Seaport Square (Formerly McCourt Seaport Parcels)

[BuilditDenser]

It's good to see that M is under construction according to their own map

 

[CSTH]

Associated map:

1. Note that it looks like they intend to build over haul road / pike ramp air rights adjacent to the vent building (does / how does this interface with the 'sausage parcel'?)

2. Really hope they get Autumn Lane right - remember that there is also supposed to be an east-west pedestrian zone in the middle of parcel L (opening to the Seaport / B st. intersection) and it would be a shame if there were a block of loading doors and service entrances on Autumn Lane between the L-block pedestrian zone and this one.

 

[JumboBuc]

This looks like the Assembly Row (the street, not the project) of the Seaport: a quasi-pedestrianized, green-ish, retail-lined path through the middle of a new, built-from-the-ground-up district. The fact that this is news in Boston--while in Somerville it's just a no-big-deal of-course-this-was-always-in-the-plans detail--drives home just how badly planners on the southern side of the Charles have dropped the ball.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad they're doing this. But my biggest reaction is "wait, why wasn't this the plan from the start?"

Also, a grocery store in parcel N or P would be perfect.

On the name: Seriously. Name it after Menino, or Sean Collier, or somebody's dog. I don't care. Just pick a real street name for once.

Please no. I'd take "Harbor Way" over "Menino Way" any day. Government should be about informed policy making and public service, not the aggrandizement of egos. Every time we slap the name of a politician (or worse, a politician's spouse) on something, whether it's a road or a bridge or a neighborhood sign, we move away from this. But that's a discussion for another forum...

1. Note that it looks like they intend to build over haul road / pike ramp air rights adjacent to the vent building (does / how does this interface with the 'sausage parcel'?)

Good catch.

 

[odurandina]

i love this. sure as hell don't want it called Menino anything. South Boston infill projects/restoration, and Fort Point (it's alive)... big picture for South Boston/Fort Point/Seaport is really great.

 

[reverend_paco]

I put up a little video showing how this Seaport Hill is arranged.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XddbFtmq4oQ

Cool beans.

 

[PaulC]

^How about a raised pathway along the entirety of Harbor Way, connected to a raised pathway along Seaport Blvd, a la NY High Line

Your wish has been granted

a team that includes James Corner Field Operations, which designed the High Line

http://www.bostonherald.com/business/real_estate/2017/02/new_plans_for_seaport_square_project

 

[stick n move]

This looks...incredible

 

[jass]

YES

 

[vanshnookenraggen]

That's a laughably over optimistic rending I'd say. Look a where Harbor Sq is supposed to be, mid block with connecting streets that don't lead anywhere that will bring in foot traffic. Is there a direct route to the T? Nope. At the north end you have end end of Seaport Blvd so you aren't going to get direct traffic to-from downtown and the waterfront will take up most of the attraction.

This is only a way to pay for less open space and get more rental income, period. It was always designed as a little oasis in the neighborhood and hopefully it turns out that way but it sure as hell won't work as some old European city square.

 

[CSTH]

It's Assembly Row without the nostalgia.

And that's more than I've ever been willing to hope for in the seaport.

 

[BostonDrew]

This looks...incredible

They need to post the high resolution renders ASAP!

 

[odurandina]

That's a laughably over optimistic rending I'd say....

Even if it fails to live up to the grandness of the render, i still love it. Will we be forced to call it something 'Menino.'

Unfortunately, compromises have to be made and the Seaport District has to have some kind of indoor, car-accessible retail. Otherwise, it will never be the kind of 24/7/365 destination everybody would like it to be....

Will this end the streak of donuts, coffee, juicing and sandwiches?

 

[curcuas]

If they're serious about several thousand units of housing, plus hotels, plus more not part of seaport square/fan pier, why exactly would car dependent retail be needed?

 

[stick n move]

That's a laughably over optimistic rending I'd say. Look a where Harbor Sq is supposed to be, mid block with connecting streets that don't lead anywhere that will bring in foot traffic. Is there a direct route to the T? Nope. At the north end you have end end of Seaport Blvd so you aren't going to get direct traffic to-from downtown and the waterfront will take up most of the attraction.

This is only a way to pay for less open space and get more rental income, period. It was always designed as a little oasis in the neighborhood and hopefully it turns out that way but it sure as hell won't work as some old European city square.

I have to ask, what then should they have proposed for it to be good enough?

 

[Sicilian]

I have to ask, what then should they have proposed for it to be good enough?

With the new plan, long-anticipated Seaport Hill Park was jettisoned. Seaport Hill Park should be restored.

Seaport Hill Park was seen as an important active recreational greenspace for 3000+ residents yet to arrive at M Block, Via and Benjamin (~1600 units).

Here's a look at Seaport Hill Park over the years, as BPDA approved an increase in massing. At right is from the new Master Plan published in the Globe.

Seaport Hill Park was first conceived in Seaport Square Project Notification Form (2008).

Seaport Hill Park (at right, below) was approved in Seaport Square Master Plan (2010, PDA #78) after a 2-year public process.

Another park that had been planned as greenspace on Seaport Square, Seaport Square Green (at left, below), now accommodates District Hall, Fallen Heroes monument (hardscape) a planned food court and a small lawn.

My suggestion for WS Development is to restore Seaport Hill Park and continue with planned promenade.

Seaport Hill Park is shown here restored (red arrow). Building massing increases approved through PDA amendments since Master Plan approval in 2010 are maintained.

The Master Plan published in the Globe suggests a significant increase in massing since Seaport Square's Master Plan was last amended. Increases in massing appear around Seaport Hill and at Blocks N and P.

It's important to note that in the approved Master Plan, the slim buildings surrounding Seaport Hill Park were planned to be residential. Today I think it's unlikely Seaport Square will meet the 2,500 housing unit objective approved and widely announced in 2010.

Edit: Typos, syntax, added carriage returns. No change to content.

 

[Cortes]

At the risk of seeming callous, I actually fail to see the need for any park or open space here at all. Forgive me if I think that the harbor is a 5 minute walk. Parcel Q is 1 minute away, or the D st. playground at convention center, never mind the gosh darn Children's Museum. If it weren't for the FAA, I would advocate for a 1000 foot building at so called "Seaport Hill".

The place is going to be shrouded in shadows no matter what, which will dictate short little trees and stupid little artistically arranged plantings. Just actually think about what a "park" at this location would look like.

So build it. I want as tall and dense as possible. Placate us with dreams of prominadas, but please, I will stroll down other places.

 

[stick n move]

His point was that this will never have the foot traffic to justify an open space like this so how does having an even bigger open space in the seaport hill plan solve anything? The only difference is even more space is wasted if people are not going to go there in the first place. My point in asking was that if you ask 5 different people youll get 5 different answers. No matter what it proposed someone will not like it, but they listened to the complaints and came back with a very solid proposal. Its never going to be perfect, but I think most people would agree this a fairly good design. Maybe they wont, who cares.

 

[Sicilian]

At the risk of seeming callous, I actually fail to see the need for any park or open space here at all. Forgive me if I think that the harbor is a 5 minute walk. Parcel Q is 1 minute away, or the D st. playground at convention center, never mind the gosh darn Children's Museum. If it weren't for the FAA, I would advocate for a 1000 foot building at so called "Seaport Hill".

The place is going to be shrouded in shadows no matter what, which will dictate short little trees and stupid little artistically arranged plantings. Just actually think about what a "park" at this location would look like.

So build it. I want as tall and dense as possible. Placate us with dreams of prominadas, but please, I will stroll down other places.

I'd venture a guess that yours is the prevailing view on ArchBoston. It's never been easy to make the case for tangible and intangible benefits of parks.

A grass lawn at Q Park and a highly manicured Fan Pier green are insufficient for the types of active, recreational uses found in districts of the anticipated density here. During M Block approvals at BPDA (~800 units) Seaport Hill Park was highlighted in illustrations for use as a proximate, valuable amenity.

LawnOnD is roughly a 1/2 mile walk from Seaport Hill. LawnOnD is not a public park, nor does it offer even remotely the hours or access of a public park. And BCEC's plan for LawnOnD was to ramp down its investment in favor of revenue from private events.

As for sunlight, I think there are likely examples of parks of this scale that receive reasonable sunlight and are embraced by residents of their neighborhoods. I have not done the research but IMO "shrouded in shadows" fails to capture what's entirely possible, as originally envisioned.

 

[FortPointGuy]

Allow someone who lives here to weigh in. The Fort Point/Seaport area has fantastic park amenities already and it is only going to get better.

Q Park is basically a giant dog park during the morning and evening. The rest of the day it is for humans, especially during the warmer months.

Channel Center has given us a very nice park for all kinds of uses, dogs, adults and kidos alike.

The existing park next to the kids museum is slated for an imminent massive overhaul.

Beyond that we have the heroes memorial next to the innovation center and of course the maligned but beautiful (and dog free!) fan pier park.

From fan pier park you can walk along the water west to the fan pier residence buildings, which have park land, and the courthouse which has park land, or to the east where a park will be built at the edge of Pier 4.

The ICA has great outdoor public space and hosts outdoor events 5-6 months a year with beer and wine.

And now, apparently, we will have a pedestrian way (instead of a road) stepping down from Summer Street to Northern Avenue.

As a local I could not be more happy with how park land in the Fort Point / Seaport area has played out. I think some of these comments to the contrary are nakedly anti-capitalist and partisan in nature, all due respect. Or maybe I'm too ignorant to realize I live in park-deficient dump. Didn't feel that way when my dog was catching balls at fan pier park this morning (we bend the rules in the winter) while I had Logan, J's Point, Chelsea, Charlestown, North End and downtown in my periphery while standing on grass.

 

[datadyne007]

Seaport Hill Park was first conceived in Seaport Square Project Notification Form (2008).

Seaport Hill Park (at right, below) was approved in Seaport Square Master Plan (2010, PDA #78) after a 2-year public process.


My suggestion for WS Development is to restore Seaport Hill Park and continue with planned promenade.

Seaport Hill Park is shown here restored (red arrow). Building massing increases approved through PDA amendments since Master Plan approval in 2010 are maintained.

Thank you for this fantastic post and I wholeheartedly agree with you. This park looks like it could have been one of the premier urban spaces in Boston. The massing of the residential buildings around the park & the park itself all had the right scales to them. Additionally, the park was shown to have mature trees. All the new Seaport Parks are barren expanses of grass, have limited thin trees (arranged in painfully coordinated patterns) and/or hardscape.

To those saying there are not enough people to make Seaport Hill Park a success, that whole L3-L6 block were planned to be residential units. That is more than enough people to populate that right-sized green, let alone everyone else moving into the other Seaport parcels, flocking to this park because it's the only one that's properly designed.

The L3-L6 "Residential Square" of the master plan was *always* my favorite part of the entire Seaport Square plan. I'm saddened to see it eliminated.