MBTA Winter 2015: Failure and Recovery

Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Matthew said:
Countries with strong union traditions manage to run far superior and efficient train and bus service than us.
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Germany is a prime example and not without its faults too. In November, Deutsche Bahn workers went on strike for 4 days and brought most of Berlin's S-Bahn to a screeching halt. They tried to bustitute, but it had the same success that bustitution has here. Commutes that should have taken 15 min, took hours. It was absolute chaos in Berlin for a few days, but overall Berlin's transit is far superior when it is working properly. The BVG has also gone on strike and stopped U-Bahn service too.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Matthew said:
Countries with strong union traditions manage to run far superior and efficient train and bus service than us.

I don't think it's the unions. Maybe it's OUR unions, but not unions in general.
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Yes, folks should also remember that Southwest Airlines has always been 100% union and super-efficient at the same time. The key has been a management that cared about both people and productivity. (My favorite story was the time Herb Kelleher unilaterally raised wages for workers who were working on an expired contract, saying in effect, "your stubborn negotiators are delaying contract talks, but we all know you've earned this raise, so here it is")

In general, it is probably more productive to think of "bad" union deals as the fruits of bad (or weak) management as it is to blame it on the nature of unions per se.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

I read an argument made by some writer somewhere that it is better for transit workers to strike and get the crisis over with -- instead of outlawing or preventing strike, letting the crisis drag out for years and years.

I dunno, maybe. Seems to work in Europe, although I'm sure that the strike days are a real pain.

I've also read that Germany's approach to unions is different from here, and it sounds superior. Management and unions don't act as if they were in opposition; instead management recognizes that they need the union to be effective, and the union recognizes that they need the management in order for the business to be successful. So they operate more in collaboration, instead of treating the contract as a zero-sum game. Maybe that's an idealized description from an outsider's point of view, I don't know. But it sounds a lot more reasonable.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Matthew said:
Work rules mandate overstaffing. It's utterly ridiculous to have 1 conductor for every 2 train cars. Can you imagine if the subways were like this? Completely ridiculous. This is the year 2015, it's time for the railroads to start behaving like it.
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Matthew the 19th C union structures and work rules create waste at a magnificent level

While some things have improved since when I was a student at MIT. Back then, I wrote some articles about the T, and in the process I got to spend some time hobnobbing with the T at the senior engineering and planning level.

As an example of the gross inefficiency rampant at the time -- the details of an encounter between a bus and the various unions involved in routine maintenance sounded like the script for a scene from Monty Python and the Holly Grail ;)

if i recall correctly 27 different Unions and their restrictive rules were involved -- a few of excerpts follow:

  • driver parks the bus at the edge of the apron of garage
  • mechanic drives bus into garage
  • sheet metal worker lifts hood
  • rubber worker checks tire pressure, windshield wipers -- can't top off fluid
  • plumber checks hoses from engine block to radiator -- can't top off fluids
  • .... etc.

Of course it goes with saying that only electricians can change light bulbs and fuses

I just don't think that a Google Bus needing service would be handled in this fashion

Note that the private sector infected with union work rules has some of the same silliness such as the line drawn on the floor in Stop & Shop Supermarkets -- beyond which only a member of the Meat Cutter's Union may step -- or at least if a maintenance person changes the light bulb a Meat Cutter must monitor the process
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

I don't think it's entirely the union work rules. The FRA mandates a lot of wastefulness and 19th century-style operation. That's a regulatory failure. It could be argued that it is regulatory capture by unions, but there's no motivation on the 'management' side to get it fixed either.

Again, many European countries have very strong unions and union culture, and yet they manage to operate trains like it's the 21st century. They run one employee per train, they use proof of payment, they run driverless trains even! Paris is in the process of retrofitting more of their century old Metro lines to driverless operation. France is no slouch in the union department, but they still do the right thing. Unions can be a partner in this, not just an obstacle.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

So for tomorrow's all-day-Monday storm (Feb 9th) they are pre-committing to a mid-day (10a - 3p) suspension of rail service on the northern Orange Line (beyond Sullivan) and the Southern Braintree line (south of JFK/UMass) so that they can jet-plow it.

Details at www.mbta.com/winter
Between 10:00 a.m. and 3:00 p.m., the MBTA will suspend Red Line service between Braintree and JFK/UMass Stations and Orange Line service between Oak Grove and Sullivan Stations so that jet engine powered snow blowers can be used to clear snow from the rights of way before the PM commute. The MBTA will provide very limited replacement bus service during this suspension of rail service, but weather conditions may severely challenge our ability to provide reliable or frequent bus service. Subway service will continue to operate all day from Ashmont to Alewife on the Red Line and from Forest Hills to Sullivan Stations on the Orange Line.
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Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Interesting approach. Might this help avoid situations where trains get stuck and block up the whole line?
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

They're also only running service at mid-day headways all day.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Matthew said:
Interesting approach. Might this help avoid situations where trains get stuck and block up the whole line?
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I'm sure that's what they're going for. I don't pay as much attention to the Orange because I don't ride it much, but the Braintree leg of the Red Line was the one that had major problems last week, with trains getting stranded out there.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Finch said:
I'm sure that's what they're going for. I don't pay as much attention to the Orange because I don't ride it much, but the Braintree leg of the Red Line was the one that had major problems last week, with trains getting stranded out there.
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It's also to groom the right-of-way with the jets in the most vulnerable locations to provide more clearance and perhaps reduce the potential for motors to take in a lot of snow. The traditional method of running trains equipped with plow blades on the center pair trucks and using the sleet scrapers keeps the line from being totally blocked, but with this extreme amount of snow, doesn't remove enough snow from being close to the rail head. Also clears the third-rail better. Sleet/ice covered third-rail can result in power going on/off for extended periods, which results in air compressors going on/off, which can result in air pressure problems, and then brake problems.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Arlington said:
Yes, folks should also remember that Southwest Airlines has always been 100% union and super-efficient at the same time. The key has been a management that cared about both people and productivity. (My favorite story was the time Herb Kelleher unilaterally raised wages for workers who were working on an expired contract, saying in effect, "your stubborn negotiators are delaying contract talks, but we all know you've earned this raise, so here it is")

In general, it is probably more productive to think of "bad" union deals as the fruits of bad (or weak) management as it is to blame it on the nature of unions per se.
Click to expand...

There is a big difference between Unions that are through(corporations) than Public Unions (Taxpayers money)

The Public Unions think the Taxpayers have unlimited money so they are always increasing with no cutbacks.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

winstonoboogie said:
It's also to groom the right-of-way with the jets in the most vulnerable locations to provide more clearance and perhaps reduce the potential for motors to take in a lot of snow. The traditional method of running trains equipped with plow blades on the center pair trucks and using the sleet scrapers keeps the line from being totally blocked, but with this extreme amount of snow, doesn't remove enough snow from being close to the rail head. Also clears the third-rail better. Sleet/ice covered third-rail can result in power going on/off for extended periods, which results in air compressors going on/off, which can result in air pressure problems, and then brake problems.
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Doesn't look like the jets helped that much. Braintree branch replaced by shuttle buses by 6:30 AM Monday and Quincy Fire is helping MBTA evacuate a train stuck between Quincy Adams and Quincy Center.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Pet peeve. It's been two weeks and no one has fixed the typo in the name of this thread. It's actually really bothering me.
 
Re: MBTA & Regualr Driving may be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

sm89 said:
Pet peeve. It's been two weeks and no one has fixed the typo in the name of this thread. It's actually really bothering me.
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It poetically captures the randomness of regualr T service ;-)
 
Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

I just assumed regualr was one of those web 2.0 startups
 
Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

It is being called "The Winter That Just Won't Die!" Or even let up a little!

With this present storm and the two before it, Logan Airport says that a grand total of 61 inches of snow has fallen on the city so far! :eek:
 
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Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Jahvon09 said:
It is being called "The winter that just won't die. Or even let up a little!

With this present storm and the two before it, Logan Airport says that a grand total of 61 inches of snow has fallen on the city so far! :eek:
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I can't take it anymore! :eek:
 
Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

Jahvon09 said:
It is being called "The winter that just won't die. Or even let up a little!

With this present storm and the two before it, Logan Airport says that a grand total of 61 inches of snow has fallen on the city so far! :eek:
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Come out to Worcester, we're at 80+ already.

Where's my white flag? Oh wait, it's already buried in the white stuff outside.
 
Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

"Gov. Baker Rips the MBTA for Unacceptable Performance"

Click-bait headline aside (especially given that Scott is in agreement with Baker that the situation is unacceptable), I hope that this "long conversation" he's planning on having is the beginning of a Grand Bargain™ fix for MassDOT and the MBTA.

Investment in public transit has failed to meet infrastructure needs for decades. Everything will need to be on the table if the state is to find a political solution that will mend the T. That means audits. That means pension and union reforms. That means additional revenues. That means tax reform.

I think Baker is well positioned to navigate the political waters with the bureaucracy and Beacon Hill, but he also needs to be prepared to piss off his base with revenues. The T won't be fixed on the backs of the employees alone.
 
Re: MBTA & Regular Driving May Be Shut Down During Coming Snowstorm!

All light, heavy, and commuter rail service ending at 7PM. Leave now.
 
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