2016 Presidential Election (General Election)

[Arlington]

Most people assimilate only those facts that fit their preconceptions and pre-existing understanding of a situation. Its how the human mind mostly works.

If you happen to have an open mind about the election, I think goes hand in hand with being uncomfortable with how badly the facts fit the traditional Red/Blue narratives (and really, how badly they always have).

I don't think anyone with an open mind can be persuaded to vote Clinton or Trump at this point because it is almost axiomatic that any politician able to lock up a constituency has probably exploited a lot of closed minds.

I think Clinton's going to win simply because she's assembled a slightly larger coalition that is slightly more likely to vote and then she'll be slightly better at her get-out-the-vote efforts.

 

[Jouhou]

I think Clinton's going to win because trump just spent a week straight talking shit about women and still doesn't understand how sexist he's been. I'm pretty up in arms about that, being female and all.

 

[statler]

Oddly, there are still plenty of females willing to vote Trump. Strange days.

 

[bigpicture7]

I think Clinton's going to win because trump just spent a week straight talking shit about women and still doesn't understand how sexist he's been. I'm pretty up in arms about that, being female and all.

Jouhou, I agree...and in particular, while I respect his/her opinion, I think Arlington downplays this aspect in the statement below (e.g., "simply because"..."slightly better")

I think Clinton's going to win simply because she's assembled a slightly larger coalition that is slightly more likely to vote and then she'll be slightly better at her get-out-the-vote efforts.

Trump's ignorant shock factor campaign is also a campaign that alienates voters.

 

[Justin7]

Both candidates don't pay taxes that's my point. They uses these foundations as slush funds. I'm not saying Trump is innocent but you are trying to paint him in this corner of being Hilter with money. And I see this as the establishment/Media will do anything to discredit Trump which is forcing me to vote for him. Since the Clintons are exposed as part of establishment they are corrupt and vile. I only see Trump as a Businessman and he understands how the world is cutthroat.

Do the Govt Agencies even work for the American People anymore? I'm actually surprised the FBI found Whitey Bulger.
FBI Allowed 2 Hillary Aides To "Destroy" Their Laptops In Newly Exposed "Side Agreements"
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-...y-their-laptops-newly-exposed-side-agreements


What is the difference between Trump trying to stop the estate tax vs The Clinton Foundation Non-profit---
Trump is trying to give his kids more inheritance and the Clintons have a Unlimited Slush fund for their family for the rest of their lives being in Politics. Next Chelsea will run for Congress.
Oh the Clintons need to give away 10% of their money to a noble cause only to manipulate that scenario who all the politics involved in that project.

If the establishment had any creditability the People/Children of Flint would not be drinking poison Water.

First I will point out that the Clinton tax returns have been released and that you can read through them. They certainly paid taxes. You will probably ignore this. I am confused as to why.

You seem to have been manipulated to the point that you are afraid of facts. You refuse to educate yourself. You ignore anything that disagrees with your make-believe world view. You're being played, man.

Your first inclination will be to respond to me (again) by claiming that I am attacking you. I will point out (again) that I am trying to help. I know I should probably just ignore your posts because you're likely too old to change, but I just can't help but try to get through to you.

How did you get to this point? What made you turn to far right fringe websites? Were you looking for confirmation of something you couldn't find somewhere else? Honest questions. Not really expecting you to answer, but I'm curious.

 

[datadyne007]

First I will point out that the Clinton tax returns have been released and that you can read through them. They certainly paid taxes. You will probably ignore this. I am confused as to why.

You seem to have been manipulated to the point that you are afraid of facts. You refuse to educate yourself. You ignore anything that disagrees with your make-believe world view. You're being played, man.

Your first inclination will be to respond to me (again) by claiming that I am attacking you. I will point out (again) that I am trying to help. I know I should probably just ignore your posts because you're likely too old to change, but I just can't help but try to get through to you.

How did you get to this point? What made you turn to far right fringe websites? Were you looking for confirmation of something you couldn't find somewhere else? Honest questions. Not really expecting you to answer, but I'm curious.

For reference:
https://www.hillaryclinton.com/page/tax-returns/

 

[bolehboleh]

What are "Rieds," and why do the Obamas, Clintons and Pelosis possess them?

Edit: Yes, I know I'm trolling, but it's only because this conversation has gone pretty much as predicted.

On a side note, I started a ballot question thread:
http://www.archboston.org/community/showthread.php?t=5360

I figure it's more relevant to our day to day lives than whoever wins the presidential race - and the conversation might actually be less vapid and cliche than this one.

 

[odurandina]

i edited the post (see below)

The liberal agenda requires that the press be maintained under strict controls. The Boston Globe is Boston's liberal safe space requiring labels and abject censorship to STOP people they don't like; the Pat Buchanan, Ann Coulters, Laura Ingraham, Newt Gingrich and Donald Trump. They've been pulling this crap for decades.

Good thing too; That's the world Dem backers need to live in. Safe spaces, false media reporting, liberal fascist editorial bias and the big one: less and less genuine debate... Down the rabbit hole it degenerates into the love ins you see with the Candy Crowley's and that turd shillfest you saw the other night.

On college campuses and campaign rally's it's rapidly turning toward Bolshevik style thuggery and intimidation to silence conservative leaning people.

 

[odurandina]

The only campaign Hillary Clinton can engage in, is one that deflects from who and what she actually represents. She can't run on her record - because it's a disaster. And the problem isn't 3/4 of the middle east collapsing into barbarism, or the Cold War returning and RUSSIAN RESET biting her in the ass. There's virtually nothing good, great or even positive in her record whatsoever. She's forced to rely on the only thing she has: Her mastery as a political operative itself; just like the 2 Democrat divide and conquer shittards that preceded her.

The Clinton's are the lowest pond scum in the history of American politics, exceeded only by the Obama's.

Obama used the office of the presidency to engage in a 4 year fund raising and reelection campaign paid for by YOU the taxpayers. He used the IRS to intimidate GOP grass roots organizations. He should go to prison for 30 years.

Hillary should spend 20 years at Club Fed.

Divide and conquer Bill is no petty criminal. He's just as bad as his wife.

Hillary in the White House is a disaster waiting to happen. 'It' will get very ugly, fast. At the very least, expect wide open borders and much more terrorist activity at home within the next 3-5 years.

Every aspect of her political existence is covert, dirty, dishonest and corrupt.

Like Obama, the method is simple; conduct all business in absolute secrecy, discharge epic criminality, graft, theft and cover it up with an army of like-minded operatives in the .gov and media,.... turn it all into the same bread and circus we're seeing now..... keep it going; wide open borders, continue to loot the treasury.... and slowly and continually convert America from an educated class of free men and women into a nation of, indigent bafoons and serfs.

Richard Nixon is a saint compared to these p.o.s. criminals.

There exists no political end harsh enough for the Obama's, Clinton's, Pelosi's and Reids.

I'm no fan of Trump but i'm appalled by the undeserved faith in government hacks, petty and serious criminals - people so eagerly hand over.

My personal opinion; is that we already have too much debt, and have exported too much manufacturing to have a strong economy in the short term. We may be headed for 20-30 years of stagflation.

Trump understands this reality far better than Hillary Clinton. If it wasn't for Trump and Sanders pointing out our likely very dim future, if the present course is continued, Hillary would be running against Jeb talking about how great our fundamentals are.

Trump and Sanders changed the entire conversation and stole the false narrative of the actual and true nature of our underperforming economy back from these career hacks.

Trump will likely, make a considerably better presidential leader than campaigner - because he's not a career politician. He's not in with the crime syndicate.... Doesn't owe them much (save for his friends at the banks) He might actually be able to address some of these real problems - without having to focus endlessly on window dressing about his privileged and playboy past, and (by comparison) trivial, PC matters that the assholes who write for the Globe deem so important.

And why shouldn't they? The truth of how the world is performing is a stunning rebuke of Obama's and Hillary's far left-of center, worthless leadership.

 

[Lrfox]

^Your thoughts on Clinton are based on a network of conspiracy theories ("I can't prove anything because it's all a big sercret all of the TRUTH has been carefully covered up by Crooked Hillary and her cronies!"). I've never seen anything like it in my life.

"I'm no fan of Trump..." What indication has he given you that anything he does will be in anyone's best interests but his own? The response on the far right to the recent tax leaks is hysterical. If Donald Trump is so proud of how "brilliant" he was to take advantage of those policies, then why did his return have to be leaked in the first place? You're talking about about one of the most boisterous personalities and egos in existence. If he's proud of it, or thinks he's a "genius" for being able to take advantage of it, then why did it take Clinton and the NYT to expose it?

The reality is that he has no interest in changing the tax code to close such a loophole. Why would he? It's benefited him and people like him for a long time. As President, he wouldn't be giving up his business interests. It's not difficult to see why he proposes a pretty straightforward version of trickle-down economics and has done nothing to indicate he would make any effort to alter the polices that enabled him to get out of paying taxes for 18 years. It's amazing that the far-right can convince themselves that Donald J. Trump- the bright orange face of everything wrong with American business and the corporate tax structure is the person to fix the problems and provide some level of relief for the working and middle class. Why on earth would he? What indication has he ever given that leads you to believe that he's anything but self serving.

I'm not going to rest my laurels on the "I'm not fan of Hillary" fence sitting stance. She's not perfect. She's a sucky communicator, she inexplicably tries to sugar coat obvious screw ups (i.e. "The FBI said I did nothing wrong). But she's not a criminal. She has a long history of being a public servant, and if either of them are going to make real change for the middle class, it's her. Donald Trump is a clueless, boisterous twerp and a huge chunk his of support comes from an equally dimwitted segment of the population that has had to convince themselves that a chain of conspiracy theories are 100% true. I love the Trump supporters calling the LIBTARDS "sheep" or telling them to "keep drinking the koolaid!" The irony is delicious and I'm hopeful that someday they'll see how ridiculously easily duped they were (although they probably won't).

 

[KentXie]

and have exported too much manufacturing to have a strong economy in the short term. We may be headed for 20-30 years of stagflation.

Manufacturing is for developing countries. Services and high tech is for developed countries. Why do you boneheads with no background knowledge on Economics insists on taking steps backwards?

And really, stop talking about the economy. You know nothing about the economy odurandina. All you do is throw around words like stagflation in attempt to scare people. Do you even know what stagflation means?

Stagflation - persistent high inflation combined with high unemployment and stagnant demand in a country's economy.

The US has a sub-5% unemployment rate and an unusually low inflation rate of 1.1%. It's not a stagflation so shut up.

 

[Jouhou]

Do all trump supporters believe this conspiracy theory? Do they believe in Santa Claus too?

 

[Justin7]

Do all trump supporters believe this conspiracy theory? Do they believe in Santa Claus too?

A very interesting read about one Trump Supporter / Conspiracy theorist: http://wapo.st/2dhgcdL

 

[TheRifleman]

Manufacturing is for developing countries. Services and high tech is for developed countries. Why do you boneheads with no background knowledge on Economics insists on taking steps backwards?

And really, stop talking about the economy. You know nothing about the economy odurandina. All you do is throw around words like stagflation in attempt to scare people. Do you even know what stagflation means?

Stagflation - persistent high inflation combined with high unemployment and stagnant demand in a country's economy.

The US has a sub-5% unemployment rate and an unusually low inflation rate of 1.1%. It's not a stagflation so shut up.

What Economy are you talking about? The one where the FED hasn't raised interest rates in 8 years?
No inflation?
Food, Housing, Education, daycare is not inflated?
Boston and most of the surrounding areas you have to be a millionaire to buy a house. NO INFLATION?
a good school will cost 250K 4 years room and board.
How about raising a child (the cost of raising a child is 300K-500K till they are 18)

What the fuck are you taking about no inflation?
50Million Americans are on Food Stamps.
Income inequality is the worst its ever been in this country. Don't you think that has something to do with Interest rates being so low for so long?

If the economy was doing so good we would not have so much Govt, Federal Reserve Intervention. Interest rates would be in a natural progression.

The FED gave OBAMA the biggest gift by never raising interest rates throughout his entire administration also printing unlimited taxpayers money QE. Now they are talking negative interest rates.

We are in one of the biggest asset bubbles in history and when the boomers start pulling their money of the stock markets everything will come down. ANd their will be nothing the Fed or the Govt will be able to do to stop this because they have kept interest rates so low for so long.

Expect crash by 2017--
America is in a Debt bubble--that most likely ends very ugly.
All the Fed/Govt did was kick the can down the road from 2008---The Piper is coming home to collect.
Also now that the Federal Reserve has recaptialized the banks by printing unlimited amounts of money only to watch the sheep go bankrupt and will pick up all there assets for pennies. This has been going on since the Beginning of time.

 

[TheRifleman]

First I will point out that the Clinton tax returns have been released and that you can read through them. They certainly paid taxes. You will probably ignore this. I am confused as to why.

You seem to have been manipulated to the point that you are afraid of facts. You refuse to educate yourself. You ignore anything that disagrees with your make-believe world view. You're being played, man.

Your first inclination will be to respond to me (again) by claiming that I am attacking you. I will point out (again) that I am trying to help. I know I should probably just ignore your posts because you're likely too old to change, but I just can't help but try to get through to you.

How did you get to this point? What made you turn to far right fringe websites? Were you looking for confirmation of something you couldn't find somewhere else? Honest questions. Not really expecting you to answer, but I'm curious.

Whatever

 

[Lrfox]

Whatever

Lol- this is this entire election in a nutshell. *comspiracy theories!* *logical rebuttal* *"whatever"*

I'm not a believer that all Trump supporters are idiots, but a lot of people sure have some serious blinders on.

 

[KentXie]

What Economy are you talking about? The one where the FED hasn't raised interest rates in 8 years?

FED didn't increase interest rate to stimulate spending, to discourage people from saving. In a depressed economy, the one thing you need people to do is spend money because that drives up demand which drives up growth.

No inflation?
Food, Housing, Education, daycare is not inflated?
Boston and most of the surrounding areas you have to be a millionaire to buy a house. NO INFLATION?

And in Detroit you need $500 to buy a house. This is a product of the local economy (i.e. the performance of a diverse economy versus one that puts all their eggs on a dying industry) and the amenities the city provides, which is boosted by a good tax base. The performance of a city is not an indicator of the economy as a whole.

a good school will cost 250K 4 years room and board.
How about raising a child (the cost of raising a child is 300K-500K till they are 18)

Again, another red herring. Increase in tuition has to do with the fact that the government has been providing proportionally less and less on aid for students and the fact that universities have competing with other universities by up scaling their amenities. This has NOTHING to do with inflation which is calculated based on how much a basket of goods increase each year (also known as CPI). Go to bls.gov and get yourself educated.

What the fuck are you taking about no inflation?
50Million Americans are on Food Stamps.
Income inequality is the worst its ever been in this country. Don't you think that has something to do with Interest rates being so low for so long?

No, it doesn't. A large portion of this is due to skill mismatch. Where the US has a competitive advantage against other nations are in jobs that require a college degree. This includes high-tech, financial services, and etc. This is why the majority of those unemployed are those that do not have a college degree.

If the economy was doing so good we would not have so much Govt, Federal Reserve Intervention. Interest rates would be in a natural progression.

The reason it has even progressed as far as it has is because of the intervention. Refer to the first point.

The FED gave OBAMA the biggest gift by never raising interest rates throughout his entire administration also printing unlimited taxpayers money QE. Now they are talking negative interest rates.

No they are not. I work at a bank, we follow the Fed and their (potential) actions to do our risk modeling. All talks are about raising interest rate so this is some bullshit that you pulled out of your ass.

We are in one of the biggest asset bubbles in history and when the boomers start pulling their money of the stock markets everything will come down. ANd their will be nothing the Fed or the Govt will be able to do to stop this because they have kept interest rates so low for so long.

Expect crash by 2017--
America is in a Debt bubble--that most likely ends very ugly.
All the Fed/Govt did was kick the can down the road from 2008---The Piper is coming home to collect.
Also now that the Federal Reserve has recaptialized the banks by printing unlimited amounts of money only to watch the sheep go bankrupt and will pick up all there assets for pennies. This has been going on since the Beginning of time.

More fearmongering. There has been a talk that next year would be the year the economy crash every single year and yet this has not materialize. Do yourself a favor Rifle, stay out of a topic you have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[TheRifleman]

Lol- this is this entire election in a nutshell. *comspiracy theories!* *logical rebuttal* *"whatever"*

I'm not a believer that all Trump supporters are idiots, but a lot of people sure have some serious blinders on.

It's not Trump supporters. Its a fuck you to the establishment. Romney, Bush, Clinton, Obama.

People are sick of the Govt Spending.

 

[TheRifleman]

FED didn't increase interest rate to stimulate spending, to discourage people from saving. In a depressed economy, the one thing you need people to do is spend money because that drives up demand which drives up growth.


And in Detroit you need $500 to buy a house. This is a product of the local economy (i.e. the performance of a diverse economy versus one that puts all their eggs on a dying industry) and the amenities the city provides, which is boosted by a good tax base. The performance of a city is not an indicator of the economy as a whole.


Again, another red herring. Increase in tuition has to do with the fact that the government has been providing proportionally less and less on aid for students and the fact that universities have competing with other universities by up scaling their amenities. This has NOTHING to do with inflation which is calculated based on how much a basket of goods increase each year (also known as CPI). Go to bls.gov and get yourself educated.


No, it doesn't. A large portion of this is due to skill mismatch. Where the US has a competitive advantage against other nations are in jobs that require a college degree. This includes high-tech, financial services, and etc. This is why the majority of those unemployed are those that do not have a college degree.


The reason it has even progressed as far as it has is because of the intervention. Refer to the first point.


No they are not. I work at a bank, we follow the Fed and their (potential) actions to do our risk modeling. All talks are about raising interest rate so this is some bullshit that you pulled out of your ass.



More fearmongering. There has been a talk that next year would be the year the economy crash every single year and yet this has not materialize. Do yourself a favor Rifle, stay out of a topic you have no idea what you're talking about.

Kentxie, Not sure where to begin with this.

I'm betting you live in Kendall Square in your condo and possibly went to school at MIT as an economist and study a bunch of useless economic models that are complete nonsense at this point.
The statement you say stay out of a topic you have no idea what your talking about shows how clueless you are to life in general.

There is only two ways out of the mathematical debt bomb our Govt created for the American People.
#1 We either inflate the currency into worthless toilet paper.
#2 Deflationary Collaspe due to Higher Interest rates since our Govt can't service the 20+ Trillion in additional interest payments.

Congress continues to not audit the Fed's balance sheet this is how corrupt the system is. We don't even know where 3 or 4 Trillion is of America Tax dollars went. Which banks borrowed this money?

America's Balance Sheet is full of UNLIMITED DEBT.
Unfunded Liabilties 000's Hundreds of Trillions
National Debt 20+ Trillion
Even both parties are petrified at this point to make a comment on this.
AND THIS IS HOW TRUMP was Created. A basic FUCK YOU since the republicans are the biggest hypocrites in the room. They act so conservative but continue to lead the masses on a suicide economic scenario.

Please enlighten me where these returns from Wall Street will come in the future especially when the boomers retire which is very soon.

The majority of the Big Corporations are cutting their pension programs. They are only offering 401K Programs. ITS BASICALLY OVER.

I believe anything is possible in this world. But mathematically speaking the United States Debt problems are BIG one and I don't believe they have a clue.

What about the other side of the coin. The Fed is supposed to keep balance in the system. What about the group that needs higher interest rates? So heading in for 10 years now we have had nothing but low interest rates. I guess that group doesn't matter right?

 

[Jouhou]

Rifle, that's called anarchism, what you're asking for. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disinformation read this or just accept my tl;dr : Trumps campaign tactics reek of Soviet era disinformation. There is a reason why the only international media outlets backing his claims up are RT and sputnik.