The Hub on Causeway (née TD Garden Towers) | 80 Causeway Street | West End

FitchburgLine said:
Whatever your personal opinion of the piece is, your claim that statler's rebuttal is "obvious to anyone" is just false. Here's an NBER paper making a convincing argument that for colleges, nearly all press is good press, with a mechanism of action (increased media coverage) that is identical to the effect you dismissed: https://www.nber.org/papers/w24852
Personal attack away, but don't do it with data you don't have.
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For what it's worth, I don't think my post was much of a personal attack. I do believe the post I was responding to was a personal attack.

I'm sure your paywalled article on the effects of Title IX investigations on college admissions is interesting, but one only needs a quick google search (or a functioning memory) to realize that all publicity is not in fact good publicity. This is the problem with speaking in absolutes and I'm not sure peddling cliches adds much to the discussion. Certainly no one deserves to be called "cranky" for simply pointing out that bad != good.

If we could get back to specifics, would someone like to explain how an article in The Globe about a developer wanting to "rebrand" this area to something the vast majority of Bostonians likely find ridiculous in any way increases the value of this property? To me this seems to be more of a distraction from how great this development really is.

Take this forum as a microcosm. Instead of discussing the amazing views these towers will have or the great convenience of being located above North Station or the fact that this project is adding a grocery store, and a movie theater, and a music venue to the area we're talking about some executive's asinine branding effort. Win!
 
Justin7 said:
If we could get back to specifics, would someone like to explain how an article in The Globe about a developer wanting to "rebrand" this area to something the vast majority of Bostonians likely find ridiculous in any way increases the value of this property? To me this seems to be more of a distraction from how great this development really is.

Take this forum as a microcosm. Instead of discussing the amazing views these towers will have or the great convenience of being located above North Station or the fact that this project is adding a grocery store, and a movie theater, and a music venue to the area we're talking about some executive's asinine branding effort. Win!
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I'm not in marketing or branding, but I'll give it a shot. This was entirely about getting an article in the Globe about the development, not about changing the name of the neighborhood. The provocative suggestion wasn't meant to stick, but rather was intended to stimulate a reporter's interest. Success!

As for using this forum as a microcosm, it isn't. This is a self selecting group with a unique interest in mostly arcane issues. What resonates with us, what causes great angst among us, probably isn't even noticed by the general public. What the general public is getting from this exercise is an awareness that the Garden has changed, that the neighborhood is no longer an empty wasteland. That's what will stick with them, while the idea of calling it uptown will quickly disappear, since it was never meant to be in the first place.
 
Justin7 said:
If we could get back to specifics, would someone like to explain how an article in The Globe about a developer wanting to "rebrand" this area to something the vast majority of Bostonians likely find ridiculous in any way increases the value of this property? To me this seems to be more of a distraction from how great this development really is.
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Simple, it makes an association between the name and the neighborhood that otherwise didn't exist. Were you or anyone else thinking "Uptown" when you though of of this area? Now if someone says "Uptown" I'm going to connect those dots. The initial reaction isn't positive, but that's pretty normal. Overtime that could change (though in this case, I doubt it will). Especially if developers latch onto it in future projects. It also drums up more publicity for the Hub development. Win on that front.

Take this forum as a microcosm. Instead of discussing the amazing views these towers will have or the great convenience of being located above North Station or the fact that this project is adding a grocery store, and a movie theater, and a music venue to the area we're talking about some executive's asinine branding effort. Win!
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We're not a microcosm though. We're a group of people that are far more heavily invested in the nuances of Boston development than the average person. This stuff carries more weight with us. The connection between the name the developers like and the area has been made. Frankly, our opinions don't really matter. If other developers latch on, buyers and tenants at the properties use the name, and the general public makes the connection and accepts it, who cares what ArchBoston thinks? Add it to the list of branding efforts we've crapped on in the past - Russia Wharf to Atlantic Wharf, XMBLY, pretty much every non-numerical building name ever, pretty much every new street name ever, etc. Most of that stuff has stuck regardless of what we think. I don't think this neighborhood will be "Uptown" in 10 years, but getting it in the Globe doesn't hurt the effort.
 
Thank you both for the replies. A few points:

HenryAlan said:
This was entirely about getting an article in the Globe about the development, not about changing the name of the neighborhood. The provocative suggestion wasn't meant to stick, but rather was intended to stimulate a reporter's interest. Success!
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The problem with this interpretation is that the article wasn't about the development. It was fully about neighborhood branding, stopping only to note that this was BP's idea. I'd guess that outside of this forum most discussion is focused on the name, not the development. I'd also wager that most "buzz" is a quick comment and laugh at BP's expense. I still fail to see how this is helpful.

HenryAlan said:
As for using this forum as a microcosm, it isn't. This is a self selecting group with a unique interest in mostly arcane issues. What resonates with us, what causes great angst among us, probably isn't even noticed by the general public. What the general public is getting from this exercise is an awareness that the Garden has changed, that the neighborhood is no longer an empty wasteland. That's what will stick with them, while the idea of calling it uptown will quickly disappear, since it was never meant to be in the first place.
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I expected this response. You'll notice the things I mentioned (views, convenience, movie theater/music venue/grocery store) are all things that many people outside aB will be very interested in. We may be a little ahead of the game in knowing these things are coming. If we were discussing the facade, massing, or street interaction I'd grant you this point, but otherwise I'd say we are a reasonable sample. The article didn't go into any of this.

Lrfox said:
Simple, it makes an association between the name and the neighborhood that otherwise didn't exist. Were you or anyone else thinking "Uptown" when you though of of this area? Now if someone says "Uptown" I'm going to connect those dots. The initial reaction isn't positive, but that's pretty normal. Overtime that could change (though in this case, I doubt it will). Especially if developers latch onto it in future projects. It also drums up more publicity for the Hub development. Win on that front.

We're not a microcosm though. We're a group of people that are far more heavily invested in the nuances of Boston development than the average person. This stuff carries more weight with us. The connection between the name the developers like and the area has been made. Frankly, our opinions don't really matter. If other developers latch on, buyers and tenants at the properties use the name, and the general public makes the connection and accepts it, who cares what ArchBoston thinks? Add it to the list of branding efforts we've crapped on in the past - Russia Wharf to Atlantic Wharf, XMBLY, pretty much every non-numerical building name ever, pretty much every new street name ever, etc. Most of that stuff has stuck regardless of what we think. I don't think this neighborhood will be "Uptown" in 10 years, but getting it in the Globe doesn't hurt the effort.
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Fox, you seem to be making a different point: That the neighborhood branding actually is important. Perhaps people have made a connection between the developer and the name, but again, how is that helpful? And again, it may be publicity, but I see no explanation of how this is "good" publicity.
 
Justin7 said:
Fox, you seem to be making a different point: That the neighborhood branding actually is important. Perhaps people have made a connection between the developer and the name, but again, how is that helpful? And again, it may be publicity, but I see no explanation of how this is "good" publicity.
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I think it's a both/and situation. There is some ambiguity about what neighborhood this actually is in the eyes of many, and even the two most obvious answers (Bulfinch Triangle/West End) aren't names that prospective tenants and buyers would associate with the best of Boston (not bad by any stretch, but not great). So it makes sense that the developer would want to brand the neighborhood with something that sounds a little more upmarket and sexy. Also something more definitive that creates a better sense of place than West End or Bulfinch Triangle (the latter of which i personally don't think is bad, but I can see why a developer wouldn't want to stick with it). I don't think it'll stick, but I get why they'd want to do it. It's "good" publicity on that front because the Globe article begins the process of having the masses make the connection between that area (and that development) as "Uptown." We scoff at it (deservedly so), but we scoff at a lot. Over time, rebrands like this sometimes do get adopted (see: DTX, Leather District, etc.). A big piece of that is getting the name on the tongues of the public and having people repeat it. The Globe article is a big step in that direction.

That's all long-term and who knows how it'll pan out. The immediate impact is that the massive Hub on Causeway is getting more time in the spotlight with these headlines. Spotlight and recognition for a transformative project such as this is never bad PR, especially if the worst you can say about it is that the attempt to rebrand the neighborhood is a little cheesy.
 
HenryAlan said:
I'm not in marketing or branding, but I'll give it a shot. This was entirely about getting an article in the Globe about the development, not about changing the name of the neighborhood. The provocative suggestion wasn't meant to stick, but rather was intended to stimulate a reporter's interest. Success!
Click to expand...

Justin7 said:
The problem with this interpretation is that the article wasn't about the development. It was fully about neighborhood branding, stopping only to note that this was BP's idea. I'd guess that outside of this forum most discussion is focused on the name, not the development. I'd also wager that most "buzz" is a quick comment and laugh at BP's expense. I still fail to see how this is helpful.
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Maybe, but when I look at that article, the first thing I see is a picture of the new Garden and North Station entrance. I think that's going to be the take away for most people, but I could certainly be wrong.
 
You ain't (wrong). BP's pr tactic/s deplorable (or not); your points (& Mike's) are plausible.
 
Amazing how many buildings with signage will be in the area!

1. Converse
2. Courtyard
3. North Station/TD Garden
4. State Street
5. ??
how many am i missing/ how many more will come?

Too late now, but could they have have slipped in a clandestine "Uptown" branding campaign by joining w/ Avalon to form Uptown East & West Towers–never arousing public suspicion, beyond a few snarky grins?
 
I like the discussion on the naming and what might make the aB community “not your average” person. I would add only one thing on the name - it’s more than cheesy, but it’s actually anti-Boston. Boston is one city that doesn’t have any particular axis; its charm is that it’s a hodgepodge of jumbled together parts that bear no linear relation to one another in the way that they might in other cities. And that’s why names like “Midtown” and “Uptown” are utterly anathema to Boston. Those are names that apply to cities that have a single axis, like the Mississippi in New Orleans, or the long axis of Manhattan... not to
mention the fact that most people associate these names specifically with New York (!), a city I personally love but has absolutely no business providing name transplants up here. I mean, come on.

The name won’t stick, probably for anti-NYC sentiment and general cheesiness, but I do think the name is more of a miss than your usual developer cheese. But here I am blathering about this, and there is probably truth to the posters saying this was really an attention seeking move more than anything else. It sure worked for the folks on aB...
 
^^The top photo is iconic in the way it fills the airspace from this perspective....

"u/c" makes a forward statement. ...The glazing once complete, all the more.
/
 
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^^^That elevated view by the Statehouse is probably my favorite of the new North Station area towers.

From Waltham, January 19 before the snow.

IMG_9121 by David Z, on Flickr

IMG_9129 by David Z, on Flickr
 
Wow! Nice series of pics, love the framing of the Hub's residential building with the mostly low rise, yet very attractive, older brick buildings in the foreground. It really is a Boston trademark, this mixing of the old with the new.
 
The side of Portal Park closest to the Hub is completely dug up..including the trees. Staging for office tower construction perhaps? Sad to lose those trees, particularly if they keep those on the other side of Bobby Orr. The loss of symmetry will aggravate my anal retentiveness :p
 
Money said:
The side of Portal Park closest to the Hub is completely dug up..including the trees. Staging for office tower construction perhaps? Sad to lose those trees, particularly if they keep those on the other side of Bobby Orr. The loss of symmetry will aggravate my anal retentiveness :p
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Ugh. Those provided some much needed shade during the summer months. And they looked really nice.
 
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