MBTA Winter 2015: Failure and Recovery

[bigeman312]

Re: Dr. Beverly Scott resigns

All of those cities have rolling stock that is newer. We can talk to them, sure, but all they are going to tell us is to upgrade our damn equipment and rail infrastructure (signals, switches, etc). This situation does. not. have. an. easy. fix.

Winston posted this in the shutdown thread. I'm going to cross-post it here. The T clearly has snow mitigation:



The problem is not that the T doesn't know how to deal with winter weather. The problem is that the rolling stock with the equipment on it simply doesn't work because it's too old.

I only partially agree. I think the primary problem is the aging, and underfunded infrastructure that the T is left with. At the same time, the Blue Line has been mostly rebuilt (stations and cars at least), within the past 20 years, and the MBTA buses, Green Line trolleys, and Commuter Rail trains are all within a reasonable age, yet the MBTA can't keep those operating at a adequate level, at all. While much of the blame falls on newer rolling stock (especially for the Orange Line and Red Line problems), the simple fact that the Red Line and Orange Lines aren't the only things experiencing problems completely refutes your point.

To improve service, step one will obviously be a funding overhaul - a drum both of us have been beating for a long time. But, the T has not shown the ability to operate effectively during winter weather, even with proper equipment. Therefore, with the addition of funding, it would be extremely helpful to look to those cities (Montreal, Toronto, Detroit, Chicago, St. Louis, Minneapolis) to see how they spend their money on weather-proofing their transit systems.

EDIT: I bolded Montreal, Toronto, Chicago, and Minneapolis, because Detroit's public transportation system is relatively small, St. Louis is relatively warm.

 

[West]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

I may have missed something else, but this Globe article is the first decent attempt I’ve seen by one of the major media powers to put the T’s woes into the longer context, and in a way the average reader can understand:

http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2015/02/14/transportation/U7vNqP861gKQFRly2jmjdL/story.html

Headline reads “The T’s long, winding, infuriating road to failure.”

God historical background of the various steps along the way, and seems to do an OK job presenting the hard fact that operating improvements alone won’t cut it (I’d have preferred to see more stress on that, but they at least got it out there).

The article provides some nuggets that instill hope, such as comments by Stephanie Pollack:

“But Pollack, the Baker administration’s point person on the T, said reform is often cast too narrowly — as a nibbling around the edges. What the moment demands, she said, is a conversation about a substantial reordering of the agency.
That could mean boosting the contribution that the communities served by the T make to the agency’s budget, she suggested — making it more accountable to them and less accountable to taxpayers in the rest of the state.”

That got a “hallelujah” from me.

The article ended on a note from Senate President Rosenberg that made me want to just give up and move to someplace far away:

" So then, will the storms of 2015 provide the political will that has long been absent? Will the disabled trains, the Peter Pan buses brought in to transport commuters, and this weekend’s suspended service finally convince the public and lawmakers that it is time for a major new investment? Is this the opportunity that will be seized? Rosenberg paused. “I think it would be a lot easier,” he said, “if we could figure out how to take the snowflakes and turn them into currency.”"

Good Lord, what a pathetically dingbat thing to say. This guy comes across as an airhead. It's one thing to make a tossed off joke like that around a dinner table, but if you're the Senate President and you say that into a live mike held by a Globe reporter, you should go into a stockade down on the Common. In this weather. For a month.

 

[George_Apley]

Re: Dr. Beverly Scott resigns

An inordinate amount of emphasis is placed on finding someone who deals with transit in a similar climate. We don't need someone who has dealt with 70"+ of snow in one winter. We need a leader that has experience managing crises, empowering the organization, and navigating ludicrous state politics. All of the experience to deal with what we've seen this winter is already in house at the MBTA. Someone needs to champion the cause and continue the battle for significant maintenance investment to ensure the operations can run as intended.

Something tells me that someone who's outspoken like Scott will be the last thing they look for in an MBTA chief.

 

[George_Apley]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

^ It's a long article and makes some great points, but it also seems to frame the whole issue as blaming transit advocates for pushing for expansion of the system, which is horribly misleading.

Pollack knows her shit, I just hope Baker doesn't sideline her if she starts to get more and more vocal about reform + revenue.

I think you're being too harsh on Rosenberg. His more important comment is this:

Senate President Stanley C. Rosenberg, an Amherst Democrat, said this reform-before-revenue approach is the right one.

The trouble is, he said, the Legislature always stops at reform and never gets to revenue.

He gets what the problem is, and he's one of the most powerful people in the Legislature. His comment is more useful than ones that Speaker DeLeo has made. He's reflexively ruled out new revenues.

His snowflake comment was an indication of how frustrating and difficult it is politically to get revenue increases through the General Court.

 

[whighlander]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

As much as I love to rag on the MBTA for its faults and operational failures, I really don't think wasting time looking at "best practices" elsewhere will help anything at all. I think it is fairly obvious that the major issue is not one of understanding how to operate Boston's system in Boston's climate, but rather one of trying to mitigate the issue of anemic funding. You can only jerry-rig solutions so many times before the very foundation comes crumbling down. We are most definitely at that point and until that is addressed any time spent elsewhere is completely useless.

Omaja -- That sounds good until you see how much is wasted by the T -- then it becomes just an excuse for the mediocracy that passes for management at the T

There are nearly 2000 people making $100k or more on the T's payroll -- that translates to a minimum of $200M -- most likely paper shufflers and union fat cats working lots of overtime to fatten up their pensions before retiring

On top of all that was already there when Scott took over -- She hired 200 new employees and others during her reign including consultants working on the plan for 2030 -- when the T didn't have a plan to get from Jan 20 to 30 this year

All of the T needs to be audited Top to Bottom and an effective Independent Inspector General appointed before any consideration can be given to any additional funds

If any funds are to be raised the first category should be Commuter Rail fares and parking fees to more closely match the cost of driving and parking in the core -- e.g. something approaching $20 to $30 per day

 

[Jahvon09]

Re: Dr. Beverly Scott resigns

Well, the things that were happening on the Red Line, had begun to mount up - most of them were weather related.

Then the problems had begun to affect the other RT lines as well. She was under tremendous pressure because it had appeared as though everything bad was bearing the weight on her shoulders.

And let's all not forget that the T has probably never experienced a exasperating winter such as this. Probably not since the Blizzard of '78.

Guess that she figured; "Get out now", and like she said, "if anyone else thinks that they can run it better, then let THEM do it."

 

[whighlander]

Re: Dr. Beverly Scott resigns

I only partially agree. I think the primary problem is the aging, and underfunded infrastructure that the T is left with. At the same time, the Blue Line has been mostly rebuilt (stations and cars at least), within the past 20 years, and the MBTA buses, Green Line trolleys, and Commuter Rail trains are all within a reasonable age, yet the MBTA can't keep those operating at a adequate level, at all. While much of the blame falls on newer rolling stock (especially for the Orange Line and Red Line problems), the simple fact that the Red Line and Orange Lines aren't the only things experiencing problems completely refutes your point.

To improve service, step one will obviously be a funding overhaul - a drum both of us have been beating for a long time. But, the T has not shown the ability to operate effectively during winter weather, even with proper equipment. Therefore, with the addition of funding, it would be extremely helpful to look to those cities (Montreal, Toronto, Detroit, Chicago, St. Louis, Minneapolis) to see how they spend their money on weather-proofing their transit systems.

EDIT: I bolded Montreal, Toronto, Chicago, and Minneapolis, because Detroit's public transportation system is relatively small, St. Louis is relatively warm.

Bigeman -- what about Cleveland and Quebec City -- Cleveland is the snowiest large North American city located East of the Rockies

 

[bigeman312]

Re: Dr. Beverly Scott resigns

Bigeman -- what about Cleveland and Quebec City -- Cleveland is the snowiest large North American city located East of the Rockies

They don't make the 2m+ urban area qualification. I had to draw an arbitrary distinction somewhere so the list wouldn't be too cumbersome and include too small of cities. Dropping it to 1m people adds places like Providence, Pittsburgh (both of which are transitional to the next warmest climate zone), Cleveland, etc.

I figure that cities of this size are not as comparable to Boston as Montreal, Toronto, et al - cities that face similar sized transportation challenges.

 

[millerm277]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Well, look at that. For tomorrow, the MBTA has finally figured out how to run underground-only service or nearly so for subway operations. Where was this the last couple of service failures?

 

[Jahvon09]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Well, look at that. For tomorrow, the MBTA has finally figured out how to run underground-only service or nearly so for subway operations. Where was this the last couple of service failures?

They've done this before - some time ago, so this isn't their first time doing it.

 

[Matthew]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Well, look at that. For tomorrow, the MBTA has finally figured out how to run underground-only service or nearly so for subway operations. Where was this the last couple of service failures?

Gotta give them a chance to fail tomorrow!

 

[datadyne007]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

This is hilarious:
Contractors working for the T are looking for people with shovels who want to make $30 an hour shoveling out Red Line tracks in Quincy and Braintree

A T spokesman says the move is part of "an all out snow removal offensive on the Braintree branch tomorrow."

http://www.universalhub.com/2015/have-shovel-t-has-job-you-tomorrow?nocache=1

 

[deh74]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

This is hilarious:
Contractors working for the T are looking for people with shovels who want to make $30 an hour shoveling out Red Line tracks in Quincy and Braintree

A T spokesman says the move is part of "an all out snow removal offensive on the Braintree branch tomorrow."

http://www.universalhub.com/2015/have-shovel-t-has-job-you-tomorrow?nocache=1

I'm actually really tempted to go and take advantage of this.

 

[pixelsand8]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

I'm actually really tempted to go and take advantage of this.

Maybe too many others have the same idea...

Emergency software upgrade on Universal Hub. The Web gnomes are hard at work,
hitting things with their little gnome hammers. Back in a few, sorry.

I could really use that money...

 

[deh74]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Maybe too many others have the same idea...



I could really use that money...

There are a lot of people who could use that money. I'm having trouble believing whether or not this is actually true or not though, because all we have is the author's claims that it is.

 

[datadyne007]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Updated from UHub:

UPDATE: The Facebook page that had details of the job has been taken down; I don't know if that means they have enough people. However, the T confirms it is hiring people tomorrow to shovel off the tracks.

Also, Adam asked Joe Pesaturo himself:

I asked Joe Pesaturo at the MBTA new
By adamg on Sun, 02/15/2015 - 9:30pm
Specifically, I sent him a link to the Facebook page (the one that has since been taken down) and actually asked him "Is this legit?" His exact reply:
Yes. We plan to launch an all out snow removal offensive on the Braintree branch tomorrow.

 

[deh74]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

The author also posted what he says is the original text of the message.

Attention: Anyone looking to work on snow removal and help the region get out from under these unprecedented snow storms...
The MBTA an the Massachusetts Building Trades have asked me to request your help in clearing the Braintree branch of the Red Line between JFK/Umass and Braintree.
Anyone who is interested should report to the Bayside Expo Parking lot at 6:30 tomorrow morning, (Monday Feb. 16th). There will be signage and they should be looking for MBTA personnel to direct them to the proper place.
Details:
• Pay will be $30 per hour.
• Shift will be from 7:00 AM to 4:00 PM.
• Parking will be provided as well as transportation to the work location. You will be transported from Bayside Expo to location and returned there at end of the shift
• Workers will be hired and paid by one of three contractors: JF White, McCourt or Barletta by check
• They are working to arrange for food but suggested that you prepare like you would for any other work day regarding food.
• Dress appropriately for the weather.
• Tools will be provided but they did say they were running short on shovels and suggested to bring one if you can.

 

[omaja]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

I am going to somewhat disagree on this point.

I completely agree that the MBTA has a funding issue, both for operation and for capital spending.

But, I also believe that the MBTA does not know how to efficiently use funding when they get it. And that is where learning from best practices in other cities would be useful. (And also learning from things that did not work). We have a lot of home grown solutions that are just stupid (T trying to build stuff they should not be building themselves), bad engineering allowed by contractors (Assembly Platform outdoors that does not have center drains, so floods), etc. The T also fails miserably on cost -benefit analysis. There are numerous cases where moderate capital expenditures to modify the current tunnels, would allow huge long-term cost savings on rolling stock and operations -- but those changes are never funded, because they are not "sexy".

There is a lot of pretending to know what they are doing, when they really do not.

Jeff, you're conflating capital improvements with operations which are very different in terms of funding and execution. I completely agree that there are ineffiencies across the system, but when we're talking about a very rare - if not unique - circumstance of weather compounding difficulties with the infrastructure we have, my original point stands: you won't find a single system anywhere in the world that has dealt with the situation we have had over the past three weeks. Period. If anyone is best positioned to understand how to deal with this in the future, it is the current staff at the MBTA.

Omaja -- That sounds good until you see how much is wasted by the T -- then it becomes just an excuse for the mediocracy that passes for management at the T

There are nearly 2000 people making $100k or more on the T's payroll -- that translates to a minimum of $200M -- most likely paper shufflers and union fat cats working lots of overtime to fatten up their pensions before retiring

On top of all that was already there when Scott took over -- She hired 200 new employees and others during her reign including consultants working on the plan for 2030 -- when the T didn't have a plan to get from Jan 20 to 30 this year

All of the T needs to be audited Top to Bottom and an effective Independent Inspector General appointed before any consideration can be given to any additional funds

If any funds are to be raised the first category should be Commuter Rail fares and parking fees to more closely match the cost of driving and parking in the core -- e.g. something approaching $20 to $30 per day

You continue to show how little you are actually understanding about the conversation at hand. This has NOTHING to do with any employment expense increases. Salaries/benefits are completely different from capital expenditures around track/train/other infrastructure expenses. Not to say what you reference is incorrect, just entirely tangential to my point. I would appreciate it if you would address what I am talking about rather than trying to further some political agenda you have.

 

[omaja]

Re: Dr. Beverly Scott resigns

To improve service, step one will obviously be a funding overhaul - a drum both of us have been beating for a long time. But, the T has not shown the ability to operate effectively during winter weather, even with proper equipment. Therefore, with the addition of funding, it would be extremely helpful to look to those cities (Montreal, Toronto, Detroit, Chicago, St. Louis, Minneapolis) to see how they spend their money on weather-proofing their transit systems.

EDIT: I bolded Montreal, Toronto, Chicago, and Minneapolis, because Detroit's public transportation system is relatively small, St. Louis is relatively warm.

What does Chicago do differently from Boston (excluding the newer rolling stock it has) to mitigate winter weather? I would not include Montreal and Toronto in the same category because the majority of each city's system is underground. Minneapolis and St. Louis are not remotely comparable in terms of breadth or depth of service. Again, I would repeat that the single largest issue dealing with weather is not the MBTA's institutional knowledge of such, but rather the lack of funding to maintain the system. We see the effects of this on a hot summer, or cool fall day, so it isn't shocking to see a complete meltdown during the most compacted winter storm period in the city.

 

[Shepard]

Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Shuttle bus on the c line was fast and efficient but dumped us at kenmore with 500 other people and no evidence a train may come half an hour later