Liberty Mutual Tower | 157 Berkeley Street | Back Bay

Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

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Taking shape nicely. This building has a massive feel once you get up close to it. But from a distance, it feels a bit short.

It looks like Grill 23 is the only portion of the adjacent building that has not been closed/gutted for the whole project.
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

Is the floor of the tube translucent?
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

Yup, and as far as I could tell that blue colored stuff is a protective wrapping which would presumably be removed later on.
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

WOW!!!!! Great pics, guys! Thanks for posting!!! Looking gooooood!!
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

atlantaden said:
WOW!!!!! Great pics, guys! Thanks for posting!!! Looking gooooood!!
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While we wish it was taller -- its materializing into an impressive building when viewed from the outside -- with a definite presence from the street -- particularly from Park Square
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

I vaguely recall seeing that coming out of rise at 6am last week ;)
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

I'm really not liking the exterior of this building. I know it's been established that it's actually limestone and not precast concrete, but I think they've totally misused the material. IMO, the beauty of a stone facade is in the workmanship, the coursing and the detailing. This facade looks like precast because of the coarseness of its detailing and the utilization of a construction method that appears to use large, pre-assembled exterior panels. It seems the designers were more concerned with simply using the material itself--limestone--than using it well. They're using it like precast concrete.

I think this photo by kz juxtaposing the new building with the neighboring Salada Building is a good illustration of what I'm talking about:
kz1000ps said:
Today:
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Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

briv said:
I'm really not liking the exterior of this building. I know it's been established that it's actually limestone and not precast concrete, but I think they've totally misused the material. IMO, the beauty of a stone facade is in the workmanship, the coursing and the detailing. This facade looks like precast because of the coarseness of its detailing and the utilization of a construction method that appears to use large, pre-assembled exterior panels. It seems the designers were more concerned with simply using the material itself--limestone--than using it well. They're using it like precast concrete.

I think this photo by kz juxtaposing the new building with the neighboring Salada Building is a good illustration of what I'm talking about:
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Briv -- I think that you nailed this one --- the arichitect seems to think that since you can hang anything onto a structural steel frame - -that any cladding is equivalent and should be treated in the same manner.

Bad decision -- this is going to be a signiture building in that part of Boston for generations and people will say -- "why didn't they use limestone instead of precast concrete'? -- Why bother -- same thing was done with the lintels on windows on Rowe's Wharf -- I thought that they were concrete until I found out otherwise.

The key missing link seemed to be that the architect forgot or ignored the fact that stone masons still exist and like to do work -- a bit of finer detail around some of the windows and everyone would understand that the company cared about the fine details as well as the grand scale -- perhaps even a Palladian window or two or some fine gargoyles

This photo juxtaposes a number of buildings in the immediate area with much nicer exterior cladding -- although I believe that all are in fact structural steel frame buildings
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Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

You guys are keen to blame only the architects - don't forget that cost, contractors, owners, etc are all involved...
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

OlsD UNclE saYing RELENTLESNESS of wINdows remindfuL Of ALBERT SPEER werks
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

I will admit the Liberty Mutual project is coming out Great. This will be a good addition for the Backbay

I wish the streetscape was more welcoming but overall looking good
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

briv said:
I'm really not liking the exterior of this building. I know it's been established that it's actually limestone and not precast concrete, but I think they've totally misused the material. IMO, the beauty of a stone facade is in the workmanship, the coursing and the detailing. This facade looks like precast because of the coarseness of its detailing and the utilization of a construction method that appears to use large, pre-assembled exterior panels. It seems the designers were more concerned with simply using the material itself--limestone--than using it well. They're using it like precast concrete.
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riserise touched on this, but there's also the matter of Liberty Mutual's dowdy character. My experience with the company is of a very plain and boring culture. They like it that way. And it's worked out for them from a business perspective. This culture means "boring" buildings. The south face of their original headquarters facing Stuart street is a good example: a flat wall with widows -- almost warehouse-like -- yet it works in context:

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The understatement of their Berkley street facing headquarters is more finely done. But contrast that with the old John Hancock building facing it on Berkley street. This company has a history of practiced restraint.

I'll admit, I'm not totally comfortable with the facade either. It could be more finely done -- but that can be said of anything, couldn't it?

On top of this: the building is not finished yet, there's still the glass and the crown of the tower to be seen.
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

IAM thinkin 50 MiLLion reasonS to DEsagre wiTH thiS zo-kAlled "restraint" karacatura
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

Oh christ you just poked the bear
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

What kind of building is this architecturally?

It's incorporating classical materials and lintels with the Sullivanesque emphasis on vertical lines with slightly recessed window bays ("[A skyscraper] must be every inch a proud and soaring thing") and tripartite composition with Modern ideas, such as the lack of ornament. Is this thing stripped down classicism, or Post Modern?

ALSO, I know this isn't the right thread but since someone mentioned 500 Bolyston...why do many here hate on this building? It's one of my all-time favorite Post Modern buildings. From the ground is provides good streetwall/retail and from the sky I think it fits in really well with the New/Old Hancock/222 Berkley/Clarendon cluster. It seems like more people here like IP (whighlander excluded) which I think is one of Boston's best buildings.
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

Lennon McCartney said:
What kind of building is this architecturally?

It's incorporating classical materials and lintels with the Sullivanesque emphasis on vertical lines with slightly recessed window bays ("[A skyscraper] must be every inch a proud and soaring thing") and tripartite composition with Modern ideas, such as the lack of ornament. Is this thing stripped down classicism, or Post Modern?

ALSO, I know this isn't the right thread but since someone mentioned 500 Bolyston...why do many here hate on this building? It's one of my all-time favorite Post Modern buildings. From the ground is provides good streetwall/retail and from the sky I think it fits in really well with the New/Old Hancock/222 Berkley/Clarendon cluster. It seems like more people here like IP (whighlander excluded) which I think is one of Boston's best buildings.
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I have had the same conflict with classifying the building. To me, it's brilliantly contextual and I have a very difficult time classifying it as "post-modern" because of views like this photo:

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I get the feeling that this photo could have been taken anywhere from the 20s to 40s (give-or-take and if you disregard the modern equipment). I'd honestly call it modernist. That calls up the question, can you really build a modernist building in the post-modern era and I'd argue the answer is yes.
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

Lennon McCartney said:
ALSO, I know this isn't the right thread but since someone mentioned 500 Bolyston...why do many here hate on this building? It's one of my all-time favorite Post Modern buildings. From the ground is provides good streetwall/retail and from the sky I think it fits in really well with the New/Old Hancock/222 Berkley/Clarendon cluster. It seems like more people here like IP (whighlander excluded) which I think is one of Boston's best buildings.
Click to expand...

+1
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

Let's file this under the damned-if-you-do/damned-if-you don't category:

briv said:
I'm really not liking the exterior of this building. I know it's been established that it's actually limestone and not precast concrete, but I think they've totally misused the material. IMO, the beauty of a stone facade is in the workmanship, the coursing and the detailing. This facade looks like precast because of the coarseness of its detailing and the utilization of a construction method that appears to use large, pre-assembled exterior panels. It seems the designers were more concerned with simply using the material itself--limestone--than using it well. They're using it like precast concrete.

I think this photo by kz juxtaposing the new building with the neighboring Salada Building is a good illustration of what I'm talking about:
Click to expand...

I couldn't disagree more. a) no one is going to confuse this with pre-cast. Typically the confusion goes in the other direction, particularly when viewed by the 99% of the population that is not an architect. b) The 'coarseness' of the detailing adds 3D interest to the skin (via shadow lines), adding visual "pop" to what would otherwise be massively relentless and brutal wallpaper. c) "use large, pre-assembled exterior panels" - that's how they can afford to use so much real stone (a decision for which I am very grateful as a citizen of this fair city)...this is the 21st century afterall. Once the windows are in and the ground floor is complete, is there anyone who will be able to discern what construction method was used?

It's interesting that you chose that particular picture to prove your point. Exclude the crown and the base of the Salada tea building, and there is not much that is particularly attractive in its use of stone - in contrast to its new next-door neighbor whose articulated stone detailing is a much more interesting way to incorporate this natural material...IMO, of course.
 
Re: Liberty Mutual plans major Boston expansion

My take is that the success of a Boston building depends on how well it works in winter. This building is going to be unbelievably grim on those miserable grey February days when all it presents is its oppressive relentless greyness.
 
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