Green Line Extension to Medford & Union Sq

Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Semass said:
It is, in fact the funding for the community path. http://blog.mass.gov/transportation/mbta/green-line-extension-community-path-funding/

Would someone please explain to me why it is $20 MILLION PER MILE?????
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For better or worse, this is not your usual pave-atop-the-ballast rail trail following an interurban. It is a complex piece of urban infrastructure (see this 2012 presentation)

It is integrated with retaining walls (running atop them or between two of them), changes grades a lot (rising to meet the street grid, falling back to the railbed) and will require either a tunnel or a bridge at the Washington Street Station (across the Yard/Lowell Branch/Union Sq junction) to reach the Inner Belt.

It is hard to know how much of the cost is truly "the trail" as opposed to how much of the cost of the retaining walls and emergency egress paths they've allocated to the trail. But when you see the presentation, you'll see that every block presents its own engineering challenges.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

As for cost, the entire thing will be built on new retaining walls and a very expensive looking viaduct (see 1:10 of video below. Not sure if the cost of the path is the extra bits they are now agreeing to pay or the whole shebang, of which MassDOT was already committed to building about 40% (emergency egresses, etc.)

[u2b]<iframe width="560" height="349" src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuhM3Vxc_O8#t=71" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>[/u2b]
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

The video shows a *crazy long* bike-ped bridge (scary to users and to the taxpayer) whose ramps start rising up at 0:41 (on the right of the screen), rise up, cross over at 1:17, and don't touch down until 1:35 (on the left). I don't think we want a bike "skyway" any more than we want the highway flyovers from the 1950s

I have to believe that a more grounded path, even if it means a tunnel underpass, would be less scary.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuhM3Vxc_O8
 
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Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Do you find the North Bank bridge 'scary'? I don't.

The path needs to meet ADA guidelines, so it's not going to have any really steep climbs or descents.

(And I'd rather walk or bike on a bridge than in a tunnel.)
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Ron Newman said:
Do you find the North Bank bridge 'scary'? I don't.
The path needs to meet ADA guidelines, so it's not going to have any really steep climbs or descents.
(And I'd rather walk or bike on a bridge than in a tunnel.)
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I love the North Bank bridge--but have seen no concepts to suggest that that's what the SCP is going to get.

As depicted in the video, the SCP bridge is several times longer, looks narrower (like a "regular" ped overpass), and climbs twice as high (because it starts down at street level and has to climb up the rail embankment before it can go up and over)

So it would be scary from a mixing-of-speeds / head-on-traffic / muggers around corners / side-friction / hard-to-limp-off standpoint. And we'd hate it for all the reasons we hate the McCarthy Overpass. Just as we've realized that a certain kind of car skyway is a white elephant, I think we'd regret a too-long bike skyway too.
 
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Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Haha kjdonovan and Arlington, you managed to break vBulletin! Please remove the HTML. All you need to do is post the YouTube URL and vB will automatically parse it and embed the player.

I've never actually seen this happen before.
--
EDIT: Problem resolved.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Arlington said:
So it would be scary from a mixing-of-speeds / head-on-traffic / muggers around corners / side-friction / hard-to-limp-off standpoint. And we'd hate it for all the reasons we hate the McCarthy Overpass. Just as we've realized that a certain kind of car skyway is a white elephant, I think we'd regret a too-long bike skyway too.
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Yeah it will be exactly the same, minus the whole air pollution/noise/ped inaccessibility and danger from large motor vehicles, not to mention having about a tenth of the overall footprint of McGrath. :rolleyes:

Seriously, bikes can be slowed via traffic calming methods like small speed bumps and signs at the tops of inclines. Mugging I guess is an issue but would you really feel better in a dark tunnel near or below ground level than you would up where you can be seen? Not to mention the experience of walking underground is much less pleasant, with the skyway you will get some good views which will promote walking.

As for the bit about taxpayers, I don't have a problem paying for quality ped-bike oriented infrastructure, especially considering some of the other garbage tax money is wasted on. My only concern is that the overpass will feature ugly chain linked fence to deter jumpers/fallers as a result of cost when an aesthetically pleasing alternative might be possible. Sure that will cost money but in the long term it will be more costly to blow this opportunity to build something unique and world class. Psychologically if not financially.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Gov. Patrick announced today that the GLX project will include full build of the Community Path from it's current terminus near Davis to Northpoint.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

And by the time that's finished, I hope the final section (bridge across the Charles River to North Station) is also well underway.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

abdinoor said:
The tire facility at 21 Water Street is still standing. But the pile of dirt being stored in front if it has grown, a lot.
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In addition, work on the Medford Street bridge (by the Target), which was supposed to be done in March, essentially hasn't begun. I think they finished painting the existing bridge last year, but other than that I haven't seen any activity.

Unfortunately, Phase 1 seems to still be a long way from completion.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Hate to be a downer, but one thing that caught my attention with the announcement was that delay creep continues to plague this project.

Back in 2011 the bad news was the opening was delayed to 2018 "at the earliest":
http://www.boston.com/yourtown/news/medford/2011/08/state_greenline_extension_will.html

Then the state said it would be in early 2019 (slide 3)
http://greenlineextension.eot.state.ma.us/documents/PubMtgs/Phase1/Phase1_Presentation_031413.pdf

Latest news says 2020
http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...-green-line/RmkOE91u4vRbI1K3scJlJI/story.html
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Coulda sworn I read late 2017 for Lechmere, Union and Brickbottom recently.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

2017 is the first three stations, which is a silver lining. The next four coming on line makes up the "finished project."
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Phase II (the first 3 stations Lechmere, Washington, Union) is much more "locked in" because it can be operated with the existing Green Line vehicle fleet serviced from existing yards. If they hustle, they can still get it done by 2017.

And Phase IV (Gillman, Lowell, Ball, College), (including the bike path from Lowell to Washington), while expensive, is certainly popular and fairly straightforward from a political and engineering standpoint.

The slippage seems to be all in Phase III and phantom phase of vehicle procurement (getting a fleet large enough to actually cover all the new areas). The existing Green Line fleet actually overflows existing yards--part of the reason why we don't see more 3-car trains today.

Phase III of the infrastructure is the expensive, un-sexy, storage yard that nobody wants, and that Brickbottom was able to push out of its Backyard (I think this was wrong--if Lechmere could store vehicles, so could have Brickbottom)

And they can't seem to get started on *procuring* the new Type 9 vehicles, getting them built and delivered and *stored* somewhere. This is the part they're really dropping the ball on.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Arlington said:
And they can't seem to get started on *procuring* the new Type 9 vehicles, getting them built and delivered and *stored* somewhere. This is the part they're really dropping the ball on.
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They requested the bids for the 24 Type 9s back in 2011 and have been sitting on two bids since.
https://www.massdot.state.ma.us/Portals/17/docs/sip/April_2014_SIP_2014-04.pdf
from the sip update report:
"Procurement of 24 new Green Line vehicles needed to support the operation of the Green Line Extension is ongoing. The MBTA advertised for the new vehicles in January 2011 and held a pre-bid meeting for prospective bidders in February 2011. Proposals were submitted to the MBTA by two potential builders of the new Green Line vehicleson June 13, 2011, and have been reviewed by the MBTA Technical Selection Committee. To date, pricing in the proposals has been extended month to month by both proposers. In March 2013, the MBTA requested the two proposing teams to update and re-submit their proposals as a Best and Final Offer to the MBTA; these were received in September 2013. MBTA continues its process to procure additional vehicles to support the GLX project, with an updated target date to award a contract in May 2014."


The May MassDOT/MBTA board meeting is coming up soon, we'll see if the Type 9 contract finally make it to them to vote on.
 
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Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

This probably isn't the right place for this but since we were just talking about the terminus of the SCP and navigating Leverett Circle/Storrow et al.

http://www.mhd.state.ma.us/default.asp?pgid=content/hearings/boston_050614&sid=hearing

"The purpose of this meeting is to provide the public with a project status update and opportunity to become fully acquainted with the proposed Leverett Circle Pedestrian Bridge project. All views and comments made at the meeting will be reviewed and considered to the maximum extent possible."
"The proposed project consists of designing a new ADA compliant overhead/pedestrian bridge over O'Brien Highway and Nashua Street which connects directly to the MBTA Science Station on the Green Line. At grade improvements will also be made to the intersection below. The proposed bridge structure will provide multi modal accommodations for pedestrians and cyclists.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Any talk about the proposed 18 month shutdown of the Green Line past North Station while they rebuilt the elevated way around O'Brien highway?

I'm curious, where will they store trains if Lechmere is cut off from the network?
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Matthew said:
Any talk about the proposed 18 month shutdown of the Green Line past North Station while they rebuilt the elevated way around O'Brien highway?

I'm curious, where will they store trains if Lechmere is cut off from the network?
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I still think it's dumb that they have to close the station for a year and a half... land-swap issues I'm guessing...

As for the storage, they shut down the viaduct a couple years ago when they rebuilt Science Park, so they must know how to manage it...
 
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