Washington Village | Andrew Square | South Boston

JeffDowntown

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BCDC:


It's a trend now that all large developments need to start with a big honkin' landscraper apartment building (this one, Allston Yards, XMBLY, etc.) to... what? Establish credibility?
Cheapest option per sq. ft. of development -- demonstrate financial viability and demand for the location. Then get financing for the mid- to high-rise sections (more costly per sq. ft.)
 

goody

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BCDC:


It's a trend now that all large developments need to start with a big honkin' landscraper apartment building (this one, Allston Yards, XMBLY, etc.) to... what? Establish credibility?
Sort of. My guess is they want to start with the less costly and therefore less risky product type (in this case its looks like a 5 over 2 construction which is the maximum height you can stick build) to test the sub-market, establish the location, and get cash flowing to recoup costs from acquisition and permitting. Future, high-rise, phases will proceed once the initial phases are proven out which provides more time for the location to mature (ie rents to grow) before commencing a product type which is more costly to build and operate. It wouldn't surprise me if the largest money maker of this scheme is the lower rise portions which they then need to front load.

From a design perspective this is certainly the parcel that wants to be development first. As far as scale goes, it does leave something to be desired but its not horrible in IMHO.
 

stick n move

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“Washington Village proposal adds apartments and subtracts a building”

“The developers behind a multi-building project near the Red Line’s Andrew Square stop in the Dorchester-South Boston borderlands have added dozens of apartments to their plans while subtracting one building.....”
Continued...
 

whighlander

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“Washington Village proposal adds apartments and subtracts a building”

“The developers behind a multi-building project near the Red Line’s Andrew Square stop in the Dorchester-South Boston borderlands have added dozens of apartments to their plans while subtracting one building.....”
Continued...
Nothing at all wrong with the scale and density here -- after all as I've stated numerous times Paris and London are mostly constructed at this scale

Build this -- give it 10 years to mature and perhaps let some of the surrounding side streets get re-developed and then come back with a couple of 20 story book-ends -- you'll have created about 2000 units right along a relatively under-utilized segment of the Red Line -- and well within walking commute of the soon-to-be GE-Gillette version of Kendall Square anchored to the Broadway Station
 

odurandina

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I assume the 21 story/278' mid-rise has hit the big sleep phase?
until demand kicks up.......
 
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stick n move

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I assume the 21 story/278' mid-rise has hit the big sleep phase?
until demand kicks up.......
Thats what I assumed, but the article says this:

“Washington Village is now due to have 746 condos and apartments total in buildings as high as 85 feet (the previous peak was 70).”

Doesnt make sense, the previous peak was well higher than 70’ and it sounds like theyre actually gaining height on that. All I can think of is that theres a couple phases and the 21 story tower is in a later phase. Idk..
 

Cortes

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Did some quick math and the area bordered by Old Colony Rd, the bypass road to eastern edge of the railroad tracks and then south to Dorchester St and back to Old Colony is more than half the the size of the Suffolk Downs redevelopment area. (300,000 m2 as opposed to 550,000 very rough.) While I don't know about 10,000 new residences for this area I have absolutely no reason to doubt that number if this development, which requires no variances, is the norm. There are so many differences between the two sites that it is hard to compare them, but one difference is that Suffolk will still look very much like a giant construction site for years, while this will not.
 
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whighlander

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Interesting summary in Curbed of all the recent development proposed / approved for the area of Dorchester in the vicinity of Andrew and JFK/UMass T Stations -- comes complete with interactive map

Dorchester’s big new developments, mapped
A handful of projects are set to add hundreds of housing units and hundreds of thousands of square feet of office and retail space to Boston’s largest neighborhood

By Tom Acitelli Jan 29, 2020, 6:43am EST

1. Washington Village
235 Old Colony Ave
Boston, MA 02127

Washington Village in the Dorchester-South Boston borderlands will now have 214 apartments instead of 124 and seven buildings total instead of eight, according to a change that the Boston Planning and Development Agency approved in late January. The 214 apartments are due to be in one building instead of two.

Recall that a development team that includes prolific Boston builder Samuels & Associates has been planning Washington Village for several years. Construction has yet to start, though nearly all the properties that were on the 4.89-acre parcel—mostly one- to two-story industrial and commercial buildings—have been demolished.

The site also includes a former surface parking lot, making the planned development part of an ongoing trend in Boston of redeveloping such parcels.
 

whighlander

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Curbed doesnt realize Washington Village isnt in Dorchester... they are, not great
Suffolk -- that's a bit of a technical nit to pick -- most people reading Curbed or the BBJ probably do not know where Southie ends and Dorchester begins in that area
 

Scott

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Suffolk -- that's a bit of a technical nit to pick -- most people reading Curbed or the BBJ probably do not know where Southie ends and Dorchester begins in that area
Lets pick that nit. Curbed cannot be absolutely proven wrong. Nobody knows where Dorchester ends and Southie begins. However it is safe to say this is in South Boston despite Washington Village being founded as part of Dorchester. In Boston, only Charlestown and East Boston have undisputed boundaries
 

chrisbrat

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dunno bout that ^^^. i don't know anyone who's unclear on what is or is not back bay, for example (and it's pretty clearly defined being that that neighborhood is infill of the... yknow, back bay). i've never heard anyone question whether some address is, say, south end or back bay or kenmore or back bay, etc. the only truly amorphous nieghborhood boundary that i've ever encountered is allston/brighton.
 

Cortes

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dunno bout that ^^^. i don't know anyone who's unclear on what is or is not back bay, for example (and it's pretty clearly defined being that that neighborhood is infill of the... yknow, back bay). i've never heard anyone question whether some address is, say, south end or back bay or kenmore or back bay, etc. the only truly amorphous nieghborhood boundary that i've ever encountered is allston/brighton.
The boundary between Roxbury and Dorchester is absolutely anyone's guess. The confusion was featured in a fairly good article only a couple of months ago in a local neighborhood paper, The Bay State Banner. https://www.baystatebanner.com/2019/11/06/roxbury-line-contested-in-media-on-the-street/ Dorchester creek, the original boundary, simply does not exist anymore. As to South Boston and Dorchester, well, South Boston IS Dorchester Neck and Dorchester Heights, but even mentioning that might get you into a bit of trouble in the D street projects that basically border this site. This site is in South Boston.

Anyway. I simply can't wait for this to get started. If things go even remotely according to "the plan", this area could become someplace that claims a name for itself before it's all said and done. If you include Widett, you could make an argument that this would be "crosstown", or even truer and more confusing, "back of the bay". But even then, this would be on the very fringes, so yeah, Southie.

Of all the development around, this project gets me the most excited. What I see when I look at the neighborhood between Andrew and Broadway is an unbelievable opportunity to create a REAL new place in Boston. I struggle with the notion that any one entity (development team) could possibly create a "real" neighborhood. While Assembly Square is getting there, I don't know... Upcoming attempts at Suffolk Downs and Allston Yards, I am not excited in the slightest by their "urbanity" in the renders. This area enjoys a MASSIVE advantage to me expressly because nobody will be forced to "create" anything in that regard. They can instead focus on how their particular portion interacts with the other competing interests in the area, creating the tension that is essential to any real neighborhood. I like the addition of a new street as part of this development. I hope that that spirit continues.
 
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BronsonShore

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dunno bout that ^^^. i don't know anyone who's unclear on what is or is not back bay, for example (and it's pretty clearly defined being that that neighborhood is infill of the... yknow, back bay). i've never heard anyone question whether some address is, say, south end or back bay or kenmore or back bay, etc. the only truly amorphous nieghborhood boundary that i've ever encountered is allston/brighton.
There absolutely is some confusion about where the South End ends and Back Bay begins.
 

JeffDowntown

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Great example, St. Botolph mini-neighborhood. Definitely aligns toward South End, but has Back Bay resident parking stickers.

There is also great confusion about where the edges are between South End and Roxbury, and Back Bay and Fenway.

In real estate terms, if you are selling, the property is in the South End or Back Bay. If you are buying it is in Roxbury or the Fenway.
 

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