Reasonable Transit Pitches

Tufts was a necessary change because the hospital is no longer called "New England Medical Center". But that's the pitfall of naming rights...these entities change their names faster than ever. Caveat emptor if you're trying to name a landmark after them. This is one example where the T got burned. Granted it was an all-new station for the Orange Line relocation, but this is why you don't mess with the legacy ones with changes you cannot predict will last at the multi-generational level.

Look at the Garden...Shawmut Center, then FleetCenter before it even opened, then that whole confusing interim period where nobody knew what the hell it was going to become. Now at least the "Garden" tag pins it with permanence regardless of whether the corporate sponsor changes once every 10 years. I'm sure that was privately arranged under pressure that whoever took over the name post-FleetCenter had to use "Garden" to restore its landmark status.

Also, re: the subscripted names...hardly any commuters in this town pay any attention to the subscripts. They aren't on T maps, just the station signage. As signage goes they are useful to have as secondary geographic references. I'm completely OK with the subscripts evolving over time if there's good reason to and they use it well. That's added detail for people not familiar with the area, not a change in identity.


As for the others. . .

-- Kendall/MIT was a reversion of a baaaaad mistake. They originally renamed Kendall "Cambridge Center" in the mid-80's when the Red Line was extended and subscripted "Kendall" (expunging it entirely from the main name) thinking the development around there was going to be the new neighborhood identity. It didn't work, people complained loudly, and the signage reverted right back to Kendall within a few years. The "Cambridge Center" subscript on the signage and the subscript getting announced on the ASA is an anachronism they probably should do away with and shorten the subscript to "MIT". I doubt the slash is going to survive forever. Brevity's important, and the MIT campus is getting so spread out they don't have a singular identification with Kendall anymore. They are probably getting their own named stop or two whenever the Urban Ring Phase I or II comes to town, so the suffix will have to get dropped just to keep the names on the spider map clearly delineated.


-- Charles/MGH was an appendage tacked on same time as the disastrous Kendall name change. I'm sure there was some political horse-trading behind that one, but the station was always named "Charles" and always pinned directly to Charles Circle so it's not a landmark change. Mass General is also not Tufts...it's such a longstanding landmark in that location that no corporate takeover is ever going to change its name. It predates the station by a good 50 years. In this case it's a vital public service to suffix it with the hospital. That merits more than just a subscript. I never suggested being totally dogmatic about this...there are viable exceptions. Just make sure the name isn't going to burn 'em in 20 years. N.E. Med. Ctr. < MGH on the century-level permanence front. That has to be taken into consideration.


-- Science Park. As noted, "West End" is the subscript nobody uses. Both of them are kind of unsatisfying names as a geographical marker, but it's been Science Park since Day 1 so not worth messing with.


-- Malden/Malden Ctr. Is that even a name change? I know it was called Malden on the commuter rail before the Orange Line opened, but it is in actual-factual Malden Ctr. People always went there because it's the center of Malden. And Oak Grove (which never existed as a RR station) is in town of Malden so a geographical qualifier was necessary.


-- Auditorium/Hynes/ICA. Ooh, boy...bunch of bad decisions compounding each other. Geographically it's "Auditorium" like the original name and they shouldn't have messed with it. Hynes Auditorium is just the latest iteration of the Auditorium. It didn't merit a name change at all, but politics got involved. Now, if the convention center itself gets a corporate sponsor in some later decade that boots John Hynes to second fiddle in the facility name...they're gonna have a problem. That's a new enough name that 100-year permanence isn't an assumption you can make when changing a 100-year-old station. The ICA suffix was just idiotic. Transparent attempt to boost business when it was in its lousy former location. That could've been subscripted, but they chose to slash it instead. And everyone ignored the slash. It's fine right now, but this stop's naming foibles over the last 25 years are a definite cautionary tale.


-- Museum. I think it's important to note that the default-detail spider map prior to about 1984-85 did not list B/C/E surface stops except for very major stations (see the 1979 map with Northeastern, Brigham, Heath, and Arborway only). For the first 2 decades of the T's existence they were still halfway in the old MTA-era convention of treating surface stops as a second tier only slightly above bus stops in importance. MFA's name was changed well before the branch stops got reclassified to parity with the subway stops. "Museum" only appeared on extra-detail maps like the printed ones or those full-neighborhood maps at stations. And I think you can call that a borderline name change as well. "Museum" = "MFA" abbreviated. MFA is a century-level landmark at that location that pre-dates all streetcar lines on Huntington. "Ruggles" suffix never took...Ruggles St. is hardly the first thing anyone thinks of when getting off at that stop, so it did not stick with riders and got dropped for clarity.

-- JFK/UMass (changed from Columbia, '88). Ugh. Okay, I can see UMass being a worthy part of the name meriting a slashed suffix 25 years ago. That campus has grown to clear landmark status, all in pretty recent times. But JFK pre-empting it? That was a dead political giveaway at a time when they wanted to stimulate tourism at the Library when it was only 6 years old. That decision has not held up well over time, but at least the Library isn't going anywhere. And dropping Columbia off the station name and onto the subscript was a huge mistake. That is the neighborhood thoroughfare out of that station, and where 4 heavily-traveled bus routes fan out from the station. People need to know that, because it's how you get around the neighborhood. Station should've been suffixed Columbia/UMass with JFK relegated to the subscript. Too late to undo that after 25 years, but they botched this one. Kendall --> Cambridge Ctr., N.E. Med Ctr., and the Auditorium --> Hynes/ICA mess all happened within 3 years of each other, BTW...do the T was in a real accident-prone state of mind with the signage eraser circa 1987-90. Use that as a cautionary tale about encoraging this habit...you live with the current political leaders' choices for a lifetime whether those leaders make competent or compromised choices.



The only ones I could see use in renaming:

-- Yawkey. Because that's not exactly a geographical marker. It was a dead giveaway to the Yawkey Trust, just like Yawkey Way was. Who knows if subsequent Red Sox ownerships are going to be all that enamored with associating with the ol' racist to keep that one so prominent around the ballpark. I would say this is suspect for lasting at the century-level. Then again, in '88 when it opened nobody anticipated that cheapo slab of asphalt that was only open for Sox games would ever have staying power so it's not a particularly bothersome one.

-- Route 128. As much as the state would like to expunge that highway number from history, it is a landmark nobody will let go. But this needs to be a suffixed stop, Westwood/128, because there are LOTS of sites that could be suffixed 128, just like Littleton and Forge Park are officially suffixed with 495. The commuter rail should probably adopt that naming convention of "[Location]/[Highway #]" more often. And they're asking for trouble if it gets "Westwood Landing" named after that never-will-be-all-it's-cracked-up-to-be vaporware development. Much like Dedham Corporate Ctr. was a wishful-thinking TOD bust.

-- Dedham Corporate Ctr. I honestly can't think of anything better than this because the surrounding TOD is decent enough to not need a major reboot but blah enough that it's not really clicking. Bringing back the old station name "Rustcraft" (after Rustcraft Rd.) probably doesn't work either because the exit off 128 to reach is is East St. I have a feeling the wishy-washiness of how this site is performing is going to make it a perpetual naming nomad.

-- New Balance/Brighton*. *Hey...perfectly OK to bend the rules here on corporate sponsorship because they're paying their way in a real-deal public-private partnership to build this station. That is totally reasonable for a naming rights deal. But let's not kid ourselves: "New Balance" the company is not going to be around for the rest of the century. They could easily get a corporate takeover in 10 years with that whole development changing names again and again. This is an acceptable exception, but let's not kid ourselves about the inherent risks of using business names for landmarks when that business isn't a permanent landmark (e.g. MGH, or the Pru...which is always going to be the Pru whether Prudential is a tenant or extant company just like the Chrysler Building in NYC will always be the Chrysler Building). Choose wisely and make damn sure it counts (like major construction $$$) when considering exceptions to the rule.



That's about it. Unless some surface Green Line stops get realigned over time to different street corners I can't really think of anything else that needs a change. Including Fenway (DO NOT WANT on "Landmark Ctr." as a main name or suffix...subscript only), which ID's the neighborhood. Most of them have been around so long under their current names it's not worth the confusion. Not even ones like Blandford where the namesake street has been absorbed by the BU borg. BU does not need an excuse to rewrite the T map (and its three named stops have had those names ever since the Charles River Campus opened 8+ decades ago).
 
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So on the map F-line linked to, what's the deal with Harvard being a separate stop from Harvard-Brattle? I never knew these were separate stations at one point... [commence wiki research]

Also, I realize it's irrelevant now, but how come Arborway and Forest Hills weren't given the same name?
 
Haha, great.

Dave M. - Sorry for taking a hostile tone last night. Internet arguing is stupid and I was grumpy. Thanks for the history lesson (don't know how to portray sincerity on the internet). I still think exploring the renaming of a station for wayfinding purposes has merit, but Fenway is a more appropriate name than I had previously considered.

Agree to disagree on the merit of renaming stations overall, though.

No problem, I was a bit strong in my response anyway. I had both guns already firing after reading the abyiss half our threads have delved into lately…
 
So on the map F-line linked to, what's the deal with Harvard being a separate stop from Harvard-Brattle? I never knew these were separate stations at one point... [commence wiki research]

Also, I realize it's irrelevant now, but how come Arborway and Forest Hills weren't given the same name?

There have actually been 5 stations near Harvard Sq over the years.

Harvard-Brattle was created between tracks in the Eliot Yard just outside of the Harvard Sq portal to the yard. It served as a terminus for the Red Line during the reconstruction/relocation of the actual Harvard station (opened in '79, closed in '83). From the research I've done on the Red Line Extension, I believe that "Harvard" was kept on the interrim map to differentiate that the stations were indeed in different locations.
 
So on the map F-line linked to, what's the deal with Harvard being a separate stop from Harvard-Brattle? I never knew these were separate stations at one point... [commence wiki research]

Also, I realize it's irrelevant now, but how come Arborway and Forest Hills weren't given the same name?

Harvard-Brattle and Harvard-Holyoke were the 2 temporary stations that existed from 1979-81 when old Harvard station was being demolished for the curve into New Harvard. Harvard-Holyoke is that abandoned platform you see to the right after the curve on any inbound train (outbound it's sealed by the cinderblock wall to the left). On the surface the headhouse used to be by Holyoke St. where those gigantic ventilation grates are in the sidewalk. The original station is to the left inbound, the undemolished half of the original station to the right outbound. Harvard-Brattle was outdoors in the yard right at the old portal where the JFK School is. They had to do 2 stations because the temp platforms were so tiny they couldn't handle many people at a time.


Arborway/Forest Hills was different because the trolleys on the E let passengers off in Arborway Yard and not the Forest Hills busway (Washington St. trolleys did use the busway). About a block's difference. The trolleys also pre-dated the Orange Line, so "Arborway" came first. The El originally terminated at Dudley, then was extended to FH about 10 years later in an entirely separate funding/build.

Had the Green Line been restored in 1991 like it was supposed to, it would've been signed FH because the new trolley station is in the busway directly at the OL/commuter rail station. "Forest Hills" signs on the outside are still in Green to this day.
 
So on the map F-line linked to, what's the deal with Harvard being a separate stop from Harvard-Brattle? I never knew these were separate stations at one point... [commence wiki research]

It was a temporary station, open during the construction of the current iteration of Harvard Station, and the Red Line extension to Alewife.

Also, I realize it's irrelevant now, but how come Arborway and Forest Hills weren't given the same name?

That happened more often than you would expect.

For example, State on the Blue/Orange Line: The Blue Line stop was known as Devonshire, the northbound Orange Line stop was known as State and the southbound Orange Line stop was known as Milk Street from the opening of the Washington Street Tunnel in 1908 until 1967.

Downtown Crossing on the Red/Orange Line: The northbound Orange Line stop was known as Summer, the southbound Orange Line stop was known as Winter and the Red Line stop was known as Washington from the opening of the Dorchester Tunnel in 1915 until 1967.

So, for over 50 years, two consecutive stops in the Washington Street Tunnel had a total of 6 names at once!

EDIT: Well played, Data and F-Line
 
I know there was a second station in the yard that was opened on harvard game days, although I believe it was called stadium or something.

There is an exit in brattle square, I think in the previous configuration the bus/trolley loop was more closely affiliated with brattle square then harvard. The old station was located on the opposite side of the square, while the bus/trolley loop is closer to brattle, so that may be it. Even today there is pretty prominent sinage in the station directing you to brattle.

Also during the construction of the new station, there were like three seperate "harvard" stations during the process. I can't remember if the abandoned station you can see today is one of the temporary ones or the original.

"Stadium" station in the yard was way the hell over on the corner of (present-day) JFK St. and Memorial Dr. Just a single wood platform on a tail track, and they opened the chain link fence for a few hours around gametime with a fare collector stationed there. Harvard-Brattle was more official-looking and right smack at the portal: http://www.flickr.com/photos/ck4049/5009702076/sizes/z/in/set-72157626821314091/.


Original Harvard was shut in '79. Harvard-Holyoke and Harvard-Brattle opened the next day. Then those two were shut in '81 and new Harvard opened the next day.

Harvard-Brattle's long gone. The pit it used to be in is covered over by the JFK School. Harvard-Holyoke inbound is very conspicuous on any inbound train right after the curve on the right. The last few feet of platform are behind the cinder block wall intact and accessible by a maintenance door, but the rest of it is right out in the open. Can still see where the signage used to hang. Outbound side is covered over behind the cinderblock wall but still accessible by staff.

Old Harvard inbound is still fully intact. Look left directly opposite Harvard-Holyoke. It's dark and doesn't look like much, but that's the platform (tiny! I can't imagine that thing handling the crowds for 70 years). Look up and you can see the concourse with standard T signage still hanging on the wall pointing to the busway, which was connected on a longish narrow concourse instead of being right there in the lobby like today. Outbound the station got half-demolished by the new curve, but you can still see the remaining half of the platform looking right as you round the curve. Old light fixtures and all. It's severed from the old concourse level...egress was on the demolished half.


EDIT: Some shots of the sealed yard tunnel under Brattle Sq. (p. 1-2), Harvard-Holyoke inbound (p. 2), and old Harvard inbound as pictured across the way from the Harvard-Holyoke platform (p. 2): http://sery2831.smugmug.com/Transit/Harvard-Station-and-yard-leads.
 
I believe Harvard-Holyoke was inbound-only. Harvard-Brattle was the 'main' Harvard Square station at that time.
 
F-Line, your dates are off.

The original Harvard was not shut in 1979 which is why the 1979 map has both Harvard-Brattle and Harvard on it. Old Harvard remained in use (with Harvard-Brattle as the terminus), but under heavy construction for 2 years until it was finally closed in 1981 because demo work had to begin. In anticipation of the incredible loads on Harvard-Brattle, loads that little temporary platforms in a rail yard could not handle, Harvard-Holyoke was built as inbound only on the other side of the original Harvard tracks and opened the day that Harvard closed.

Harvard-Brattle and Harvard-Holyoke remained open for the next 2 years and closed on September 2, 1983. The MBTA ran shuttle buses for 4 days while they reconnected the New Harvard, which opened on September 6, 1983.

Refer to PDF page 306, actual page 308: http://www.transithistory.org/roster/MBTARouteHistory.pdf
 
Auditorium is really a poor name for the GL station. The entrance closest to Hynes Auditorium is usually closed. The most efficient way to get to Hynes is from Prudential Station (which is closer, I think). What prompted the stupid, now irreversible, change from Massachusetts? Anyway, the station now needs a new name. Any suggestions?
 
There's a tremendous amount of precedence in naming stops after the prominent nearby college/uni (Harvard, Northeastern, BU, BC, UMass, soon to be Tufts, etc). So, why not rename Hynes to be Berklee? And, similarly (although I'm less inclined on this one) why not rename the confusingly named Boylston stop to be Emerson?

Colleges have a great permanence and will often define an area. Boylston/Mass is much more defined by Berklee than it is by the convention center.
 
I've always liked the idea of calling it Boylston and renaming Boylston to Theatre District.

Either that or Newbury Street.
 
I always thought Boylston was a particularly poor name for a stop on a subway that runs the length of Boylston. Theater District is solid.

Berklee is not a bad idea for Hynes, although it is a relatively small presence compared with the bigger universities. Coupled with "Emerson" it might not seem out of place. "Mass Ave" is the place name I would choose first and foremost, except for the other station already named that and all the other stations on mass ave in other locations. I'll offer up "Embarrassing Pike Crater that would be Great to Deck Over"
 
Government Center is going to be a fun re-naming contest if the city ever nukes City Hall Plaza.
 
I've always liked the idea of calling it Boylston and renaming Boylston to Theatre District.

Either that or Newbury Street.

Newbury Street would be even more confusing than Boylston... At least the station is at the intersection of Tremont and Boylston. Newbury Street is all the way across the park from there.
 
JFK/UMass was certainly renamed before 1988, which is when Braintree trains began stopping there. I can't remember when, although I believe I've read 1982 somewhere.
 
JFK/UMass was certainly renamed before 1988, which is when Braintree trains began stopping there. I can't remember when, although I believe I've read 1982 somewhere.

I've heard 1982 for the Columbia -> JFK/UMass change as well.
 
"Stadium" station in the yard was way the hell over on the corner of (present-day) JFK St. and Memorial Dr. Just a single wood platform on a tail track,

Old Harvard inbound[/URL] is still fully intact. Look left directly opposite Harvard-Holyoke. It's dark and doesn't look like much, but that's the platform (tiny! I can't imagine that thing handling the crowds for 70 years). [/URL].

Stadium station was on the loop track, not a tail track. It also was a concrete platform, not wood. It was not in use by the time I can remember seeing it, but I know from first hand observation it was concrete. The linked article in the Electric Railway Journal has a photo and description.

http://books.google.com/books?id=zq...AOVxYCYBw&ved=0CD4Q6AEwBA#v=onepage&q&f=false





The old inbound Harvard is not fully intact. Because the inbound/outbound tracks are off-set at that point, a few more feet of the inbound side remains vs. the outbound, but it is by no means the entire original platform. The 1980s alignment cuts through the inbound platform as well. Back during the construction when Harvard-Holyoke was open, you could stand right on the Harvard-Holyoke inbound platform and get a direct view across the tracks of the demolition of most of the original Harvard platform.

The fare collection area at the old Harvard station was along the inbound platform, but it was not at the very end of the platform, a portion of the platform extended beyond the location of the fare collection area into the tunnel towards Eliot Shops. When the present Harvard station opened in 1983, the Church St. entrance was the only entrance to the station for a couple of years. They had to wait for the trains to be placed on the new alignment before they could demolish a portion of the old tunnel (heading towards Harvard-Brattle) to build the present main fare collection area at Harvard. As noted in the previous photo links, the old abandoned tunnel does pick up again on the other side of the fare lobby near the ramps to the bus tunnel.
 

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