Seaport Neighborhood - Infill and Discussion

Re: South Boston Seaport

Boston: It's a suburb, not a city! Thank you Mayor Menino and friends for helping us fix that pesky problem of "urbanity". The cure is obviously banality.

seaportmay106.jpg

seaportmay105.jpg

seaportmay104.jpg

seaportmay1001.jpg


Oh look. Grass.

seaportmay103.jpg


You could lay each building horizontally and they would still only scrape roofs. If that. You could probably lay the two buildings to the left roof-to-roof and then throw another tower in between them.

seaportmay101.jpg


Why does this building exist? No really, why did anyone think this was a good design? Oh, I love how they went for the "Oceangoing Cinderblock Made of Alucbond" look. That's the kind of innovation we need.

seaportmay102.jpg


This building never fails to make me sad.

seaportmay1002.jpg


Oh look. A city. Better get around to redeveloping it into some shadeless grass and isolated PoMo towers.

seaportmay1003.jpg
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

That LOUiS building is a disaster. It makes One Marina Park Drive look like the freaking Burj Khalafififdurkadurkamohammedjihad or whatever they call it these days.
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

That LOUiS building is a disaster. It makes One Marina Park Drive look like the freaking Burj Khalafififdurkadurkamohammedjihad or whatever they call it these days.

It would actually be nice as a small piece of a much denser development. I would imagine that finding it nestled in among larger buildings in a real neighborhood would be very nice. Here the store serves as a centerpiece. It just calls to attention everything that hasn't, and now probably won't happen in the area. The talk of it being permanent is disturbing, though the tradeoff is the ground is essentially salted against any truly terrible buildings emerging on that one spot. However the Fan Pier model earlier in this thread gives us all a good approximation of how relentlessly banal and downright ugly the rest of the site promises to be.

I'm moving out of Boston by the end of June. I hope to come back in ten years and find the area worth visiting for reasons that have nothing to do with my morbid curiosity as to how badly it has developed.
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

Why don't you just stay here and work really hard at trying to make things better?
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

If this clown couldn't develop Filene's especially with all the foot traffic downtown. How in the hell is Hynes going to handle Seaport?

Can somebody post this article. I'm not a subscriber to Banker Tradesman

Seaport Speedup
Ready Or Not, Here Comes Seaport Square
Hynes Says Groundbreaking Coming Soon


By Paul McMorrow

Banker & Tradesman Staff Writer
Yesterday

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

John Hynes wants to sprint out of the recession and begin work on the first million square feet of his multi-billion-dollar Seaport Square development project next year. To do so, he?ll have to meet an ambitious timeline, out-duel his South Boston neighbors, and swallow an unusual clawback provision from the city.
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

Here you go:

Ready Or Not, Here Comes Seaport Square
Hynes Says Groundbreaking Coming Soon



By Paul McMorrow
Banker & Tradesman Staff Writer
Yesterday


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

John Hynes wants to sprint out of the recession and begin work on the first million square feet of his multi-billion-dollar Seaport Square development project next year. To do so, he?ll have to meet an ambitious timeline, out-duel his South Boston neighbors, and swallow an unusual clawback provision from the city.

As CEO of Gale International, Hynes is the public face of the far-reaching proposal to turn 33 acres of parking lots along the South Boston waterfront into a new neighborhood of 20 city blocks and 6.3 million square feet of commercial and residential space. Gale?s equity partner is Morgan Stanley. WS Development is handling the project?s retail component.

The aggressive construction timeline appears to be a significant shift from last year. Speaking at an Urban Land Institute forum last May, Hynes painted a cautious, if not dour, picture of the project?s development future.

Then And Now

At the time, Hynes had just endured months of public beatings over the failure of One Franklin, the Gale-led redevelopment of the former Filene?s building in Downtown Crossing.

His personal relationship with Boston?s powerful mayor, Thomas Menino, was reportedly at a low point. Menino had previously castigated as a ?hare-brained idea? what Hynes believed to be one of the central elements of the Seaport Square plan: A private school to draw international executives to the South Boston waterfront. At the ULI event, he indicated that the full build-out of Seaport Square could be several years off.

A year later, the development environment, and Hynes himself, appear to be on firmer ground. Hynes has avoided Menino?s ire by mostly staying out of the Boston press ? with the exception of an appearance in the Boston Globe last month, in which he criticized developer Don Chiofaro, Menino?s primary development foil. Gale has also made several approving nods to the notion of South Boston as an innovation district, a concept Menino introduced at his January inauguration.

But most importantly, city development watchers say, at a time when development in the Seaport has slowed considerably, Hynes is laying plans to quickly remake an area that has long been a priority for City Hall.

A recent project filing with the Boston Redevelopment Authority said Gale expects to break ground on more than 1 million square feet of residential construction along Northern Avenue next year. The developers would follow that with 2.1 million square feet of residential, hotel and office space in 2012, and another 1.5 million square feet of residential and hotel in 2013.

?If we receive our permits from the City of Boston this year, we plan to break ground in 2011 on our first phase, assuming there is market demand for one or more of the uses we propose,? said Tom Palmer, a spokesman for the developers. ?And we believe there will be.?

Too Much, Too Soon?

Privately, some Hub developers are calling the plan overly-ambitious. They say it could be difficult for the entire city, let alone one neighborhood, to quickly absorb the volume of new space Hynes is talking about. They also note that the project?s abutters at Fan Pier and Pier 4 already have their permits in hand, but aren?t talking about the type of development timelines Hynes is.

Joe Fallon, developer of Fan Pier, told reporters after a recent NAIOP Massachusetts forum that he was eyeing a three-year timetable for getting a luxury residential tower in the ground.

?2011 seems a little optimistic from a permitting standpoint and a financing standpoint,? said Vivien Li, executive director of the Boston Harbor Association and a close observer of Boston development. ?I hope his optimism is based in reality. I would love to see four parcels start in 2011. It would be fabulous.?

Jack Hobbs, president and CEO of RF Walsh Collaborative Partners, said while the market for new office space remains years away, he?s seeing signs of the market turning for rental housing development in Boston.

?It depends on the individual deal, but the numbers look fairly good for those to happen,? he said. ?A bit longer term, condos could begin work too, based on the numbers I?ve seen.?

?It might be the right time to start condos down there, as well as high-end rental,? added David Begelfer, CEO of NAIOP Massachusetts. ?There is clearly an interest in retail for premier locations. Residential is intriguing. I wouldn?t be surprised to see a number of multi-family construction projects start work next year.?

Kairos Shen, chief planner for the BRA, said his agency wants to see Seaport Square roll out as planned. To prod the developers into action, the BRA will insert a clause in the project?s permits that would make its final phase contingent upon meeting a five-year deadline for getting 1 million square feet of construction in the ground.

?Part of the problem is, for the past 15 years, developers have had permits and they have not been acting on them,? Shen said. ?We want to make sure we have some provisions to incentivize the acceleration of development. It makes the developer more accountable.?

?If we start construction as planned, there is no concern about getting approval to go forward on our last phase,? Palmer said.

Financial pressures also appear to favor a swift build-out. Morgan Stanley purchased the 33-acre site for $204 million in 2006, financing the acquisition with a $155 million mortgage from Capmark Finance. That note has come due and been extended twice, first in September 2009, and then again in March. Seaport Square?s owners now have extension options that run through the end of 2013. Gale and Morgan Stanley anticipate having 4.7 million of the development?s 6.3 million square feet under construction by that point, according to their most recent filing with the BRA.
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

I hope this clown loses his shirt. I can't stand these people anymore. Hynes is just waiting for a bailout from the city on Filenes.


"Kairos Shen, chief planner for the BRA, said his agency wants to see Seaport Square roll out as planned"
Just like all your other half @ssed projects. This guy is the biggest moron at the BRA.
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

Nothing he says is based in reality. Talk is cheap - say the right things and maybe, just maybe, the Filene's folly will be bailed out.
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

To prod the developers into action, the BRA will insert a clause in the project?s permits that would make its final phase contingent upon meeting a five-year deadline for getting 1 million square feet of construction in the ground.

?Part of the problem is, for the past 15 years, developers have had permits and they have not been acting on them,? Shen said. ?We want to make sure we have some provisions to incentivize the acceleration of development. It makes the developer more accountable.?

Not to change the subject, but I think this move by the BRA is quite significant, and long overdue on the Waterfront.
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

South Boston skyline from Logan off ramp
410.jpg
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

I already screwed up downtown area why not move to the Seaport district.

http://www.bankerandtradesman.com/news139030.html

Seaport Square Developers To Take Risk, Go Small
By Paul McMorrow

Banker & Tradesman Staff Writer
Today

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The developers of Seaport Square, a 6-million-square-foot development on the South Boston waterfront, said they will be the first developers in Boston to test new models of workforce housing that shrink unit sizes and rely on shared amenities, transportation and public spaces.

Speaking yesterday at a City Hall symposium on bringing new, affordable housing models to South Boston, John Hynes, CEO of Boston Global Investors, said a shortage of affordable housing in Boston's urban core was hampering corporate growth.

"The answer is smaller units," Hynes said. "It's exactly what we believe the market wants. We need more affordable housing, retail and green space; you don't need a lot of cars. The risk is, it hasn't been done yet. You're going to have to convince your lenders and investors you have something worth investing in."

"Somebody has to go first," added John Buza, a managing director at Morgan Stanley, an equity partner in Seaport Square. "We're willing to be the first, and see if it works."

In January, Boston Mayor Thomas Menino announced plans to re-brand the South Boston waterfront as an innovation district. Menino said he wants to fill the neighborhood's warehouses and parking lots with technology companies, creative firms and business incubators, and with housing developments that keep those firms' workers in the city.

The City Hall symposium brought together architects with South Boston landowners to discuss how new European housing models might be applied along the waterfront.

"We can build more office towers and condos, but it would be anywhere else in America," Menino said. "This is the largest piece undeveloped land on the East Coast, and it has to be innovative. I hope out of this discussion will come new proposals and new ideas."

Several presentations pointed to Amsterdam, where developers have cut unit sizes, delivered partially-finished spaces, emphasized communal spaces and deemphasized costly parking spaces.

"Units are getting much smaller, and they need to get much smaller," said Brian Healy of Brian Healy Architects. The key to making small units work, Healy said, is "the relationship between private and public space."

"There's a sense of community in how the units interact with each other - you're constantly in touch with the people who live and work in the building," added David Hacin of Hacin + Assoc.

Hacin's firm designed Berkeley Investments' FP3 condominiums, and is currently designing the first residential building at Seaport Square.

Young Park, president of Berkeley Investments, said Boston's zoning code doesn't accommodate the kinds of live-work arrangements, shared spaces and dearth of parking that European housing models rely on.

Tim Pappas, president of Pappas Enterprises, said city officials must "help reset expectations in the public process," because the neighborhood groups that review development projects have come to demand ample parking and spacious unit sizes.

Kairos Shen, the Boston Redevelopment Authority's chief planner, agreed.

"The job of the BRA is to take these innovative ideas and make them the new norm," he said.
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

The developers of Seaport Square, a 6-million-square-foot development on the South Boston waterfront, said they will be the first developers in Boston to test new models of workforce housing that shrink unit sizes and rely on shared amenities, transportation and public spaces.
[...]
The City Hall symposium brought together architects with South Boston landowners to discuss how new European housing models might be applied along the waterfront.
[...]
Several presentations pointed to Amsterdam, where developers have cut unit sizes, delivered partially-finished spaces, emphasized communal spaces and deemphasized costly parking spaces.
[...]
Tim Pappas, president of Pappas Enterprises, said city officials must "help reset expectations in the public process," because the neighborhood groups that review development projects have come to demand ample parking and spacious unit sizes.

^^Isn't this exactly what most of us have been calling for?
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

I think this might be a good idea. Actually make new affordable housing units, not large luxury units w/ some set aside as affordable or subsidized. The Americans that acutally built this country used to live modestly, within their means. Nice to see us finally coming around full circle (granted microscopically fractional and only after an enourmous housing bubble burst).
 
Re: South Boston Seaport

And with no real neighborhood groups on the seaport, you'd think this would be an easy sell, right?

We'll see.

We'll also see if a 10mph crumbling bus tunnel is enough "shared transportation" to serve a neighborhood of young urban innovators.

That being said, I hope this is a success - the infrastructure can be improved after this becomes more of a neighborhood. I only hope it does.
 

Back
Top