Patriot Place | Foxboro
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Tim Jackson
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Re: Patriots Place
Yep. This weekend, the team will re-induct the 12 members of the Patriots of Hall of Fame, and then the Hall will be open to the public for the first time on September 22. The ribbon cutting ceremony is on September 18, but I don't think anyone will be let in.
Yep. This weekend, the team will re-induct the 12 members of the Patriots of Hall of Fame, and then the Hall will be open to the public for the first time on September 22. The ribbon cutting ceremony is on September 18, but I don't think anyone will be let in.
Re: Patriots Place
Ok, quite a bump here, but I needed to do some shopping the other day and the girlfriend always loves a good deal at Wrentham; so we decided to see what was going on at Patriot Place and maybe grab a bite to eat after spending too much money at the Outlets in Wrentham. The weather was nice so we were expecting a moderate crowd at least.
Boy were we wrong! It was DEAD. Furthermore, at LEAST 50% of the potential storefronts are completely vacant (covered with photos of moments in Patriot history). It was depressing and I really got the feeling of a failing venture. I know it's early on for this project and the economy doesn't help, but I was very surprised at the lack of life on a warm Saturday afternoon in April.
Here are a few snapshots I took:
Looking toward the hotel portion (note the empty storefront on the right):
The nearly empty (at about 2pm) "CBS Scene"
The "Hall"... nice looking, but again, dead (it's DRAFT Weekend!):
Where the Hall meets the entrance to the stadium:
The area near the stadium with CBS Scene, the Hall, Tastings, and the staircases down to the plaza and stadium entrance looks pretty nice. The upper portion of the retail mall (near Red Robin, the Hotel, etc) is ugly and boring. Like Toby said, it really has VERY little to offer in terms of variety of retail. Bass Pro Shops is cool, but it might as well be a world away to pedestrians as it's across a massive sea of parking lots. There is a small strip mall that is sandwiched between Bass Pro's parking lots and the lots for the stadium/ pedestrian retail area that's just pathetic. Circuit City was one of the anchors there and now it's gone. I believe there is still a Bob's and Olive Garden on that small strip.
Maybe things will pick up with the start of the Rev's season and training camp, but I was blown away at just how dead it was the other day.
Ok, quite a bump here, but I needed to do some shopping the other day and the girlfriend always loves a good deal at Wrentham; so we decided to see what was going on at Patriot Place and maybe grab a bite to eat after spending too much money at the Outlets in Wrentham. The weather was nice so we were expecting a moderate crowd at least.
Boy were we wrong! It was DEAD. Furthermore, at LEAST 50% of the potential storefronts are completely vacant (covered with photos of moments in Patriot history). It was depressing and I really got the feeling of a failing venture. I know it's early on for this project and the economy doesn't help, but I was very surprised at the lack of life on a warm Saturday afternoon in April.
Here are a few snapshots I took:
Looking toward the hotel portion (note the empty storefront on the right):
The nearly empty (at about 2pm) "CBS Scene"
The "Hall"... nice looking, but again, dead (it's DRAFT Weekend!):
Where the Hall meets the entrance to the stadium:
The area near the stadium with CBS Scene, the Hall, Tastings, and the staircases down to the plaza and stadium entrance looks pretty nice. The upper portion of the retail mall (near Red Robin, the Hotel, etc) is ugly and boring. Like Toby said, it really has VERY little to offer in terms of variety of retail. Bass Pro Shops is cool, but it might as well be a world away to pedestrians as it's across a massive sea of parking lots. There is a small strip mall that is sandwiched between Bass Pro's parking lots and the lots for the stadium/ pedestrian retail area that's just pathetic. Circuit City was one of the anchors there and now it's gone. I believe there is still a Bob's and Olive Garden on that small strip.
Maybe things will pick up with the start of the Rev's season and training camp, but I was blown away at just how dead it was the other day.
pelhamhall
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Re: Patriots Place
Sure it sucks, but in fairness, most malls were dead this weekend - the weather was absolutely beautiful.
And in regards to the prior post, the profit model here is very, very different than a typical development. The land was already owned outright, and the mall serves to increase the value of the stadium as an events facility.
Sure it sucks, but in fairness, most malls were dead this weekend - the weather was absolutely beautiful.
And in regards to the prior post, the profit model here is very, very different than a typical development. The land was already owned outright, and the mall serves to increase the value of the stadium as an events facility.
Patriots_1228
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Re: Patriots Place
I hope i didn't already post these pics:
but here is a contrast to that, some gameday photos.
the line for CBS scene was massive
The shops may not get many visitors when there is nothing going on [afterall, its foxboro] However, I think they succeed in the fact that they will make people want to stay in the area for an extra hour or two before and after games. With the massive parking jams they have at Gillette, it makes a lot of sense to walk around and do some browsing before you go to the car, and hopefully by then the traffic will have lightened.
I hope i didn't already post these pics:
but here is a contrast to that, some gameday photos.
the line for CBS scene was massive
The shops may not get many visitors when there is nothing going on [afterall, its foxboro] However, I think they succeed in the fact that they will make people want to stay in the area for an extra hour or two before and after games. With the massive parking jams they have at Gillette, it makes a lot of sense to walk around and do some browsing before you go to the car, and hopefully by then the traffic will have lightened.
Re: Patriots Place
Sure, the mall will be quite lively when 68,000+ people are in town for one of 10 home games (pre and regular season) each year. You could also argue that they will be somewhat active for Revs games. In that regard, I think these stores will see some life.
The reason I was surprised about this weekend being dead was because the weather was so nice. Patriot Place is outdoors and you have Bass Pro Outdoors World (which was packed) and the entire development is very outdoors oriented. Wrentham had good crowds of shoppers enjoying some window shopping outside so I expected the same at PP. If this were the typical indoor suburban mall, then I would absolutely expect it to be dead; but it's not.
This development was intended to make the area around the stadium a full time destination, not just a destination for a few football and soccer games. I highly doubt retailers like Puma, Life is Good, Bob's, etc would buy in if the goal was to keep people around for for a few hours before/after the few games that take place each year.
I'm probably jumping the gun given that it hasn't been around that long, the economy is bad, and last weekend wasn't a big shoppers weekend. However, I was very surprised at the lack of retailers and the lack of people. I hope I'm wrong, because it could be nice if there were a few more shops and a little more life. Add some residential development in the area (and a full time T-stop instead of just on game days), a grocery store and you'd have a nice (and likely more lively) TOD. But right now, it feels VERY incomplete.
Sure, the mall will be quite lively when 68,000+ people are in town for one of 10 home games (pre and regular season) each year. You could also argue that they will be somewhat active for Revs games. In that regard, I think these stores will see some life.
The reason I was surprised about this weekend being dead was because the weather was so nice. Patriot Place is outdoors and you have Bass Pro Outdoors World (which was packed) and the entire development is very outdoors oriented. Wrentham had good crowds of shoppers enjoying some window shopping outside so I expected the same at PP. If this were the typical indoor suburban mall, then I would absolutely expect it to be dead; but it's not.
This development was intended to make the area around the stadium a full time destination, not just a destination for a few football and soccer games. I highly doubt retailers like Puma, Life is Good, Bob's, etc would buy in if the goal was to keep people around for for a few hours before/after the few games that take place each year.
I'm probably jumping the gun given that it hasn't been around that long, the economy is bad, and last weekend wasn't a big shoppers weekend. However, I was very surprised at the lack of retailers and the lack of people. I hope I'm wrong, because it could be nice if there were a few more shops and a little more life. Add some residential development in the area (and a full time T-stop instead of just on game days), a grocery store and you'd have a nice (and likely more lively) TOD. But right now, it feels VERY incomplete.
Boston02124
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Re: Patriots Place
^ the beaches were packed this week-end I went both days!
^ the beaches were packed this week-end I went both days!
Re: Patriots Place
I went Sunday. It was great and VERY crowded. I can't wait for summer.
I went Sunday. It was great and VERY crowded. I can't wait for summer.
tobyjug
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Re: Patriots Place
It is a bad time to be in the mall business. I'll bet the current cap rate on something like this one is, what, 9.5%? Hefty vacancies too. Love to know the sales p.s.f.
Be interesting to know if malls have a future. The "all you need is love" but "living in the material world" baby boom generation is moving to the divestment of possessions mode that normally accompanies old age.
It is a bad time to be in the mall business. I'll bet the current cap rate on something like this one is, what, 9.5%? Hefty vacancies too. Love to know the sales p.s.f.
Be interesting to know if malls have a future. The "all you need is love" but "living in the material world" baby boom generation is moving to the divestment of possessions mode that normally accompanies old age.
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Ron Newman
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Re: Patriots Place
But this isn't really a mall, if I'm understanding it correctly.
But this isn't really a mall, if I'm understanding it correctly.
Re: Patriots Place
Doesn't a "lifestyle center" imply some residential component? At least a mix of uses (i.e. retail/office)? This is tough to call mixed use and certainly doesn't contain a residential portion. The Hotel is a different use and the Hall/ Stadium are different uses, but it's not a good or diverse mix as this project is mostly chain retail/restaurant. In short, it's a mall. I think the long term plan is to make it a "lifestyle center" but it's still very much a mall right now.
Doesn't a "lifestyle center" imply some residential component? At least a mix of uses (i.e. retail/office)? This is tough to call mixed use and certainly doesn't contain a residential portion. The Hotel is a different use and the Hall/ Stadium are different uses, but it's not a good or diverse mix as this project is mostly chain retail/restaurant. In short, it's a mall. I think the long term plan is to make it a "lifestyle center" but it's still very much a mall right now.
Ron Newman
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Re: Patriots Place
A mall is a shopping center where you walk indoors between stores. It does not sound to me like Patriots Place is a mall.
A mall is a shopping center where you walk indoors between stores. It does not sound to me like Patriots Place is a mall.
Re: Patriots Place
^Much of Patriot Place is a strip mall (where Bass Pro is and the other small strip around Bob's Stores) in the sense that most of us would think of one... parking lots abutting a small strip of retail.
The portion closest to the stadium (shown in pictures) is an outdoor mall. It doesn't have a roof, but it's a mall in every sense. I wasn't aware that a "mall" had to be indoors to be considered a mall. This is no different than what you'd find in a suburban mall except without a roof (and with fewer open stores). It's almost identical to a pedestrian-only suburban outlet center like Wrentham Village or what you'd find in North Conway at Settler's Green outlets. It's an outdoor mall. There's nothing to designate it from a typical mall but a roof an the stadium next door.
^Much of Patriot Place is a strip mall (where Bass Pro is and the other small strip around Bob's Stores) in the sense that most of us would think of one... parking lots abutting a small strip of retail.
The portion closest to the stadium (shown in pictures) is an outdoor mall. It doesn't have a roof, but it's a mall in every sense. I wasn't aware that a "mall" had to be indoors to be considered a mall. This is no different than what you'd find in a suburban mall except without a roof (and with fewer open stores). It's almost identical to a pedestrian-only suburban outlet center like Wrentham Village or what you'd find in North Conway at Settler's Green outlets. It's an outdoor mall. There's nothing to designate it from a typical mall but a roof an the stadium next door.
Patriots_1228
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Re: Patriots Place
^ the other small strip is a disaster IMO. looks like somthing you'd find in nashua. If your going to build somthing in Gillette Stadium's parking lot, it can't look like your typical strip mall. The other larger part is great when your there, it feels like an outdoor mall, however, the parts facing the street are uninviting and hideous. They need to make it look more inviting from route 1 IMO. And that hotel blocks the view of the stadium which i don't like.
Btw, my least favorite term ever: Lifestyle Center
^ the other small strip is a disaster IMO. looks like somthing you'd find in nashua. If your going to build somthing in Gillette Stadium's parking lot, it can't look like your typical strip mall. The other larger part is great when your there, it feels like an outdoor mall, however, the parts facing the street are uninviting and hideous. They need to make it look more inviting from route 1 IMO. And that hotel blocks the view of the stadium which i don't like.
Btw, my least favorite term ever: Lifestyle Center
blade_bltz
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Re: Patriots Place
Ron, it's a strip mall. I don't know why you wouldn't call that a mall.
Ron, it's a strip mall. I don't know why you wouldn't call that a mall.