MA Casino Developments

underground said:
It's a political win/win for Curtatone: if he succeeds, he blocks the casino and gets another check next to his anti-casino bona fides; if he partially succeeds and gets concessions from Wynn, he gets a check next to "going up against the big guy for his constituents"; and if he fails, he still gets to add a check next to being anti-casino.
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Uground -- he'd better hope he doesn't Wynn but onlys gets a bone tossed in his direction

If he Wynns then for the foreseeable future the view across the Mystic will be a Superfund site and a Big Power Plant -- that will do wonders for Somerville and the idea of activating the river bank

If I was Curatone I'd be checking the bed nightly for horseheads -- Everett isn't going to take kindly to this kind of interloping
 
^ Curtatone isn't the only lawsuit. I don't think Everett has enough horses to issue threats to all the parties necessary...
 
Time for another episode of NIMBY Death Match in which the all project opponents are put into 1 room to hash out their directly-contradictory reasons for opposing a project.

For the Casino we have now accumulated a full card of both-can't-be-right opponents that must answer the question "well, which is it?" with a single answer rather than ask us to take either seriously.

ROUND 1
A) Casino will be empty and quickly bankrupted because gambling is saturated
B) Casino will be an unstoppable, runaway success and take all our money, forever.

ROUND 2
C) Casino will primarily attract problem gamblers
D) Casino will primarily attract revelers from Landsdowne Street (problem drinkers?)
(yes, theoretically, if A wins Round 1, then Round 2 is absurd, but that's never stopped anyone)

ROUND 3
E) Casino will succeed by monopolizing metro-area nightlife
F) Casino will generate trips that ruin the AM rush hour
 
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underground said:
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I liked him on SNL!!! He was so funny!! :cool:
 
I get your pt. Arlington, but your "both-can't-be-right" analysis is a bit flawed in round 2 and especially in round 3, as the scenarios are not mutually exclusive.

ROUND 2
Certainly a casino "could"

C) attract problem gamblers
&
D) attract revelers from Landsdowne Street

ROUND 3
And while I don't believe this will happen, a casino could both

E) monopolize metro-area nightlife
&
F) generate trips that ruin the AM rush hour
 
So, apparently the 5th or 6th largest metro population in the country can only support a single nightlife hot spot? One that can hold, let's say 10,000 people's attention at a time. We really are a lame area if that's true.
 
SeamusMcFly said:
So, apparently the 5th or 6th largest metro population in the country can only support a single nightlife hot spot? One that can hold, let's say 10,000 people's attention at a time. We really are a lame area if that's true.
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Yeah, placed in that context, what was already manifestly ridiculous should be clear to all but, well, maybe one.
 
SeamusMcFly said:
So, apparently the 5th or 6th largest metro population in the country can only support a single nightlife hot spot? One that can hold, let's say 10,000 people's attention at a time. We really are a lame area if that's true.
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The casino will be a huge success: Boston nightlife is very mediocre at best for a great city. This being the only gambling venue in the city of Boston (It's a no-brainer that this will succeed)

The Union workers love to gamble and there are a lot of people that live in Boston and around the surrounding areas have Money.

I do believe if the casino is built for more a nightlife atmosphere with multiple clubs, shows and different types of bars and entertainment we could really see a consolidation in the bars, clubs and restaurant in the city of Boston and the surrounding areas.

(I'm not saying the House of Blues will shut-down on Landsdown) But I'm saying the smaller bars in the city don't stand a shot to compete.


I do believe Traffic will get worse in the surrounding areas no matter how they spin this.
 
TheRifleman said:
The casino will be a huge success: Boston nightlife is very mediocre at best for a great city. This being the only gambling venue in the city of Boston (It's a no-brainer that this will succeed)

The Union workers love to gamble and there are a lot of people that live in Boston and around the surrounding areas have Money.

I do believe if the casino is built for more a nightlife atmosphere with multiple clubs, shows and different types of bars and entertainment we could really see a consolidation in the bars, clubs and restaurant in the city of Boston and the surrounding areas.

(I'm not saying the House of Blues will shut-down on Landsdown) But I'm saying the smaller bars in the city don't stand a shot to compete.


I do believe Traffic will get worse in the surrounding areas no matter how they spin this.
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The casino would obviously take away some patrons from other bars, no one is denying that. Heck, it might even cause a few bars to go out of business. But those bars that would go out of business because of a casino were already in trouble anyway.

Even if the casino had 20 new restaurants and bars that would be a drop in the bucket compared to the overall Boston scene. There are that many bars and restaurants in a half mile stretch of the Financial District alone. Then if you take into account Fanueil Hall, Seaport, North End, Back Bay, South End, Fenway/Landsdowne, Allston/Brighton, Harvard, Davis Square, Union Square, Central Square (just to name a few areas) it's obvious that the casino will not have much of an impact relative to the total Boston scene.

I think you are either over-estimating the impact of a casino by an order of magnitude, or under-estimating the size of Boston nightlife by an order of magnitude. It simply won't have the impact you think it will.
 
TheRifleman said:
I do believe if the casino is built for more a nightlife atmosphere with multiple clubs, shows and different types of bars and entertainment we could really see a consolidation in the bars, clubs and restaurant in the city of Boston and the surrounding areas.
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If the nightlife sucks that bad elsewhere in the Metro area, why wouldn't we say that the other venues *deserve* to lose? Why should we shelter crappy entertainment venues from their customer's free choices?

And if Wynn is that much better at his non-gambling, non-drinking "entertainments" why isn't he a *hero* for at last providing the people with a circus they like?

While I don't think that problem gamblers and alcoholics are "free" to chose, you're describing something different in both scale and motive: a kind of mass migration of people from entertainments they don't like to a place they will like. Why should we discourage or deplore that aspect of Wynn's Resort?
 
^^^^
Arlington,

All I'm saying is Mohegan and Foxwoods nightlife is on a different level compared to the clubs in the City of Boston.

If Wynn Chooses to develop the casinos with that type of VIBE he will smash this investment out of the park.

That's all I'm saying. The energy at Foxwoods and Mohegans on Fri and Sat nights there is nothing better than it. besides VEGAS--
 
TheRifleman said:
The casino will be a huge success: Boston nightlife is very mediocre at best for a great city. This being the only gambling venue in the city of Boston (It's a no-brainer that this will succeed)

The Union workers love to gamble and there are a lot of people that live in Boston and around the surrounding areas have Money.

I do believe if the casino is built for more a nightlife atmosphere with multiple clubs, shows and different types of bars and entertainment we could really see a consolidation in the bars, clubs and restaurant in the city of Boston and the surrounding areas.

(I'm not saying the House of Blues will shut-down on Landsdown) But I'm saying the smaller bars in the city don't stand a shot to compete.


I do believe Traffic will get worse in the surrounding areas no matter how they spin this.
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Riff -- have you ever been on Causeway St. after / before a Bruins match -- I don't think that any of those patrons would skip the black and gold for the casino

Ditto for the crowd at the Cask & Flagon and the Sox

What Wynn has is mind is not designed to compete with those kind of places, but rather what attracts people to the wilds of eastern Connecticut

Th only negative business impact that I foresee due to the casino is on medium-sized performances of pop / rock stars at a place like the Orpheum
 
TheRifleman said:
^^^^
Arlington,

All I'm saying is Mohegan and Foxwoods nightlife is on a different level compared to the clubs in the City of Boston.

If Wynn Chooses to develop the casinos with that type of VIBE he will smash this investment out of the park.

That's all I'm saying. The energy at Foxwoods and Mohegans on Fri and Sat nights there is nothing better than it. besides VEGAS--
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That's a totally valid opinion to have that many people share. But there are also a TON of people who value small, intimate bars and venues over large, flashy casino clubs.
 
TheRifleman said:
If Wynn Chooses to develop the casinos with that type of VIBE he will smash this investment out of the park.
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Let's stipulate your vision as an established fact.

Curtatone still can't show any real public interest in his suit against Wynn, apart from the lowest, NIMBY, paranoid, class-envy, Diana Moon Glampers sort.

Is it:

1) Wynn will be rich & successful. Market successes should be taxed punitively. Mayor Curtatone is right to try to cut us in on the loot by suing Wynn. He will spend it wisely.

2)Nightlife traffic will crush the morning commute. Mayor Curtatone is going to claw back free-flowing auto traffic by squeezing out offset dollars which he will spend on road improvements that will miraculously avoid Induced Demand

3)Union guys, who are happy at local bars today, will find all the places they love shut down because Wynn will have drawn all nightlife into his inescapable vortex. Mayor Curtatone is going to save the dumpiest, most-marginal, endangered dives in the metro area with Wynn's offset payments.
 
TheRifleman said:
I do believe if the casino is built for more a nightlife atmosphere with multiple clubs, shows and different types of bars and entertainment we could really see a consolidation in the bars, clubs and restaurant in the city of Boston and the surrounding areas.

(I'm not saying the House of Blues will shut-down on Landsdown) But I'm saying the smaller bars in the city don't stand a shot to compete.
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I'm confused. Arguably a great deal of night life venues have opened in the seaport over the past few years. Why didn't that shut down everything else?
 
HenryAlan said:
I'm confused. Arguably a great deal of night life venues have opened in the seaport over the past few years. Why didn't that shut down everything else?
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Because the Casino will have the VIBE! And gambling! And free food! And union workers! And no transit access.... waaaait... I thought part of Riff's argument was that the lack of transit access will lead to clogged roadways... most people are going to Lansdowne and Faneuil to get schmamm'd, and certainly won't be driving out of the city to go drink at a casino instead... those bar hoppers take the T, a cab, or an Uber. Fatal flaw in the argument? Nah, I'm sure we can count on Rifleman to stick with it till the bitter end. Next argument will be that ALL THE TAXIS WILL BE AT THE CASINO INSTEAD OF OTHER PLACES!!1!1!!
 
BussesAin'tTrains said:
Because the Casino will have the VIBE! And gambling! And free food! And union workers! And no transit access.... waaaait... I thought part of Riff's argument was that the lack of transit access will lead to clogged roadways... most people are going to Lansdowne and Faneuil to get schmamm'd, and certainly won't be driving out of the city to go drink at a casino instead... those bar hoppers take the T, a cab, or an Uber. Fatal flaw in the argument? Nah, I'm sure we can count on Rifleman to stick with it till the bitter end. Next argument will be that ALL THE TAXIS WILL BE AT THE CASINO INSTEAD OF OTHER PLACES!!1!1!!
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I realize now, that the lack of hard rail and a football stadium is why the seaport area night life hasn't killed Lansdowne St. Fortunately for Wynn, the Casino has both.
 
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