COVID-19 in Boston

Nibbles O’Plenty

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Very helpful primer on their COVID countermeasures, thanks. I still believe that casinos are uniquely susceptible to suffering from viral outbreaks given all of the touching that would normally take place--high-fives, handshakes, hugs, yelling, etc., etc. But that, of course, does not mean that a casino can't be run safely during a pandemic, provided management is extremely vigilant. But is a casino inherently less "fun" if it's being run responsibly during a pandemic? I don't know...
And subways and CVS and Macy’s are safer? Was at the casino last week and I felt perfectly safe…as can possibly be these days.
 

Johnnyrocket891

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How is this place open? This is a COVID-19 spreading nightmare
How is this not a public health crisis for allowing the casino to spread the virus throughout the area.
Encore is not a essential business and this is why these areas are so highly infected with the virus.

If a casino can be open then every other business should be allowed to conduct business accordingly to safety restrictions.
 

DBM

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And subways and CVS and Macy’s are safer? Was at the casino last week and I felt perfectly safe…as can possibly be these days.
The last time I checked, neither the MBTA nor CVS nor Macy's included as a key component of their operational plan the strategy of plying their patrons with as many intoxicating beverages as possible so as to... loosen their inhibitions and... impair their judgment... in order to extract maximum revenues from them.

So, yes, I'd imagine that trio as being orders of magnitude safer, as venues.

[although I thought I remember reading that the MGC prohibited comping booze to players, so perhaps I should qualify my comparison to limit it to all casinos where booze-comping is permitted--which is still probably, what, 95%-plus in the world?]
 

Johnnyrocket891

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The last time I checked, neither the MBTA nor CVS nor Macy's included as a key component of their operational plan the strategy of plying their patrons with as many intoxicating beverages as possible so as to... loosen their inhibitions and... impair their judgment... in order to extract maximum revenues from them.

So, yes, I'd imagine that trio as being orders of magnitude safer, as venues.

[although I thought I remember reading that the MGC prohibited comping booze to players, so perhaps I should qualify my comparison to limit it to all casinos where booze-comping is permitted--which is still probably, what, 95%-plus in the world?]

The entire point g of social distancing is keeping people away from each so the virus doesn't spread. Please tell me how keeping a casino open helps with the spread of the virus?
How is this venue allowed to be open when people are dying?
 

Nibbles O’Plenty

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The last time I checked, neither the MBTA nor CVS nor Macy's included as a key component of their operational plan the strategy of plying their patrons with as many intoxicating beverages as possible so as to... loosen their inhibitions and... impair their judgment... in order to extract maximum revenues from them.

So, yes, I'd imagine that trio as being orders of magnitude safer, as venues.

[although I thought I remember reading that the MGC prohibited comping booze to players, so perhaps I should qualify my comparison to limit it to all casinos where booze-comping is permitted--which is still probably, what, 95%-plus in the world?]
Maybe you have not been there. Drink service is usually exceptionally infrequent…and many times nonexistent on many visits. The casino bar is closed. You can only buy a drink at a restaurant there with food. The statement that plying with drinks to the point of intoxication is their strategy is a stretch at this place.
 
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dshoost88

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How is this venue allowed to be open when people are dying?
The answer to your question is in one of your previous posts.

allowed to conduct business accordingly to safety restrictions.
Massachusetts Gaming Commission and Governor Baker's Administration have placed safety restrictions on casinos just like they have other businesses. Encore is a 200,000 square foot gaming venue with 50% of the gaming positions shut down. They have shut down the buffet indefinitely; the nightclub is shut down indefinitely; Garden Cafe, Waterfront, Oyster Bar, Sinatra, and now Mystique restaurants continue to be closed; and with the 9am to 9pm operating hours restrictions placed in recent weeks (just like other businesses across the state), the 5-star resort decided to shut down their hotel as well.

It was reported earlier this week that from the time the Commonwealth's casinos and slot parlor reopened in June, 80 out of up to 6300 employees tested positive for COVID-19... a rate on par with the median rate of cases in Massachusetts during the same time frame. They have been allowed to conduct business according to safety restrictions just like every other business in the US; they have paid penalties for group gatherings just like others across the US.

I've gone to the resort somewhat regularly for a dinner or gaming every few weeks since it's reopened. Much like before the pandemic, the Encore Boston Harbor is one of the cleanest facilities you can walk into--it's what they do well. I've also tested negative for COVID-19 five times over the course of this pandemic... because wearing masks, washing hands, and socially distancing not only work, but are also not mutually exclusive from visiting a resort.
 

Johnnyrocket891

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The answer to your question is in one of your previous posts.



Massachusetts Gaming Commission and Governor Baker's Administration have placed safety restrictions on casinos just like they have other businesses. Encore is a 200,000 square foot gaming venue with 50% of the gaming positions shut down. They have shut down the buffet indefinitely; the nightclub is shut down indefinitely; Garden Cafe, Waterfront, Oyster Bar, Sinatra, and now Mystique restaurants continue to be closed; and with the 9am to 9pm operating hours restrictions placed in recent weeks (just like other businesses across the state), the 5-star resort decided to shut down their hotel as well.

It was reported earlier this week that from the time the Commonwealth's casinos and slot parlor reopened in June, 80 out of up to 6300 employees tested positive for COVID-19... a rate on par with the median rate of cases in Massachusetts during the same time frame. They have been allowed to conduct business according to safety restrictions just like every other business in the US; they have paid penalties for group gatherings just like others across the US.

I've gone to the resort somewhat regularly for a dinner or gaming every few weeks since it's reopened. Much like before the pandemic, the Encore Boston Harbor is one of the cleanest facilities you can walk into--it's what they do well. I've also tested negative for COVID-19 five times over the course of this pandemic... because wearing masks, washing hands, and socially distancing not only work, but are also not mutually exclusive from visiting a resort.
Why even take the chance for this type of venue to be open when you can spread the virus? The casino is not an essential business. It only justifies entertainment and it increases the chances of spreading the virus around the area. That is why Everett, Chelsea, are so infected with corona.

If your okay to leave a casino open then there is no reason why small business's should not be open based on the same safety precautions?

You can't pick and choose what can and can't be open. Then justify it's okay that casino is open during a pandemic but every other business needs to be shutdown.

The casino alone is a coronavirus spreader. No reason why this should be open as the nation is in lockdown.
 

Nibbles O’Plenty

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Why even take the chance for this type of venue to be open when you can spread the virus? The casino is not an essential business. It only justifies entertainment and it increases the chances of spreading the virus around the area. That is why Everett, Chelsea, are so infected with corona.

If your okay to leave a casino open then there is no reason why small business's should not be open based on the same safety precautions?

You can't pick and choose what can and can't be open. Then justify it's okay that casino is open during a pandemic but every other business needs to be shutdown.

The casino alone is a coronavirus spreader. No reason why this should be open as the nation is in lockdown.
How many COVID-19 cases do you know of that were caught at the casino? Everything there is controlled so there is no spread.
 

393b40

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The casino alone is a coronavirus spreader. No reason why this should be open as the nation is in lockdown.
Shooting from the hip. Bring some data to the table before making these kind of accusations. I am getting real tired of people claiming things are "coronavirus spreaders" without any evidence. Yes, there is a higher risk to anything indoors, but higher risk != guaranteed infection.

There's no national lockdown.

How many COVID-19 cases do you know of that were caught at the casino?
He can't answer that because he doesn't know. He's only got a "feeling" or a "hunch" and wants to base policy decisions that have huge impacts to thousands of people on his hunches.
 

Equilibria

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He can't answer that because he doesn't know. He's only got a "feeling" or a "hunch" and wants to base policy decisions that have huge impacts to thousands of people on his hunches.
Same applies to you. That's why we have a concept of "essential" businesses and close everything else.
 

George_Apley

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Given the tangents elsewhere, what are people's perspectives on how Baker has handled the pandemic since the end of Summer? Walsh, Curtatone, and some other municipal leaders have struck off on their own again somewhat due to a sense in some places that Baker has been too hesitant.

I think that the lack of federal action has strongly informed Baker's passive approach, and not much about the supposed Congressional deal will alter that calculus.
 

393b40

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Same applies to you. That's why we have a concept of "essential" businesses and close everything else.
Except it does not, because I am not taking a position other than the The State of Massachusetts has the data and clearly based on its own metrics believes the casino is “safe enough” and that non-essential business can operate right now.
 

Johnnyrocket891

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Except it does not, because I am not taking a position other than the The State of Massachusetts has the data and clearly based on its own metrics believes the casino is “safe enough” and that non-essential business can operate right now.
What science has identify that a casino is safer to be open than a restaurant across the street if they follow the same safety precautions?
 

jklo

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Went to the Natick Mall today. Pretty busy to the point where the long lines to get into stores was clogging up things.
 

DZH22

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MOD EDIT: Following convo from here.

Has anyone heard anything about the food hall? I realize Covid but you'd think they'd say something.
The website still says it's expected in 2020. https://www.hubhallboston.com/
I ran a search through about 6 months back and couldn't find much. It would be moronic for a restaurant to try to open soon as opposed to wait this out 6 more months. Look at this case rate for Covid in MA. 2nd wave completely dwarfs the first. Anybody who opens a restaurant today gets what they get, and it isn't going to be pretty.

1609261313649.png
 
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Patrick Winn

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The website still says it's expected in 2020. https://www.hubhallboston.com/
I ran a search through about 6 months back and couldn't find much. It would be moronic for a restaurant to try to open soon as opposed to wait this out 6 more months. Look at this case rate for Covid in MA. 2nd wave completely dwarfs the first. Anybody who opens a restaurant today gets what they get, and it isn't going to be pretty.

View attachment 9140
Great, an online COVID and economics expert.
 

Patrick Winn

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I mean, it doesn't take an expert to know that opening a restaurant right now is not a productive exercise.
You said it would be “moronic” for a restaurant to “open in the next six months.”And you neglected to mention that COVID deaths have remained consistently low—a faction of what they were in March—hospitals have not hit capacity, treatments are consistently improving and there is a vaccine already being administered. It’s heartbreaking to see so many restaurants and small businesses struggling the way they are. I’m rooting for them. And making market forecast for the next six months based off a novel virus is definitely an area were you should be an expert before you demoralized people.
 

DZH22

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You said it would be “moronic” for a restaurant to “open in the next six months.”And you neglected to mention that COVID deaths have remained consistently low—a faction of what they were in March—hospitals have not hit capacity, treatments are consistently improving and there is a vaccine already being administered. It’s heartbreaking to see so many restaurants and small businesses struggling the way they are. I’m rooting for them. And making market forecast for the next six months based off a novel virus is definitely an area were you should be an expert before you demoralized people.
First of all, that was ME who said it. Make sure you direct your misplaced ire at the correct person. Second of all, the graph alone should make it pretty obvious that people aren't going to be rushing out to food halls en masse during the largest Covid case spike to date. There are 80,000 active cases right now in MA compared to a peak of ~57,000 in the Spring. Even though we aren't having the nursing home debacles that caused the initial death surge, deaths still ARE going back up and many more people are getting sick than before.

I am also absolutely rooting for the restaurants and small businesses to succeed. However, I 100% stand by my assertion that if you choose to debut that business right now, you get what you get. Multiple vaccines literally exist and are being distributed, and people should be ready to start returning to more normal routines as early as Summer. That is when opening a new business could once again be viable. At the moment, it's clearly a big risk to do so, much bigger than waiting.

We don't need experts to demoralize people, just readily available statistics. In this case though, I am absolutely an expert. I'm an expert at POINTING OUT THE OBVIOUS. The obvious move is don't open a new restaurant or other business that relies on foot traffic until we can actually count on that foot traffic to be there. I don't know exactly when that will be, but I do know it won't be in Q1 of 2021. That would take a bigger miracle than the miracle of Hanukah.
 

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