The Hub on Causeway (née TD Garden Towers) | 80 Causeway Street | West End

Re: TD Garden Towers

This is the part of the city that already has the buzzing before the game thing down already. It's the rest that is missing.

Have you been on those blocks before game? The bars, the barkers, the scalpers, the street vendors? Buzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz like a beehive.

Now, all other times of day? It's a beehive in January. Quiet. Till night fall, the bars do good again.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

Too bad the fauxcade is brick precast. Why not art deco, since that was what got ripped down? Might make it more funky.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

^ This city desperately needs more deco.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

Anyone see this in the filing:

"Boston Properties, Inc. and Delaware North Companies, Inc. acknowledge with
appreciation the professionalism of the staff of the Boston Redevelopment Authority in
bringing this project forward."

Not sure if this is their attempt at brown nosing, or sarcasm.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

Isn't that pretty standard language the BRA gives developers to use?
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

I only have one reservation about this:

Places like Maple Leaf Square in Toronto were built at the same time as new arenas. The Garden is now a 20-year-old facility.

What happens in 10 years (which is how long this will all take to build) when the Bruins and/or Celtics decide they want a new arena? 25-35 years seems to be the going lifespan for these facilities these days, and some sort of reverse site swap back to the old Garden site won't be possible once these towers are built. Given that there actually was some rumbling from commentators a couple of years ago that the Celtics would try to get out from under the Bruins' thumb by building a basketball-specific arena in the Seaport District, it's plausible that in a decade or so the teams would look to move out.

Does this development anticipate that at all? It doesn't make it a bad idea, since a rebuilt North Station could still be an anchor to a dense urban neighborhood here, but we should have learned in the last ten years that a sports stadium is really not a thing a neighborhood can count on.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

Oh, don't taunt me with notions of replacing the Garden. It was the worst of '90s corporate architecture when it was built and I've loathed the aesthetics since day 1.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

Yeah, unfortunately the Garden was replaced a few years before they actually started building these things with money. Of course the Devils are borderline bankrupt now, they built a beautiful facility. The Stars got a nice new home. Most of them give more thought to the exterior as well as retail and/or restaurants in the base as opposed to single use.

A Celtics only arena makes no sense to me. What's the point? They get gate at the Garden. Jacobs makes out because he owns the Bruins and the concessions (where the real money is). The C's would build and arena, and be paying the debt off on it for 10 years, they would hire a concessionaire to run the food, and be in no better place than they are now, plus trying to fill all there dates when there are so many other venues around already.

Hockey first arenas make so much more sense because of the infrastructure requirements, and different systems associated with the ice (creation, maintaining, and disposing) with basketball as tenants. Basketball requires a floor and hoops (which can be installed anywhere at anytime as we have seen.) Hell, the NCAA brings there own floor and puts that down for the Final Four (have floor will travel) in lieu of the Parquet.

In many markets the above may not work as well as hockey is not a big draw, but in Boston 41 home games for both franchises typically sell out or come close to it.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

Seamus hit the nail on the head regarding the Celtics. They play basketball at the Garden RENT FREE and get to keep the ticket revenue.

It's a good deal for both teams.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

I've been to a number of "new" arenas over the years, and the difference between the pre 1998 arenas (Garden) and post 1998 arenas (Toronto, Pittsburgh) is stark. The fact that the upper deck seats at the garden are all plastic without cushioning is still dumbfounding to me.

The upper deck seating in Phoenix, Pittsburgh, and Toronto not only have cushions, they even have cupholders.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

Maybe when they get to building the new Garden they'll be able to negotiate with feds and take over O'Neill's building?
Or maybe they'll get Spaulding's old lot?

I'm not sure what in the current development needs to change to anticipate their possible move?
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

Smartiro said:
Maybe when they get to building the new Garden they'll be able to negotiate with feds and take over O'Neill's building?
Or maybe they'll get Spaulding's old lot?

I'm not sure what in the current development needs to change to anticipate their possible move?
Click to expand...

Not too much, just expectations. This development is very attractively designed to incorporate the arena entrance into the streetwall, which is wonderful as long as the Garden exists. All I'm saying is that if the Garden will be 30+ years old by the time this opens, we shouldn't be expecting this to be a sports-and-nightlife-centric neighborhood forever.

It's probably not a problem. This is being developed by the arena management, after all.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

I'd prefer to see the TD Garden improved rather than replaced (again). It's wasteful to keep building new stadia and arenas every 30 years. The Roman Colosseum is still in use today ;-)
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

First off, there is 0 need for the Bruins nor Celtics to relocate for any logical reason. Even as the Garden becomes obsolete, its structure is built properly to allow transformations and growth. And yes, it would be wasteless to build another new arena.

Now let's say hypothethically that the garden was suddenly not there. What would you expect at this location? Furthermore, I would think that all of the surrounding restaurants, bars, and sports shops would have to reinvent themselves way more than a pair of high condo/retail/office buildings.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

Are either the Celts or the B's complaining about the Garden? It is no gem of an arena, but it does the job. I actually prefer it to the old dilapidated Garden with its obstructed views, narrow walkways and humidity problems. I will now go and hide as I verbally get my butt handed to me. :)
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

AmericanFolkLegend said:
Seamus hit the nail on the head regarding the Celtics. They play basketball at the Garden RENT FREE and get to keep the ticket revenue.

It's a good deal for both teams.
Click to expand...


If the real money is in concessions (which I agree with) how is the current arrangement a good deal for the Celtics for the long term? Sure moving into their own facility will result in a lot of debt initially but at some point, those costs are paid down or reduced significantly and then the team can enjoy the benefits of concession sales AND ticket revenue. If the Celtics had the interest and did this right in terms of facility and location, I don't see why they couldn't steal most of the non-Celtics/Bruins bookings away from the Garden where anyone who has been to a concert will tell you the sound is sub par in a large portion of the building. I sat in the upper deck of the Garden for the Prince concert a few years back and the sound was deplorable. I will never sit up there for a concert again.
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

BosDevelop said:
If the real money is in concessions (which I agree with) how is the current arrangement a good deal for the Celtics for the long term? Sure moving into their own facility will result in a lot of debt initially but at some point, those costs are paid down or reduced significantly and then the team can enjoy the benefits of concession sales AND ticket revenue. If the Celtics had the interest and did this right in terms of facility and location, I don't see why they couldn't steal most of the non-Celtics/Bruins bookings away from the Garden where anyone who has been to a concert will tell you the sound is sub par in a large portion of the building. I sat in the upper deck of the Garden for the Prince concert a few years back and the sound was deplorable. I will never sit up there for a concert again.
Click to expand...

But they would have to own and operate an entire arena and collect concession revenue for only half the number of sporting events (compared to combined hockey and basketball).
 
Re: TD Garden Towers

SeamusMcFly said:
Yeah, unfortunately the Garden was replaced a few years before they actually started building these things with money. Of course the Devils are borderline bankrupt now, they built a beautiful facility. The Stars got a nice new home. Most of them give more thought to the exterior as well as retail and/or restaurants in the base as opposed to single use.

A Celtics only arena makes no sense to me. What's the point? They get gate at the Garden. Jacobs makes out because he owns the Bruins and the concessions (where the real money is). The C's would build and arena, and be paying the debt off on it for 10 years, they would hire a concessionaire to run the food, and be in no better place than they are now, plus trying to fill all there dates when there are so many other venues around already.

Hockey first arenas make so much more sense because of the infrastructure requirements, and different systems associated with the ice (creation, maintaining, and disposing) with basketball as tenants. Basketball requires a floor and hoops (which can be installed anywhere at anytime as we have seen.) Hell, the NCAA brings there own floor and puts that down for the Final Four (have floor will travel) in lieu of the Parquet.

In many markets the above may not work as well as hockey is not a big draw, but in Boston 41 home games for both franchises typically sell out or come close to it.
Click to expand...

Besides the last couple of years the Jacob brothers have been very fortunate owning the Garden.
Hockey was a complete mess during the strike season and the Bruins game were barely selling 1/2 their tickets until they made that amazing NHL Stanely Cup run. The only thing keeping the Jacob Brothers from not going bankrupt have been the Celtics since most of their games fill most of the arena.

Also didn't the city give the Jacob Brothers this land for free to develop 10 years ago?

Overall the Jacob Brothers are very cheap (just ask their employees at Delaware North)

If the Boston Celtics had savvy business owners they would have put the Jacob Brothers in a bad spot when Hockey was on Strike and forced them to sell the Garden to the Celtics organization or the Celtics Move. No Garden no games. This would have bankrupted the Jacob Brothers. I'm sure the Celtics were probably under sometype of Contract to not consider this option.

But overall Disney on Ice or the Ciricus is not going to cover their expenses on this building if the Celtics moved as Hockey was on strike.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top