Rose Kennedy Greenway

As most of you, I'm not sad to see Safdie's design go ... but what a nice way to treat a local architect ... one who is known worldwide. I wonder how long Safdie and his firm were waiting to make a mark on their home town ... what an insult.

The thing that ticks me off is that, like most other projects in Boston, all of the interesting, controversial, and racy ideas are chucked and simplified to shit. If they want to make a "signature building", use a signature architect ... or someone who is known for their aesthetically pleasing designs. There are so many younger up-and-coming architects in New York who would love to get their hands on such a project ... or even in Boston. I'm willing to bet that their fee would be a hell of a lot less.

In any case ... Cambridge Seven will never be known for making anything close to interesting. Boooo.
 
In my Alzheimer's test for today, I remember that there was a pretty serious fire that destroyed some of the semi-permanent structures that the vendors used. The fire was where there is now that empty plot near the back of the Millennium Hotel (the fire was prior to its rebranding). The fire occurred about the time that the City had drawn up a design for a major re-do of the vendor area, to make it more all-season, and to provide better facilities for the safe storage and display of food. I vaguely remember renderings of the design, or think I do. Then it seemed the whole idea got politically charged with some of the vendors not wanting new or better facilities, or fearing economic ruin if they had to shut during construction. Then the Big Dig came along.
 
If I remember right the hotel presented the plans and designs almost days after the fire. Jee wonder who might have had an interest in setting the fire?
 
Riverworks said:
In any case ... Cambridge Seven will never be known for making anything close to interesting. Boooo.
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Well, given none of the original architects are still around, but Cambridge Seven was pretty well known for the NE Aquarium and the interior of Bucky's Expo '67 Dome.
 
It looks like even the Globe is beginning to realize what a lemon the Greenway is and could remain if sound decision-making and bolder thinking doesn't become part of the authorities' (who are they here, anyway? the state? the Pike? the Conservancy? ... still confused) bag o' tricks:

Trouble on the Greenway

THE MISSION of the proposed Boston Museum seemed a little vague from the start. But at least its location was clear: Parcel 12 along the Rose Fitzgerald Kennedy Greenway, between Faneuil Hall Marketplace and the North End. Yet now museum backers have shifted their gaze to a new site that doesn't pose the engineering and economic challenges raised by trying to build on a surface penetrated by ramps leading in and out of a Big Dig tunnel.

One of the biggest payoffs from the lengthy and expensive depression of the Central Artery was to be the creation of great civic spaces from North Station to Chinatown. The Boston Museum promised a "new icon for Boston, adding beauty, power of place and definition" to the Greenway. But now the museum's world-class architectural firm, Moshe Safdie and Associates, has been given its walking papers. And Frank Keefe, the chief executive of the proposed museum, talks of building a more "sustainable, justifiable" project between Hanover and North streets.

This is the first rumble in what could be a quake along the Greenway. The proposed YMCA of Greater Boston faces a similar construction challenge between New Sudbury and Market streets. Steep development costs based on geotechnical challenges could also upset construction plans for the New Center for Arts and Culture planned for the parcel between International Place and the Boston Harbor Hotel at Rowes Wharf. But developer Ron Druker, who chairs the New Center's board, thinks the project sits on more "terra firma" than the original Boston Museum site, and will benefit from both modest size and design features that work better with the ramps.

The Boston Museum move raises more than just engineering concerns. The original site was to include a visitors' center along a public concourse that would provide orientation movies and one-stop concierge services not currently available to tourists. The new downsized plan, says Keefe, will not emphasize a visitors' center. In fact, the entire museum concept seems to be shifting underfoot. The original plan focused on post-colonial Boston literary traditions, politics, and sports. But Keefe says it now includes the entire New England region, with state-of-the-art interactive exhibits.

Losing the visitors' center in the Boston Museum project shouldn't be a problem if the National Park Service makes good on a plan to build such a center at Faneuil Hall. But visitors may find little more than sod along the Greenway.

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Did the state/Pike/Massport/whoever(?) not do their due diligence at all? Did they vet all these untested groups to ensure their projects were remotely feasible? Does a hamster control the workings of the Great Oz of the Greenway?
 
The Boston history museum was one of several competitors for the southernmost ramp parcel. The New Center won this competition. The Big Dig then offered Parcel 12 to the history museum as an alternative.
 
^^I too recall the proposed clean up and rebuilding of the push cart market near the Millennium Hotel. In fact, the whole area bounded by Union St. is the oldest street pattern still existing in Boston (from the 17th C) and has been used as nothing more than a trash and parking area for the hotel. I would never buy anything sold from these old storehouses...especially the basements....
^I can never understand why "air rights" development is proposed and pushed by the city and state without a clear policy on getting such difficult construction off the ground financially. If we're going to build over tunnels, ramps and highways, an automatic funding by the state or feds should kick in to provide a safe platform on which to build. Given the history of such projects throughout the city, I'm surprised that the Bostonian Society, the Y, and others, did not anticipate the costs well before they hired architects and proposed designs.
 
What about MassHort's parcel near South Station? That would be a much better spot for the history museum than the little triangle aside Haymarket.

The MassHort parcel is fairly large, doesn't have the on/off ramp problems (as far as I can recall) and, being next to South Station, the Red Line and the bus depot, is a much more fitting location for a large visitors center.
 
But the history museum's parcels (both the old and new ones) are in a heavily touristed area, along the Freedom Trail.
 
Is this the same Frank Keefe as in the Commonwealth Hotel Fiasco?
 
The bike lanes discussion in the Comm Ave thread got me thinking about the Rose K Greeway. It seems so simple to me now--the Greenway should have been designed as a pedestrian thoroughfare with designated bike lanes down the center and wide sidewalks for outdoor seating/restaurants, akin to say, Blvd du Rochechouart.
 
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...and the porn theatres on that street would surely draw the sort of vivacity we'd all hope to see on the Greenway.

Seriously, that, and the Unter den Linden (similar model) are good precedents - for a much narrower, more intimate street. The Bvd. de Rochechouart is, I think, narrower even than Comm. Ave.
 
Having taking note of this a few times now in the past couple of weeks (since daylight savings time pushed the morning sunrise back an hour), I am confident to now say that, in my opinion, the Greenway from Rowes Wharf up to the Garden is pretty nice first thing in the morning.

With the sun not yet fully up, the various lighting devices are still on and they create an interesting blend of color, scale and contrast (especially with the orange old-style gas light street lights) at street level looking at the area as a whole (i.e. walking up Atlantic Ave).

Furthermore, recently the area has been demonstrably bereft of excess litter?maybe it just lucky timing on my part, but I do walk this route at least twice and usually 4 times per week going from South Station to Aquarium on my way in and out of the airport.

There was not much in the way of activity there at any of these recent times I have passed through, though I did not really expect there to be at 6:20-ish in the morning?there was a lady walking a boxer (more appropriately, letting the dog run around a bit) and the dog seemed to be having an exceptionally good time. I look forward to seeing what this space is like mid-afternoon on non-rainy days from mid-May to late-September, not to mention at 8:30pm on a July or August evening.

Admittedly I am no expert on the design of such spaces, and, as with most things, I am sure there are ways to improve it?particularly when viewed in hindsight. I feel compelled to say that this swath has a much better feel to it than what preceded it (Captain Obvious-like statement there) and that with a few years of maturation of the foliage combined with continued upkeep and the on-going development in and around this part of the city, it will really be quite an enjoyable place to be.
 
I spend an hour exploring it on monday because it was so nice out and I rather enjoyed it. It's certainly better than the elevated highway, and there were some (but not many) people just sittinh and enjoying the sun.

One funny note is that as much as the on/off ramps annoy us and we think they're a deterrant, I felt that the quitest parcel of the entire thing was the one between Oliver and High Streets. It felt like the two ramps almost acted as buffers to the noise from traffic on either side, and furthermore, I saw more people sitting on the benches here and playing on the grass than any of the other ones.

That may not be the norm, but that was what I observed on that particular Monday afternoon.
 
I like the Greenway, but I must admit I miss the elevated highway. It definitely made that area feel more "urban" and just the way it separated the North End and downtown was kind of a nice experience to go through. The overpass reminded me of Chicago's many overhead ramps for subways and whatnot. I don't know why the elevated highway had such a big impact on me, but I just remember it so clearly, and my family used to drive on it a lot, especially during the summer when we went down to the Cape Cod and had to drive through Boston. I miss driving on the highway and seeing the buildings around me and trying to find the top of building (I used to look straight up International Place). Ah sorry, I just have some fond memories from the elevated highway haha
 
If by urban you mean a run-down, ugly, noisy, congested, obsolete, polluting strip of metal and concrete than yes, the artery was indeed "urban." I, for one, think the artery completely killed everything that we usually place on the great pedestal of urbanity. Even if the Big Dig had left a strip of sand and gravel, it would've been better than the old artery.

The only merit it had was grit, if you can even call that a merit.
 
It is like when people are nostalgic for the Combat Zone. It may have looked cool on some level, but it was not really cool at all.
 
Scott said:
It is like when people are nostalgic for the Combat Zone. It may have looked cool on some level, but it was not really cool at all.
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It may not have been cool where it was but it should have been allowed to develop elsewhere. For being the seventh largest metro in the nation the adult entertainment options are pathetic. Thank God for Rhode Island.
 
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