Seaport Neighborhood - Infill and Discussion

Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

SeamusMcFly said:
As to this, I will not agree to disagree. I'll just disagree.

The intent of the tunnels is not to reduce traffic, but to speed up and simplify traffic. As a byproduct it is to clean up pollution. Getting the exhaust pipes off the surface streets in gridlock, but moving steadily if slowly through a tunnel, means less time to release exhaust into the city. Large vent buildings and fans to direct the exhaust up into the air to dissipate and/or blow away rather than blowing into peoples faces at street level is a huge mitigation of pollution.

It's not cleaner because you can't see it, it's cleaner because it's cleaner.
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And those tunnels with their massive capacity have induced a great deal more traffic to flow to and through the city. So it's a mixed effect. Yeah, the nasty green monster is gone, but now there's a lot more vehicles with tail pipes spewing exhaust. And bottlenecks forming on the perimeter.

Furthermore, highway-only development means an increase in sprawl -- that's more natural land consumed for subdivisions, more auto trips in general, and higher levels of pollution regionally.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Matthew said:
And those tunnels with their massive capacity have induced a great deal more traffic to flow to and through the city. So it's a mixed effect. Yeah, the nasty green monster is gone, but now there's a lot more vehicles with tail pipes spewing exhaust. And bottlenecks forming on the perimeter.

Furthermore, highway-only development means an increase in sprawl -- that's more natural land consumed for subdivisions, more auto trips in general, and higher levels of pollution regionally.
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So, for the first paragraph. You are basically saying pollution of idle cars vs less idle cars but more cars producing pollution. The question becomes is more generated from 10,000 idle cars elevated or 20,000 moving cars (numbers for rhetorical purpose only)?

From my understanding, most pollution from cars are generated when idle with acceleration and deceleration. That's the one factoid I know. Of course, more cars could cancel out the savings of less idle cars, but that depends how much the new amount of cars produce.

The second paragraph sounds like an attack of the existence of highways at all. Sounding all the highways did is bad. We don't want massive, dead zone sprawl, but I'm not really sure how much of that type of sprawl have been created with the tunnel.

I also remember an argument by MassMotorist a few months back. There's two type of traffic: Necessary and Induced. The way you framed it seems all the new traffic is all induced and thus wasteful traffic that not towards any economic benefit or better of life (Reducing capacity in order would go from no effect >>> choosing other routes/modes >>> killing off traffic that would have been beneficial). Your wording indicate you seem to framing all new tunnel traffic is just induced indicating no benefit economically or societally. Are you saying that?
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I don't understand how opening the Haul Road would reduce traffic in the Seaport. Most of the traffic congestion is people trying to get over the bridges so they can get on 93N, Storrow, etc. right? The Haul Road bypasses to the south.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

AmericanFolkLegend said:
I don't understand how opening the Haul Road would reduce traffic in the Seaport. Most of the traffic congestion is people trying to get over the bridges so they can get on 93N, Storrow, etc. right? The Haul Road bypasses to the south.
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Right. You can go north where it terminates but you are south of the tunnel. So it would really only be of practical use for commuters traveling south or heading to Dorchester/Roxbury via South Bay.

I had thought the restricted access to the road was sort of a joke. We've been using the road since 2009 and have never been bothered by city or state police. It's been great for quick trips to Home Depot!
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Matthew said:
And those tunnels with their massive capacity have induced a great deal more traffic to flow to and through the city. So it's a mixed effect. Yeah, the nasty green monster is gone, but now there's a lot more vehicles with tail pipes spewing exhaust. And bottlenecks forming on the perimeter.

Furthermore, highway-only development means an increase in sprawl -- that's more natural land consumed for subdivisions, more auto trips in general, and higher levels of pollution regionally.
Click to expand...

My counter to this is merely anecdotal, but I find the traffic moves much more smoothly now than pre-tunnel, with less bottle necking whether at the city or the perimeter. The traffic still sucks am and pm rush hour, but I don't think it's worse in any way. I don't know about more traffic induced due to the tunnel. Is that true? Whether caused by the tunnel or an increase in jobs in the city, I do not know.

My point stands that there is less pollution where the people are.

Your second point is off point however. It's true yes, but more related to the 50's addition of a highway, not the 90's conversion of said highway to tunnel form. The highway was there, and needs to stay there (along its route anyways).
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Does anybody know when they will replace the concrete divider in the center of the road with the flowers and shrubs like in this render, and like they have done in the waterside place area?

539w.jpg
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Pollution doesn't respect political boundaries. It needs to be addressed as a region. That's been the approach of the Clean Air Act regulations. You cannot cut the scope of the CA/T down to just the land above the tunnels in downtown Boston; it does not address the regional pollution problem.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

DC-by-the-Sea is really coming together!

It's finally starting to cluster. Even if the architecture so far leaves a lot to be desired, it's heading in the right direction.

Thanks for the pics!
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Lol. I was just thinking the same thing... leaves a lot to be desired, style wise, but at least there is the beginning of some density here.


tmac9wr said:
DC-by-the-Sea is really coming together!

It's finally starting to cluster. Even if the architecture so far leaves a lot to be desired, it's heading in the right direction.
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Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

My guess is that it is referring to fan pier and pier 4 plans commencing with their "phased" construction.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I know they have been drilling for the planned "22 Liberty" condo project for a couple of months now. I believe that will be in front of the Vertex buildings. The Goodwin Proctor building should be starting soon as well if they are going to make their early 2016 lease startup date. That building - with included hotel - is supposed to be in back of the ICA, next to the first Pier 4 building.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

I haven't seen a good rendering of either of those yet. I wonder what they are waiting for. Anything that blocks waterside place is a welcome addition.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Don't count your chickens on GP. My friend is a partner and says that they have discussed very little regarding any development for the site.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

choo said:
I haven't seen a good rendering of either of those yet. I wonder what they are waiting for. Anything that blocks waterside place is a welcome addition.
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22 Liberty/Residences at Fan Pier is designed (in CD phase) and there are/were no public renders. It looks nice though. That's all I'll say.
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Why does the interesting side of every building in Boston face the water.......
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

^ For all those tourists on Harbor Cruises of course!
 
Re: Innovation Dist. / South Boston Seaport

Anyone know what's going on with the Innovation Center? Progress seems to have been stalled for a couple months now.
 
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