The Hub on Causeway (née TD Garden Towers) | 80 Causeway Street | West End

I love that the supermarket will be below ground level here. There are certain things that really benefit from being at/above GL, and other things that work just fine (or better) below ground...the Roche Bros. @ DTX is prime example of how great a supermarket can work down below. They take up so much space, and really don't need to have windows...so I say, bury 'em, and save the sidewalk frontage for other stuff.
 
I definitely notice being underground at the Roche dtx. In the back part which opened later I believe, I feels like a dark cave back there. Could be the design scheme too
 
[url=https://flic.kr/p/NU9UW2 said:
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[/url]https://flic.kr/p/NU9UW2
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Cool photo BeeLine!!
 
Suffolk 83 said:
I definitely notice being underground at the Roche dtx. In the back part which opened later I believe, I feels like a dark cave back there. Could be the design scheme too
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Aren't most grocery stores (and big box stores in general) fully enclosed and mostly windowless anyway? This is just a lighting problem.
 
Yea they all usually have windows at the front of the store at least which obviously doesnt happen underground.
 
JumboBuc said:
I'm weird, but I always consider new grocery store openings to be one of the clearest indications of the societal benefits of density.

The Roche Bros at DTX, the TJs at Assembly, the TJs in Lower Allston, the Whole Foods at Ink Block, this Star Market: they're all clear wins for the community made possible by new dense residential development. The presence of these stores greatly benefits people who don't live in the associated buildings, possible even more so (on the aggregate) than those that do...
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It will even benefit those farther out: commuters using the Commuter Rail. Instead of sitting in the waiting room, passengers can shop for their groceries and bring them with them on the train, eliminating potential stops on the way home. Sure, they won't be doing their core shopping (or buying the way-aforementioned 100 lb bags of dog food), but for someone taking the train to Anderson and then driving home to Stoneham or Burlington, it will be a huge convenience not to stop at the Market Basket at the Woburn Mall on the way home.
 
As it relates to the super market here (it's going to be a Star Market?), why has it taken so long for full service supermarkets to really start popping up in the city? Whole Foods in the South End at Ink Block. Roche Brothers inside Millennium Tower in DTX. Trader Joe's over in Allston near HBS. Star Market here in Causeway Street.
 
mass88 said:
As it relates to the super market here (it's going to be a Star Market?), why has it taken so long for full service supermarkets to really start popping up in the city? Whole Foods in the South End at Ink Block. Roche Brothers inside Millennium Tower in DTX. Trader Joe's over in Allston near HBS. Star Market here in Causeway Street.
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Don't forget the "new" Star/Shaw's that went into the Pru about a decade ago. I believe that was the first of the newer/renovated markets downtown. I remember it's opening well as I happened to live in the area at the time.
 
BosDevelop said:
Don't forget the "new" Star/Shaw's that went into the Pru about a decade ago. I believe that was the first of the newer/renovated markets downtown. I remember it's opening well as I happened to live in the area at the time.
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And Stop & Shop at One Brigham Circle.
 
mass88 said:
As it relates to the super market here (it's going to be a Star Market?), why has it taken so long for full service supermarkets to really start popping up in the city? Whole Foods in the South End at Ink Block. Roche Brothers inside Millennium Tower in DTX. Trader Joe's over in Allston near HBS. Star Market here in Causeway Street.
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There's a graduate level class on food deserts and accessibility to grocery stores in urban areas that I could direct you to if you want a very nuanced answer to that question. (otherwise, I'll spare you)

The "short" answer: not enough people with disposable income lived downtown until the last couple decades to merit construction of large-scale supermarkets. Millennium Crossing (as I've dubbed their Tower, Place, & Avery residences), Archstone, Kensington, Ava, and other Downtown residential towers concentrated thousands of high-income earners in the neighborhood, thus establishing a market there for a Roche Bros. The Master Plan for Ink Block, 345 Harrison, Troy, and several other residential developments in the South End & Broadway areas drove the market for a supermarket in that area.

Though more housing has popped up around HBS & Western Ave in Allston where the Trader Joes opened, I genuinely wonder if that store opening was more a response to relieve congestion at the Coolidge Corner location. (I've read in a couple places that the Coolidge Trader Joes is the busiest or most profitable per square foot in the country).

Among West End reconstruction, Avenir, Victor, Merano, the Bulfinch Crossing master plan, and (of course) the Hub on Causeway master plan, the new market of thousands of residents in the Bulfinch Triangle drives the demand to support a Star Market at Hub on Causeway.

The only other consideration I'd add is the challenge with finding upwards of 40,000+ square feet in the middle of the city to add new supermarkets. Deals like that take a long time to coordinate and evolve from (see Filene's Basement Hole). At the end of the day, decision-making and planning during the last decade will continue to make Boston a more livable city than most in the long run.
 
Not saying you're wrong but you need disposable income to go to a grocery store? Have you ever been to a small market/bodega in the city? They're even more expensive
 
Suffolk 83 said:
Not saying you're wrong but you need disposable income to go to a grocery store? Have you ever been to a small market/bodega in the city? They're even more expensive
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I think you focused on the wrong part. It isn't really the disposable income on any one patron, its the total dollar volume across all patrons.

Take the perspective of the grocery store. If you look at a neighborhood and see a population that has been getting by with bodegas and small markets, how sure are that your 40,000 sq foot store is going to get enough business? You might do some math and see that even if you took all the grocery business in the area, it wouldn't support your store. When things are stable (as they had been for a long time in Boston) then why stick your neck out?

On the other hand, If the neighborhood population is growing (downtown, Bulfinch Triangle, Ink Block, Kendall) then the math starts to look more attractive. You don't have to cannibalize everyone else's business if you are part of the neighborhood's growth.
 
A shaws I wouldnt count as disposable income. The one in Fenway on Boylston is going to be replaced with a tower so hopefully we get one of these new modern shnazzy ones in its place. A basement one there would be great too to keep retail/restaurants at ground level. The one at New Balance is being replaced too with a tower and I dont remember if a new one is going in but Id bet one is but hell lets do it there too. No need to take up ground level space with them.
 
Thanks for describing supply/demand and competition for me fattony like I'm a child, I didnt understand that before you came around.
 
Lrfox said:
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This is a beautiful shot. I love the industrial era buildings near North Station (and I realize many/most of them are gone at this point).

Even if the Hub on C's architecture isn't great, at least it's breathing life back into the area and helping us celebrate whatever enduring charm survived from the past.
 
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