Back Bay Garage Tower | Dartmouth and Stuart | Back Bay

odurandina said:
Extremely hot day in LA... Hollywood (91F) so, we're on the Beach in Malibu (75F) watching boobs and longboards.

Waves are thigh/waist high with an occasional sweetie with nice curves shooting third point Dora style...
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Archboston. Where I come to get my daily dose of 'bro'.
 
KentXie said:
No, this should not be considered a blight area. They could have the most amazing project proposed here and they should still not get any tax break because this is just abusing the system.
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The grand irony of all is that the BRA declared the site "blighted" in the 60s and eventually built the garage a decade+ later. Now BP wants to declare the garage blighted!
 
odurandina said:
Waves are thigh/waist high with an occasional sweetie with nice curves shooting third point Dora style...
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Can you say "tabla de surf"?

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datadyne007 said:
The grand irony of all is that the BRA declared the site "blighted" in the 60s and eventually built the garage a decade+ later. Now BP wants to declare the garage blighted!
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+1
 
Last edited:
Extremely hot day in LA... Hollywood (91F) so, we're on the Beach in Malibu (75F) watching boobs and longboards.

Waves are thigh/waist high with an occasional sweetie with nice curves shooting third point Dora style...
Click to expand...

It's spring break for k-12, let me guess you're with your parents OR?

I'd make comment about boobs and this website, but I'll try to rise above and stifle myself
 
Suffolk 83 said:
It's spring break for k-12, let me guess you're with your parents OR?

I'd make comment about boobs and this website, but I'll try to rise above and stifle myself
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I'm still trying to figure out what "shooting third point Dora style" means.
 
HalcyonEra said:
I'm still trying to figure out what "shooting third point Dora style" means.
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I believe it's a comment on the architecture of this proposal, what with there being three major structures-- that's the "shooting third point"-- and the office component designed by Pelli, a prominent Spanish-speaking American from south of the border, much like young Dora the Explorer. It's a crude reference, but a decent point nonetheless.

:rolleyes:
 
DZH22 said:
I think it's time for Boston Properties to sell the site. I'm sure another developer can eventually build something worthy of being there, and not just a gigantic glass stump wall. Because that's what this is, a big fatty and it doesn't matter if it's 200' or 900' when the ground experience is just going to be an overbearing wall. (kind of like the way Aquarium garage blocks everything even though it's just a short garage)

BP already has its hands full with its mediocre treatment of the North Station Towers. (solid podium notwithstanding) If they need a tax break to build in the heart of the high spine, they are not the right developer for the job. These guys are blowing 2 of the most prime sites in the entire city with completely inappropriate massing. For instance, EVEN MENINO would have let them build 600'+ for the NS residential tower. They really left something (iconic) on the table with that one. Now we have a mediocre, fat stack of blocks for a site that should be another Hancock sized tower. Another 1 Liberty, another Key Tower, another BOA (Charlotte).... Yet instead we get Kendall-sized boxes in the heart of the "high" spine. I really really hate these guys.
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DZH -- Yes it superficially looks like place for a 300m class tower [even by the FAA's maps] however the site is much more of real development challenge than you seem to believe.

Look at the package submitted the BRA and you can see all the highway and T and Amtrak stuff running right on the surface and just below in the original railroad cut. The result is that the amount of "Terra Firma" upon which you can easily place a foundation for a major structure is quite limited -- hence the plans to demolish the parking garage drum ramps

Then there is the major issue of ventilation especially finding the places for the intakes and exhausts amongst a number of taller buildings. Of course all of the ventilation issues would be minimal if the T was to electrify everything inside Rt-128 [not likely in the near future] -- so until fuel cells and hydrogen replace diesel -- ventilation is always going to be a major requirement.


So -- Blighted is probably the wrong term -- but challenging is probably appropriate and you can argue that the tax abatement might be justified as there are some Big Dig aspects to this one.
 
whighlander said:
DZH -- Yes it superficially looks like place for a 300m class tower [even by the FAA's maps] however the site is much more of real development challenge than you seem to believe.

Look at the package submitted the BRA and you can see all the highway and T and Amtrak stuff running right on the surface and just below in the original railroad cut. The result is that the amount of "Terra Firma" upon which you can easily place a foundation for a major structure is quite limited -- hence the plans to demolish the parking garage drum ramps

Then there is the major issue of ventilation especially finding the places for the intakes and exhausts amongst a number of taller buildings. Of course all of the ventilation issues would be minimal if the T was to electrify everything inside Rt-128 [not likely in the near future] -- so until fuel cells and hydrogen replace diesel -- ventilation is always going to be a major requirement.


So -- Blighted is probably the wrong term -- but challenging is probably appropriate and you can argue that the tax abatement might be justified as there are some Big Dig aspects to this one.
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I have to agree with Whighlander on this. The Back Bay Garage/Station site is essentially a giant air rights parcel. Very limited terra firma. Plus BP has to deal with fixing the station. And as was pointed out the station and the air rights aspects create a ventilation nightmare; all of which cost money to fix.

While "blighted" is the wrong term, it is the only term that works under Urban Renewal authority. We actually need to have a term for "developmentally complex" (for things like air rights -- things we want to see developed, but that do not make total market sense).
 
Thanks for the tip. Flew under my radar. I've re-tweeted from TransitMatters for more visibility.

I like the increased retail, reallocation of underutilised space. Interesting how much they've taken away from CR waiting areas and are squeezing MBTA fare control to fit the retail... I'm moderately concerned about capacity for throughput during AM rush (more intense/concentrated than PM rush which tends to be spread out from 4-6:30). I wonder how much of this has been informed by an audit of existing ped counts measured through something like Placemeter.

At first glance, that doesn't look like nearly enough room for the kinds of queues I sometimes see in front of the Amtrak and CR ticket booths. Also looks like they're making less prominent the stairs to the Dartmouth St underpass and westernmost Orange Line platform entrance; should be okay with the introduction of the second fare gates at the east stairs that line up with the exact centre of the train.

Airflow improvements look great. Just hoping we get a top-down deep clean of the station, from roof to top-of-rail.

My next question is where Keolis thinks it's going to put its fare gates for its 'ring of steel' (wow...really?...). Looks like the two portals to the Worcester line platforms would actually get a corridor that would make sense for a gateline thanks to the new retail. For NEC/Providence Main Line, would they add a gateline at the tops of the stairs or before the waiting area, putting the restrooms inside fare control.

Also, do we still not have any idea if the terms of the agreement with BP stipulates a percent of revenue or a fixed rate - if any - back to the T or does the benefit to the T only extend as far as station redevelopment and ongoing maintenance?
 
DigitalSciGuy said:
Thanks for the tip. Flew under my radar. I've re-tweeted from TransitMatters for more visibility.

I like the increased retail, reallocation of underutilised space. Interesting how much they've taken away from CR waiting areas and are squeezing MBTA fare control to fit the retail... I'm moderately concerned about capacity for throughput during AM rush (more intense/concentrated than PM rush which tends to be spread out from 4-6:30). I wonder how much of this has been informed by an audit of existing ped counts measured through something like Placemeter.

At first glance, that doesn't look like nearly enough room for the kinds of queues I sometimes see in front of the Amtrak and CR ticket booths. Also looks like they're making less prominent the stairs to the Dartmouth St underpass and westernmost Orange Line platform entrance; should be okay with the introduction of the second fare gates at the east stairs that line up with the exact centre of the train.

Airflow improvements look great. Just hoping we get a top-down deep clean of the station, from roof to top-of-rail.

My next question is where Keolis thinks it's going to put its fare gates for its 'ring of steel' (wow...really?...). Looks like the two portals to the Worcester line platforms would actually get a corridor that would make sense for a gateline thanks to the new retail. For NEC/Providence Main Line, would they add a gateline at the tops of the stairs or before the waiting area, putting the restrooms inside fare control.

Also, do we still not have any idea if the terms of the agreement with BP stipulates a percent of revenue or a fixed rate - if any - back to the T or does the benefit to the T only extend as far as station redevelopment and ongoing maintenance?
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DigSciGuy -- What they need are some large OLED Wall Panels with, news, weather, maps -- but featuring the ability to let a visitor connect by Bluetooth and control what is displayed

You should be able to chose one of a few dozen slides of what the immediate area has looked like over the past few hundreds of years. This is the ideal place to tell the story of Back Bay:

  • what it looked like just after the Glaciers Retreated
  • the power dam along Beacon St
  • the Filling of the Back Bay and the original construction
    • BPL, Trinity and New Old South
  • the original Back Bay Station with the extensive rail yards,
  • the building of the "Weather Beacon John Hancock
    • the discovery of the Fish Weir
  • The coming of the Turnpike Extension
  • The Pru
  • 200 Clarendon aka the JHT
    • and all the recent construction added in the past 40 years
 
Whigh, exactly how much money do you have invested in OLED Wall Panel manufactures?
 
statler said:
Whigh, exactly how much money do you have invested in OLED Wall Panel manufactures?
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Statler -- that's a good question -- nothing that I know explicitly although Analog Devices makes some chips that can help with the display

However, there are possible investments made by mutual funds, pension funds, insurance companies [through annuities] with which I participate -- so I'm guessing there might be a few $ to perhaps a few hundred $

But -- I get your point -- I just hope that fellow AB-ers get my point -- OLED technology will revolutionize the way we think of walls [particularly interior walls] and other surfaces which today we might paint, stain or clad - -well we can put pictures, ads, maps, messages, etc, -- pretty much at our will and whim and available to our beck and call

For example at the MOS as part of the redo of the Entrance Lobby and the Yawkey Gallery on the Charles River display panels were installed on the underside of the bridge connecting the Blue and green Wings and on the ceiling above the Bridge

These are currently programmed by the staff of the Planetarium so the bent is decidedly astronomical and geological -- but there is no reason that MOS visitors shouldn't have a hand at choosing an image to be displayed for a few seconds.

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How many threads are you going to post the MoS renovation pix in??
 
Blackdog said:
No way this could backfire, certainly no one would display hardcore adult videos
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Blackdog -- the idea is based on a closed system -- just as you are limited to viewing with your set top box the channels that your cable provider provides to you -- all you could view with your phone would be a list of prepared images or videos

I'd deem that fairly safe
 
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