share"--folks "get" that infills are different from the "regional system" and Alexandria, Somerville and Chicago have figured that out and put their* money where their mouth is.

The bad precedent here is Boston curled up in a fetal position whimpering that Red-Blue isn't being built for it by others.

*Their money is sometimes Fed money, sometimes private money, sometimes tax money. The point is, it is "special matching" money to prove they're serious.

 

[Matthew]

Not sure who in East Boston you're expecting to want to pony up more dollars. But I think an even bigger problem is that there is a powerful, influential, and wealthy constituency that does not want the Red/Blue connection: Beacon Hill snobs.

 

[Arlington]

Not sure who in East Boston you're expecting to want to pony up more dollars.

- TOD at Maverick & East Boston
- TOD at Suffolk Downs
- Massport (maybe as PILOT)
- TOD on top of Orient Heights

Why is Red-Blue seen only as a gift that can/must be bestowed at no cost to Eastie, and not as something that their property owners--particularly the commercial owners close to transit--should pay for via TIF and long-term bonds?

A little upzoning in Beachmont and development in Revere should chip in too, if anyone had any sense of justice or imagination.

there is a powerful, influential, and wealthy constituency that does not want the Red/Blue connection: Beacon Hill snobs.

Two answers there: (1) are you sure and (2) call their bluff.

I'd say the owner-snobs tend to be on the Chestnut Street side of the hill, while the landlords and tenants of the MGH side are more for it.

As long as you let "not enough State money" take the blame, the snobs never have to show how snobby they are. Take away the money barrier and you're left with just a few opponents who are going to look obviously anti-social.

 

[Matthew]

Fair enough. How about locations adjacent to the Red Line? I think that the Harvard community would benefit significantly from a better Blue Line connection. Why not ask them too?

Still not sure how we deal with Beacon Hill, though. There are some people there who would probably spend good money on lawsuits just to keep Red/Blue from progressing any further, much less contribute to TIF.

Edit for edit: OK -- who leads this effort?

 

[Arlington]

Who to lead? Mayor Walsh, channeling Rahm Emmanuel.

Fair enough. How about locations adjacent to the Red Line? I think that the Harvard community would benefit significantly from a better Blue Line connection. Why not ask them too?

Harvard both via its MGH connection and MIT, for whom access to Kendall gets very much better should both chip in as Cambridge freeholders.

I'd say the problem if you're Mayor Walsh rounding up backers and shaking down landowners is that MIT and "mother Harvard" are not immediately in his city. Still, it is worth a try.

You are Mayor of Boston, pull yourself together. Go. Confront the problem. Fight! Win!