Driving around New England Pix's

Patrick said:
The city, like any, goes through spurts and ups and downs...it was huge for a port, like new bedford, then that fell off, then it was huge for tourism, then that slowed, then huge as a place to invest in commercial offices, then that fell off, etc. And huge is to be read in a relative sense (relative to maine, that is) of course. I think most cities are like this, as long as they have the right minded civic leaders. Allentown PA and Youngstown OH are two examples of cities that were very similar but one improved while the other has not. It depends on civic leadership. NB seems like it has a ton of potential, Fall River maybe not so much...does that sound right or am I off
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I should have put some more thought into the 15 years point. I know the Old Port has thrived. I do remember reading though that the mall took a lot of business away from downtown for a while before efforts reestablished the area as a shopping destination. New Bedford is going through that now. It had lots of vacant storefronts for a while and is only in the past 5 years or so (maybe 10... the national park was established in 1999) seeing major renewed interest downtown. In fact, during the recession, vacant storefronts downtown have DECREASED by quite a large margin. Many new businesses have opened up within the last 2 years and most of them have been quite successful. New Bedford has seen ups and downs too. Whaling, Manufacturing, etc. It's biggest lull was from the early 80s to the mid-late 90s when it became the highest grossing fishing port in the nation. That continues to be the case, but downtown is becoming a destination again. Like you said, it takes civic leadership and New Bedford's had problems with that in the past, but it's gotten a lot better. They have many new organizations promoting the region and people have really taken a keen interest in it. There's so much civic pride in Portland and I truly believe that for these small cities, that is a huge factor. New Bedford's only starting to see a fraction of that, but it's coming and starting to grow.

For the record, I though Portland was always a pretty major port... like it still is today? I thought I read that it's one of the top 40 in the nation in terms of volume.

You sound dead on about the two cities. Fall River is way behind. I also just don't think it has that much potential. It's scarred beyond recognition. It will take so much work to reconnect the city (although they do have a great waterfront boardwalk that goes all the way from where I took the pictures of the "Fall River" banners looking towards the copper topped building and the bridge to the battleship... about 1 mile) and get rid of urban renewal's mistakes. New Bedford has more to offer (Art Museum, Whaling Museum, Oceanarium, Ferries, National Historic Park, great restaurants, shops, galleries, etc) while Fall River doesn't. I'm not saying it can't be done, but New Bedford is in the midst of a renewal of sorts and Fall River seems to be regressing further.
 
Good points. Portland is still a major port by tonnage, in fact its the second largest oil port on the east coast (mostly because it is the point of oceanic contact for Montreal, which explains why it would need to receive such a disproportionate size of goods and resources...its basically montreal's port that moved a few hundred miles over). I guess my point was that portland used to only be a port, hence the name. It has evolved into a new role as a commercial center of other sorts, from a fishing village. It was not a planned urban center, like some cities, but rather the urban center (congress) grew up after and around the initial industry of the port...and now the waterfront is sinking, pardon the pun, and has to be subsidized by restrictive zoning measures that keep condominums and offices and restaurants off the water. The working waterfront aint workin'. But per tonnage in oil I think you are correct that it is still quite significant, but that is a small part of the city's overall "feel." No one even sees the water when they come to portland these days, theres hardly any meaningful public access except on the eastern prom which is far removed from things. Chandler's wharf has security guards making sure no one goes to the water view side. uhhhh....failure to capitalize on a major asset? I think so. When I worked at the portland harbor hotel people always asked for water view rooms. sorry people, its actually the portland parking lot hotel, and you might be lucky and be able to see the civic center if your on the top floor....

The Maine Mall hasn't really ever taken commerce away from the old port. It took it away from congress street, where places like MECA used to be large intown department stores and national chains. The old port is really the city's response to the maine mall. The mall opened in the late 1960s and the old port revitalization took place shortly thereafter. The real turn around point for portland cam when franklin arterial, cumberland, spring and state streets allowed cars to return downtown so that the city could compete with the convenience of the maine mall. no one was coming downtown anymore, and projects like the holiday inn, the civic center, one city center and surrounding structures, etc, all those were made possible by the franklin expansion which is now the subject of so much controversy as it cuts the city in two. I think it has had pluses and minuses. it certainly helped revitalize the city but in so doing changed what "the city" was. Now the city has a reputation that can afford it a chance to narrow franklin again without risking lost visitors, but that wasn't the case back then.

I think NB should ride the current wave of trendy green development/bicycling/artis and creative class/ urban living / etc that the nation seems to be witnessing because, forget about new urbanism, NB has OLD urbanism that is better and already in place for those types to invest in rehabing. The city seems to have a ton of potential. I have more to say but my battery is going so....
 
See, your description of Portland is why New Bedford needs to take notes. I'll clarify by saying that despite the fact that Portland is smaller than New Bedford, New Bedford will never been like Portland (I'm thinking it will be somewhere between Portland and Portsmouth, but better to aim high). This is primarily due to the fact that it's never going to be a regional center with Boston less than an hour away and Providence 20 minutes down the road (not to mention, Fall River 10 miles away). However, it can follow Portland's lead and diversify. New Bedford has the fishing industry covered. That's really only relatively recent. It is growing BIG TIME as a port (30% increase in volume in the last year) given it's strategic location near the mouth of the Cape Cod Canal and the growing popularity of short-sea-shipping. It also recently stole a page from Portland's book by enticing UMass to move their College of Visual and Performing Art to a vacant downtown department store (Star Store) a la Maine College of Art on Congress. They also been working to better integrate UMass Dartmouth and B.C.C (as well as Bridgewater State College) into their downtown area. Both schools have Campuses and B.C.C. is looking to build a large residential component downtown.

New Bedford is also doing its best to lure high tech industry and has been successful as a few new industries have open up in town in the past year or so. The growth of high tech industry (and other commerce like tourism, etc) are heavily contingent on better transit infrastructure. New Bedford airport has scheduled commercial flights to Cape Cod and the Islands, but the failure to expand the runways and terminals a few years back hurt the city (UPS wanted it to be an air cargo hub and one major airline wanted a New York-New Bedford shuttle), but it seems that with the growth as a port and interest in tourism, that may come back on the table soon. Also, Commuter Rail Service (which is still progressing nicely) will be a HUGE asset to the city. Not only does it make New Bedford a better location for Boston commuters, but it opens up the door for people in the Boston area to easily access New Bedford and it's attractions. It will also help the existing freight rail services.

New Bedford is riding the green development wave. There's a huge artist community in town as it's picturesque and still very affordable compared to Boston. It doesn't hurt that there's a college of art and a nice Art Museum downtown either. The artists are doing a good job of providing an alternative to the typical blue collar (and spotty yuppie feel) of the area. You're right about Old Urbanism. People are starting to catch on. The Buzzards Bay Coalition is renovating a historic "counting house" downtown into modern Green offices with ground floor retail. Many of the mills away from downtown have been/are being turned into modern, market rate apartments. Entrepreneurs are taking advantage of low rents and increased interest in the picturesque historic areas. The city is right where it should be in riding that wave (Fall River, not so much).

Looking forward to the rest of your insight.
 
Very nice start, sounds like it has even more potential than I previously thought. I wouldn't think its proximity to Boston and Providence or even Fall River would be bad things, though I understand your point about Center city versus Peripheral city. What I think needs to be done is for NB to really take a good look at growth trends in the region and try to absorb a particular type of growth that would otherwise take place in its neighboring towns that it may be in a more competitive position to....i.e. you mentioned artists like the place due to its less pricey apartments, art museum, etc. NB should work on becoming a HUB for artists, rather than growing all around. Like you said, proximity to Boston and Providence hurt its chances of becoming a large center city, so it should try to specialize as a type of niche peripheral community. high tech would be another great avenue. also, the schools should be invested in heavily, as this draws MUCH more attention to a place. Portland schools aren't great, but the surrounding tows offer good systems and most of the people downtown that make the city what it is don't live here anyway, though a few do. School systems bring in highly educated and invested people and their money and families. Infill is another great idea, rather than building new large structures because NB already seems to have the right rustic dense feel to benefit from more of the same type of development. Also, REGIONAL coordination in planning between NB and particularly FR would be a huge plus, with both cities cooperating and one deciding to pursue one sort of industry or economy and the other pursuing something else. This would be politically hard to sell to some as they think the cities perhaps should be competing, but I think in the long term people will see that it is beneficial to regionally coordinate. Say, keep industry in FR (manufacturing etc) and turn NB into a shopping mecca and port. just as an example, not necessarily the ideal strategy I would pursue. The fact that it is less than an hour from Boston could also be good in that NB could capitalize on offering something Boston CANNOT - i.e. scenic shores and a quiet getaway yet with city amenities a block away. I don't know what the area is like per se but the pictures make it look as though there are at least SOME scenic coastal areas there, so people from the Boston area may be drawn there for a day trip to just stroll around and get out of the city to relax, especially if they want to do so while keeping urban conveniences nearby (NB's downtown). Just some ideas. Also, Portsmouth is less than an hour from Boston, and it seems to be doing well, however it has no other large city to its north like NB does to its south (other than portland which is too far away and too small to really efffect portsmouth).
 
also the university growth you mentioned should be a HUGE boon to the NB economy. College students and the culture they bring are as good as artists if not better. boutiques, shops, pubs, art galleries, museums, all of these things would, in theory at least, increase with a large university presence. of course, it depends on the type of students attending, but usually I notice positive effects in university towns.

Also, I can't overstate how important I think the following are: TREEEES!!!!! NB (and all cities) could really benefit from the installation of large elms on either side of its many streets, strategically planted to frame the avenues and provide shade to visitors as they stroll about. Trees really re-energize a place. are there many in town now?
 
Fall River, MA:

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very nice^ I have to get back to this thread I have lots of cities and towns I've yet to post!
 
Patrick said:
Nice photo. Where is the city though?
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NOT a good view of the city. It's a good view of the bridge (and the Mt. Hope Bridge in the distance). Downtown Fall River is centered right over the entrance to the bridge on the left hand side of the photos. The Point Gloria tower and the darkness block the view.
 
Today some of the Hingham ship yard
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will they ever finnish this bridge?
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95% of people in Hingham will think that's wonderful or just won't care.

It is, of course, complete garbage.
 
These are the same people who held up the Greenbush commuter rail line over that damed tunnel. They deserve garbage.
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Nice, there are no new Providence pics ANYWHERE until today, finally! It's cool to see the new buildings in downtown, I haven't been down there in forever.
 
vanshnookenraggen said:
These are the same people who held up the Greenbush commuter rail line over that damed tunnel. They deserve garbage.
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Wow, I just checked out this tunnel thing on google maps, and was shocked to see no "Hingham Center" station icon to be found. I thought it must have been a mistake, but the MBTA website shows there is in fact no stop there. WTF. Gmaps shows a Station St. and a freakin salon called Station 27, presumably located in the old station house. How NIMBY can these people be?!??!
 
Thanks for the Prov. Pics. I was there a few days ago playing with my DSLR. I'll post those pics soon. I LOVE Providence.
 
Me too! Was Providence once poised to become bigger than Boston/Mass.,nicer statehouse taller buildings pre 1950 ect






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