New England Revolution Stadium | 173 Alford Street | Boston-Everett

[statler]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

I'm not much of a sports nut but it's hard to look at the areas around Fenway Park and the Garden and think those places are a waste of space/poor urbanism. They are both very active on non-event days and lot of that is due to people going to the venues built for event days. It's a win/win.

Now if they proposed surrounding the new stadium with parking lots, yeah, absolutely not. If you want an urban stadium, you are going to have to sacrifice your tailgating, sorry.

 

[stick n move]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

Exactly. I went to a job fair for military vets at Fenway a year ago where they also give you free tickets. Things like that are the small ways these places interact with the community that you dont see.

 

[tangent]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

I'm not much of a sports nut but it's hard to look at the areas around Fenway Park and the Garden and think those places are a waste of space/poor urbanism. They are both very active on non-event days and lot of that is due to people going to the venues built for event days. It's a win/win.

Now if they proposed surrounding the new stadium with parking lots, yeah, absolutely not. If you want an urban stadium, you are going to have to sacrifice your tailgating, sorry.

Which is exactly why they should locate the stadium where it can be surrounded by city streets at least on one side...

 

[JANAM]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

Now if they proposed surrounding the new stadium with parking lots, yeah, absolutely not. If you want an urban stadium, you are going to have to sacrifice your tailgating, sorry.[/QUOTE]


Soccer fans don't tailgate, typically gather in local bars and restaurants before and sometimes after matches.

 

[datadyne007]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

Soccer fans don't tailgate, typically gather in local bars and restaurants before and sometimes after matches.

At Gillette we do (there's a very robust tailgate culture at Gillette), but it's only because there's the opportunity (read: massive parking lots) to do it. You're correct that everywhere else in the world that has an urban stadium gathers at a bar pre-match, but statler is also correct that Revs fans are going to have to give up tailgating culture and shift to a pre-match bar and March to the Match. As I've said in the past, I have no problem dropping it for an urban stadium but there are many fans I know who are dead set against giving up tailgating and want massive parking lots around a Boston stadium.

 

[mass88]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

Tailgating is an American thing and should be embraced by MLS fans – it’s something different than what the European soccer teams do. To each their own, but the whole march to the match thing is kind of lame. I go to 5 to 6 Patriots games every year and for some reason am always nearby a group of foreign fans (usually from Europe) and they are always blown away by how great the American tailgate culture is. It will be unfortunate if that has to go away if the Revs get their own stadium in an urban area. Yes, it will be great to get a stadium better suited for soccer, but losing the tailgating will stink. While the crowds may be smaller than Patriots games, Revs fan get after it in the parking lots before the games and there is a solid tailgating scene.

 

[stick n move]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

The bay state expo site could have kept tailgating, had a patriots place, near transit, the waterfront, etc. 93 sucks already though and that rotary is a disaster too so it would have been a mess. A stadium that relies massively on transit with park n rides, ubers, etc.. to get there is the only viable solution to not cause a catastrophe if its in city limits. There could have been the tail gate culture at bay state at the expense of everything else, I dont see it anywhere within the city. What about Allston yards next to the double tree? Storrow, the pike, Memorial drive, plus the T, and central sq red line not far up the street.

Bus, taxi, uber, or even walking wouldnt be too bad from the red line. Then the future west station is right there and the 3 road arteries.

 

[HenryAlan]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

Tailgating is an American thing and should be embraced by MLS fans – it’s something different than what the European soccer teams do. To each their own, but the whole march to the match thing is kind of lame. I go to 5 to 6 Patriots games every year and for some reason am always nearby a group of foreign fans (usually from Europe) and they are always blown away by how great the American tailgate culture is. It will be unfortunate if that has to go away if the Revs get their own stadium in an urban area. Yes, it will be great to get a stadium better suited for soccer, but losing the tailgating will stink. While the crowds may be smaller than Patriots games, Revs fan get after it in the parking lots before the games and there is a solid tailgating scene.

Really, tailgating is an American suburb thing. I've been to games for a variety of top tier pro sports in a variety of settings. When there is a big parking lot, there is tail gating, regardless of sport. When there is no such parking facility, there are bars and restaurants within easy walking distance. To me the question, then, is which setting will work best for attracting soccer fans, not which setting will work best for tailgating. Tailgating is a non-issue unless soccer fans cannot have a quality experience without it.

 

[Ruairi]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

Tailgating is an American thing and should be embraced by MLS fans – it’s something different than what the European soccer teams do. To each their own, but the whole march to the match thing is kind of lame. I go to 5 to 6 Patriots games every year and for some reason am always nearby a group of foreign fans (usually from Europe) and they are always blown away by how great the American tailgate culture is. It will be unfortunate if that has to go away if the Revs get their own stadium in an urban area. Yes, it will be great to get a stadium better suited for soccer, but losing the tailgating will stink. While the crowds may be smaller than Patriots games, Revs fan get after it in the parking lots before the games and there is a solid tailgating scene.

the whole march to the match thing is actually not very European or South American. It's more of a MLS thing. MLS supporters groups looked at the behavior of fringe European ultras groups and made them main stream. Tailgating is great fun but I'd happily switch that for a few beers in a pub with my mates and a walk to a stadium (not a march being directed by some bellend with a bull horn and a huge flag).

 

[tangent]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

The bay state expo site could have kept tailgating, had a patriots place, near transit, the waterfront, etc. 93 sucks already though and that rotary is a disaster too so it would have been a mess. A stadium that relies massively on transit with park n rides, ubers, etc.. to get there is the only viable solution to not cause a catastrophe if its in city limits. There could have been the tail gate culture at bay state at the expense of everything else, I dont see it anywhere within the city. What about Allston yards next to the double tree? Storrow, the pike, Memorial drive, plus the T, and central sq red line not far up the street.

Bus, taxi, uber, or even walking wouldnt be too bad from the red line. Then the future west station is right there and the 3 road arteries.

Fenway is a disaster transportation wise. Green line gets seriously overcrowded and streets get gridlocked before and after games... not sure if that supports or undermines what you are saying, but if it is grandfathered in people just deal with it as the way it is. Inevitably events with 20,000 people are going to cause traffic/congestion wherever it is... still I think it is worth it, but people that live nearby and don't like soccer are going to have other opinions.

 

[kingofsheeba]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

Allston wouldn't work because the neighbors would throw a shitfit. I think the best location still would've been Suffolk Downs (close to Rt.1/Blue Line) and you could still tailgate. But I think datadyne said it best. With the new location of this stadium, tailgating will have to be jettisoned.

Getting back to the topic of the proposed site, you read the comments on social media. There are the clear idiotic, NIMBY, knee jerk reactions that you would expect but not as many as you might think. Which is a major silver lining and a signals hope that this can go through. Because there's also a ton of support for this. Ultimately it depends on the design of the project and if if can meet the needs of the connection neighborhoods and what the long term ROI can bring. If done right, this can help to create a whole new neighborhood spearheaded by the stadium.

Fenway is always going to be a fustercluck no matter what they do to that neighborhood and I'm so glad that they're not adding more seats inside the park this off-season. Ultimately, the attitude of the future site of the Revs and where the Krafts finally decide to build this in the city, depends on the future of Fenway and the surrounding neighborhoods as well as the rebuilt Garden. If the added capacity can bring revenue without causing neighborhood disruptions, then the Revs have a shot in the city.

 

[tangent]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

My point was that you can't integrate a stadium into a neighborhood without disruptions... but that doesn't mean that you therefore choose a location that isn't actually in any neighborhood.

 

[JohnAKeith]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

What is your definition of "NIMBY"?

Allston wouldn't work because the neighbors would throw a shitfit. I think the best location still would've been Suffolk Downs (close to Rt.1/Blue Line) and you could still tailgate. But I think datadyne said it best. With the new location of this stadium, tailgating will have to be jettisoned.

Getting back to the topic of the proposed site, you read the comments on social media. There are the clear idiotic, NIMBY, knee jerk reactions that you would expect but not as many as you might think. Which is a major silver lining and a signals hope that this can go through. Because there's also a ton of support for this. Ultimately it depends on the design of the project and if if can meet the needs of the connection neighborhoods and what the long term ROI can bring. If done right, this can help to create a whole new neighborhood spearheaded by the stadium.

Fenway is always going to be a fustercluck no matter what they do to that neighborhood and I'm so glad that they're not adding more seats inside the park this off-season. Ultimately, the attitude of the future site of the Revs and where the Krafts finally decide to build this in the city, depends on the future of Fenway and the surrounding neighborhoods as well as the rebuilt Garden. If the added capacity can bring revenue without causing neighborhood disruptions, then the Revs have a shot in the city.

 

[tangent]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

What is your definition of "NIMBY"?

I believe he said "idiotic, NIMBY" as opposed to the open pit coal mine "not in my backyard" or the paint factory "not in my backyard".

Personally, I think it is perfectly legitimate to not want a sports stadium in close proximity to your neighborhood. Or if you live in Salem to hate the month of October. Just because something negatively affects you in some way doesn't mean it isn't overall good for the community and worth weighing the pros and cons.

 

[kingofsheeba]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

I believe he said "idiotic, NIMBY" as opposed to the open pit coal mine "not in my backyard" or the paint factory "not in my backyard".

Personally, I think it is perfectly legitimate to not want a sports stadium in close proximity to your neighborhood. Or if you live in Salem to hate the month of October. Just because something negatively affects you in some way doesn't mean it isn't overall good for the community and worth weighing the pros and cons.

This^^^

Nobody is saying that there aren't concerns. Living in the city can be stressful and it's okay to have these discussions. My point was that we've come a long way from when 1970 when Louise Day Hicks ran the Sullivans out of Boston down to Foxboro when they tried to build that stadium in South Boston. Shit, we've come a long way from 1997 when Menino and Weld told Kraft to take a hike.

 

[tangent]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

It is a bit strange how stadiums with their very infrequent large scale events (and the casino while we are talking about traffic/transportation concerns holding back development) elicit such a negative neighborhood response. But other economic development activities just don't get the same attention to traffic concerns. The Fenway, the Seaport, area around North Station, North End and many areas of the city get packed with pedestrians and traffic many different times and people complain about it in the sense of asking for more infrasructure spending to smooth the flows of people and traffic, but not so much in terms of saying it is a bad thing to have so many people in the city.

 

[Arenacale]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

It's the large scale events that are the most disruptive, though. If other developments create an increase of people and traffic, it's generally more of a steady stream that might be more congested than prior, but it's also not going to be 25,000 people all entering and leaving at the exact same time.

I think it's worth noting that the two major sports venues in the city proper - Fenway and the Garden, have been on their parcels (or thereabouts) for almost a century or more, so the neighborhoods around them have had time to develop and adjust to the influxes of people around events (also - there were far fewer cars when they were built!). Simply dropping a major stadium in a densely settled neighborhood without considering consequences to the people living there is, I think, foolish and will always be seen by the residents as disrespectful.

 

[kingofsheeba]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

It's the large scale events that are the most disruptive, though. If other developments create an increase of people and traffic, it's generally more of a steady stream that might be more congested than prior, but it's also not going to be 25,000 people all entering and leaving at the exact same time.

I think it's worth noting that the two major sports venues in the city proper - Fenway and the Garden, have been on their parcels (or thereabouts) for almost a century or more, so the neighborhoods around them have had time to develop and adjust to the influxes of people around events (also - there were far fewer cars when they were built!). Simply dropping a major stadium in a densely settled neighborhood without considering consequences to the people living there is, I think, foolish and will always be seen by the residents as disrespectful.

I don't know what else to say. This is part of living in a city. What's disrespectful is when I didn't hear a peep out of these same snowflakes when Amazon wanted to move its headquarters into Boston. Amazon. Where the workers are run into the ground and treated like galley slaves. Not one peep.


You mention Fenway and the Garden. Fenway is now at 39,720 (not sure if that's the actual capacity). The Garden is also expanding with the new Hub on Causeway. Both arenas are now adding capacity in their venues. Fenway will probably add more seats somewhere in the park at some point.


No towers, no stadiums, no shadows, no picketing hotel workers. I'd like to ask these people what they think makes up a good city. Maybe take them to Seattle, Chicago, Denver, Portland and other places where stadiums exist. I'm sure the residents in those cities would get a kick out of what concerns us as residents.

 

[stick n move]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

I got a look at where exactly the Revolution practice facility is going to go at Gillette.

Using this image you can place it in the woods past the football practice fields.

As of now there is only this one soccer field a little bit beyond the indoor training field.


I tried to line this up to the render below as close as possible.


The existing practice field above is shown below at the top left. So they're expanding throughout the wooded area behind the stadium parking lots. This is great to see the Revs being taken more serious. They are adding 3 more practice fields and an HQ facility. Pretty cool!

This looks like a great facility. It makes sense to have it at Gillette for the extra room needed for practice, and it wont affect the stadium being located in Boston eventually *fingers crossed.

Also the way the Celtics described the Auerbach center is that they now had 1 place as a home base vs being spread around with offices in one location, a borrowed gym in another. Now everything is in one place and you know where you have to go and you have everything you need in 1 place. I see it being the exact same for the Revs. They'll have the different pools, tubs, locker room, weight room, cardio, hangout areas, film rooms etc..

"Massachusetts' Major League Soccer team is getting a new, $35 million training facility.

The New England Revolution broke ground on the 68-acre facility in Foxborough on Monday, according to a statement from the team. Located just outside of Gillette Stadium in the surrounding wetlands, the center will become the new headquarters for the team and its operations."
https://www.wbur.org/news/2018/10/15/new-england-revolution-training-center-groundbreaking
https://www.revolutionsoccer.net/post/2018/10/15/revolution-break-ground-world-class-35-million-training-center

 

[jass]

Re: Site in Hub top choice for a soccer stadium

How the fuck is chopping down a forest to build parking lots and grass fields "great to see"?