Seaport Neighborhood - Infill and Discussion

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Ron Newman said:
Doesn't the city actually need the hotel rooms more than it needs the apartments? Housing can go anywhere, but hotels need to be near the convention center and other tourist attractions. The hotels should be made bigger than the current plans, though.
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The hotels that are proposed for D Street are the "mid-range" hotels that the BCEC is looking for. They are looking to build a larger Headquarters hotel in another close-by location.

But this is exactly my point - The city, especially the Seaport, needs new hotel rooms. Apartments are shooting up everywhere, hundreds of apartments are in development just blocks of this site - on both sides.

There is a demand for hotels, not only to support the BCEC expansion but also to accommodate the workers in the ID. As one of them, I can say that when coworkers from other offices fly into town they have a very, very hard time finding nearby rooms.

One of the main benefits of the ID is the proximity to Logan. Companies fly people in every day.. if there are no reasonable hotel rooms available this is no longer a benefit to the district. When my coworkers talk about the development in the area the first thing everyone says is "there needs to be more hotel rooms."

I understand that people are frustrated with how this went down and the fact that the site was approved for housing. Hotels and retail just make more sense to me in this location. Where else would we want them? Right on Seaport Blvd or in Fort Point? This is a perfect location to transition from the hustle-and-bustle of the Seaport to residential Southie -- and one that should have a constant flow of activity given the retail and foot traffic from conventioneers, hotel guests, and the thousands of current residents in the area (a rapidly growing section of residential southie is .3 miles from this site.)
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I recall 500 Boylston/222 Berkeley replacing a row of Boylston Street storefronts, including the notable Colton Building.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

ParkerChris said:
What is being squandered exactly?
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What's been squandered over the past decade? The potential of D Street to be a grand boulevard between South Boston and water's edge. The potential of D Street to contribute to the 24/7 livelihood of the waterfront.

Here's D Street today.

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ParkerChris, I hear your concern about the lack of hotel rooms in the district. Perhaps a private developer will build a privately financed hotel on privately owned property -- not likely in the environment we're talking about, but possible.

Ron Newman said:
Housing can go anywhere, but hotels need to be near the convention center and other tourist attractions.
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I've heard this line from BCEC and don't buy it, especially in Boston. BTW, what tourist attractions are you referring to in your defense of this site as preferable over residential development?
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Ron Newman said:
Doesn't the city actually need the hotel rooms more than it needs the apartments? Housing can go anywhere, but hotels need to be near the convention center and other tourist attractions. The hotels should be made bigger than the current plans, though.
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No. Boston has one of the highest housing costs in the nation, so I don't see how you can say that subsidized hotels are more important than market rate housing.

If you're adding hotels, this is probably the place to do it (Notwithstanding the excellent arguments Sicilian has made countless times about botching the opportunity to create a new neighborhood here). So, lets assume for a moment that we really do need 2,700 new hotel rooms near the BCEC, as MCCA has said repeatedly. We're getting 500 new rooms on nearly 6 acres. Based on the density of this development we'll need an area 1.5x as big as Fan Pier to fit all those hotel rooms. Why?

Because a little more than half of this site is being occupied by an above ground parking garage. I realize the garage is replacing a surface lot that will be occupied by the BCEC expansion (assuming it ever happens). So why not rebuild the surface lot on one extra level under the BCEC expansion?
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

AmericanFolkLegend said:
I realize the garage is replacing a surface lot that will be occupied by the BCEC expansion (assuming it ever happens). So why not rebuild the surface lot on one extra level under the BCEC expansion?
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Refer to the quote below:
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Here's the problem: When planning this district, the BRA acts like they have all the space in the world: ample room for wide roads, highway ramps, tracts of open space, single uses, surface garages. While it's true that the Seaport is a vast area - and therefore a great opportunity - this planning mindset results in Houston.

If only they would see it as a vast opportunity on a very finite (and height-restricted) plot of land we might get far more density and mixed use out of it. We should be thankful that Fan Pier is developing with as much density and mixed-use as it is; we won't see the same with D Street from what we're learning here.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Shepard said:
Here's the problem: When planning this district, the BRA acts like they have all the space in the world: ample room for wide roads, highway ramps, tracts of open space, single uses, surface garages. While it's true that the Seaport is a vast area - and therefore a great opportunity - this planning mindset results in Houston.

If only they would see it as a vast opportunity on a very finite (and height-restricted) plot of land we might get far more density and mixed use out of it. We should be thankful that Fan Pier is developing with as much density and mixed-use as it is; we won't see the same with D Street from what we're learning here.
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Best summary of the issue thus far.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

BostonUrbEx said:
Refer to the quote below:
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Well.... it would probably take 3 or 4 levels to replace a surface lot, but I still agree that's the way to go.

Need to factor in structure, ramps, booths, elevators, mech. space, elec. space, etc.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

LAST WEEK: Clear-eyed Globe opinion writer shines a light on Seaport as an office destination for established corporations.

http://imgur.com/hJQpo

LAST WEEK: Mayor's Office rebuts Globe writer, citing Zipcar among other firms as "saplings" arriving in the Innovation District. Zipcar recently signed a building lease in Fort Point.

http://imgur.com/TdXU0

THIS WEEK: Zipcar bought for $500 million.

http://www.nbcnews.com/business/avis-buying-zipcar-500-million-all-cash-deal-1C7785094

The folks at the BRA and Mayor's Office are going to have to work overtime to keep up with the mythology that Fort Point (with finite office space stock) and Seaport are going to serve garage startups and fledgling companies. I'd bank on 2-3 years before the new "Seaport Destination District" PR rolls out.

EDIT: Minor edit for clarity.
 
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Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

What about the innovation district?

EXCLUSIVE: Facebook shops Kendall Square office space for a return to Cambridge

Facebook is seeking space in Kendall Square for a Cambridge, Mass. office, close to MIT and the Boston-area offices of companies such as Microsoft, Google and Nokia.

Thomas Grillo
Real Estate Editor-
Boston Business Journal

Email | Twitter Facebook is poking around in Cambridge for office space it may “like.”

The $66 billion social networking company, founded in a Harvard University dorm by Mark Zuckerburg and friends, is seeking 7,000 square feet of space in Kendall Square to house three dozen software engineers that would be hired over the next six months, according to sources.

“They want to have a larger footprint here,” said one source. “They want to be near MIT to recruit staff and they want to be next to similar firms.”

Facebook (Nasdaq: FB), the Menlo Park, Calif.-based company that went public last year, has four employees in temporary space at 711 Atlantic Ave. at the edge of Boston’s Financial District. The sources said Facebook wants to be near other technology companies in Cambridge such as Microsoft Corp. (Nasdaq: MSFT), Google (Nasdaq: GOOG) and Nokia (NYSE: NOK).

Newmark Knight Frank, a Boston commercial real estate brokerage, is representing Facebook in the search, sources said. Brokers Ryan Weber and John Hennessey declined to comment.

Officials from Facebook have looked at Cambridge Center and One Kendall Square, the sources said. Boston Properties (NYSE: BXP), the owner of Cambridge Center, declined comment. Ashley Zandy, a Facebook spokeswoman, did not respond to a request for comment.

After a short time on Stuart Street in 2005, Facebook took space in the office of Student Advantage, at 280 Summer St. in South Boston. Facebook's sales team stayed there for about a year, before the office closed in mid-2006 as Facebook operations consolidated in California. The early sales effort in Boston played a role in helping to turn the site, then known as “Thefacebook,” into a legitimate business.
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Oops sorry.......... I thought Facebook might at least consider looking into the Innovation District. I guess the Mayor should promote more taxbreaks to a 65 Billion dollar corporation to at least look at the INNOVATION DISTRICT.

http://www.bizjournals.com/boston/real_estate/2013/03/facebook-boston-office-in-cambridge.html
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Sicilian said:
The folks at the BRA and Mayor's Office are going to have to work overtime to keep up with the mythology that Fort Point (with finite office space stock) and Seaport are going to serve garage startups and fledgling companies. I'd bank on 2-3 years before the new "Seaport Destination District" PR rolls out.
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http://masschallenge.org/
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

singbat said:
More: http://greenhornconnect.com/events/...2-Greenhorn_Newsletter_mar10&utm_medium=email

I can keep going...
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I don't think you get my point.

Startups, coworking cos and accelerators in Fort Point are occupying significant amounts of floor space that will be far too valuable within 10 years.

You don't just point to 500 tenants and declare a District based on what you see today. If that were the case, Fort Point would be called Fort Point Cultural District today. 10 years ago there were 1000 artists studios in those same spaces.

If a city wants to foster the evolution of an innovation economy where startups can exist, I'd suggest it start by identifying a district that has a 20 year window of affordability and building stock suitable for growth, not the most valuable real estate in the USA, already well along its trajectory by 2010 with $8B in public investment.

If you feel like naming all the young startups and coworking spaces enjoying Fort Point today, feel free.

Meanwhile dozens of cities worldwide are kicking Boston's butt with substantive long-term planning initiatives for innovation uses and districts. Among them, Cambridge, NYC, Tel Aviv, Madrid, etc. etc. etc.

EDIT: Added words "Cultural District" above.
 
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Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

The MassChallenge prize of a free cubicle in One Fan Pier is a clever marketing campaign for an empty building, nothing more.

One of my friends actually won a cube with his company, it was just a big unfinished floor full of young "entrepreneurs" asking each other too many annoying questions.
 
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