Logan Airport Flights and Airlines Discussion

I'm interested to see how this will work out for the current U.S Airways routes with American now focusing on their hubs as more of their model.
 
BosDevelop said:
Herald article on efforts to bring non-stop service from Logan to Tel Aviv: http://bostonherald.com/business/bu...fficials_push_land_deal_direct_flights_israel
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Seems like a natural market when El Al gets 787s (hoping the 787 is cleared to fly by then). This is an amazing-if-true pair of facts from the Herald:
“There’s about 80 passengers a day now going each way between Boston and Israel. That’s about two-thirds of a plane,” Glynn said. “In addition to the Jewish community in Boston, there are a lot of institutions like Harvard, MIT and Brandeis that have a lot of business and family relationships in Israel.”

Direct service would further incentivize Israeli companies to build operations in Boston, which is known for its high-tech industry and hospitals, Bazak said. He added that 44 percent of Israelis who start companies in the United States do so in the Bay State and more than 120 Israeli companies already in Massachusetts generate $2.4 billion in direct revenue.
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It would be nice to get El Al however considering their inability to make Miami work I can't see Boston lasting once the subsidies run out. As I understand it the 787s, of which they only have two on order, will replace existing 767s rather than be used to open new routes.
 
kmp1284 said:
It would be nice to get El Al however considering their inability to make Miami work I can't see Boston lasting once the subsidies run out. As I understand it the 787s, of which they only have two on order, will replace existing 767s rather than be used to open new routes.
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If what the Herald states is true in regards to nearly half of Israeli business started in the US being started here in Massachusetts, we may have a better shot at sustaining the route with more business travel than Miami might see. Just guessing here but Miami must have been predominately leisure travelers, no? Sure the Miami area is home to a large concentration of Jewish residents who might be inclined to travel to Israel for pleasure. But my experience has been that many Jewish folks (obviously excluding the ultra religious) either aren't interested in traveling to Israel or have been before and view it is a once in a lifetime kind of trip. There is no question a Logan route would fail absent a large number of business travelers.
 
I would never fly on El Al; it just seems like too much of a target, precautions notwithstanding. I can see how even people who travel to Israel regularly might feel the same.
 
czsz said:
I would never fly on El Al; it just seems like too much of a target, precautions notwithstanding. I can see how even people who travel to Israel regularly might feel the same.
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That seems pretty silly to me. Has an El Al passenger ever been killed on a flight? I believe there has only been one successful hijacking of an El Al plane and all hostages were eventually freed. Also, I don't believe they have ever had a crash of a passenger plane which is rather remarkable for an airline in business for 60+ years. I would feel safer flying on EL AL than most American carriers.
 
BosDevelop said:
That seems pretty silly to me. Has an El Al passenger ever been killed on a flight? I believe there has only been one successful hijacking of an El Al plane and all hostages were eventually freed. Also, I don't believe they have ever had a crash of a passenger plane which is rather remarkable for an airline in business for 60+ years. I would feel safer flying on EL AL than most American carriers.
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I would never fly el al for many reasons.
 
BosDevelop said:
If what the Herald states is true in regards to nearly half of Israeli business started in the US being started here in Massachusetts, we may have a better shot at sustaining the route with more business travel than Miami might see. Just guessing here but Miami must have been predominately leisure travelers, no? Sure the Miami area is home to a large concentration of Jewish residents who might be inclined to travel to Israel for pleasure. But my experience has been that many Jewish folks (obviously excluding the ultra religious) either aren't interested in traveling to Israel or have been before and view it is a once in a lifetime kind of trip. There is no question a Logan route would fail absent a large number of business travelers.
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Boston is way better than Miami from a route-fit standpoint. As the Herald reported, Boston has the educational, pharma, and tech *business* ties to drive route success, not just the religious ties.

Miami, as a Jewish community, is leisure oriented, while its business community is Latin-America oriented. It might work with a 787, though--but Boston will work better.
 
80 passengers are "about two thirds" of a planeload? Really? Planes that fly transcontinental routes normally carry 120 people?
 
Tombstoner said:
80 passengers are "about two thirds" of a planeload? Really? Planes that fly transcontinental routes normally carry 120 people?
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I have no idea where they are getting that claim from either. The 787 is a pretty big bird that seats around 240. 80 appears to be 1/3, not 2/3.

Israel is about 4500 nmi away from Boston, so the 767-200, which is the smallest 767 seating around 180, wouldn't actually reach that far and 80 is still less than half a passenger load.
 
Not to mention not everyone who goes to Israel will do so with El Al. A good number will undoubtedly stick with the major European carriers that have established a following on this route over the last several decades. Swiss, British and Lufthansa each carry a rather healthy percentage of Boston's Israel bound traffic. With the lack of connecting opportunities at either end there's little chance of filling the other ~120 seats on the plane.
 
El Al also guards it's planes 24/7, literally!! Security on the inside as well as outside, landside, during it's turn-around time! The cost of the security alone is a huge added factor for El Al to consider when it's looking at the bottom line!
 
atlantaden said:
El Al also guards it's planes 24/7, literally!! Security on the inside as well as outside, landside, during it's turn-around time! The cost of the security alone is a huge added factor for El Al to consider when it's looking at the bottom line!
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I think cz was alluding to the fact that they are a target for missile strikes. No matter how much security you have on board and around the aircraft on the ground, you can't guarantee a militant group won't fire off a missile at a civilian plane. I guess that factors into any plane flying in that airspace, but El Al seems like a particular national target that wouldn't start a World War.

That said, El Al's amenities are INSANE. Their crafts are beautiful and service is top-notch.
 
Their hard product is shit. Their first looks like somthing off Pan Am and their business class is similarly antiquated.
 
Following an attempt to shoot down an Israeli airliner in 2002,[52] all aircraft in the fleet have been equipped with an infrared countermeasures system called Flight Guard, developed by Israeli Aerospace Industries to defend them against anti-aircraft missiles.[53][54][55][56] Although comparable systems such as CAMPS are now available for civilian aircraft, there is no information to date about any other airlines deploying such a system. Switzerland and other European countries have expressed concern that flares dropped by the Israeli system could cause fires in the vicinity of an airport.[57]

I copied this from Wiki (if that's kosher to do here on archBoston) To use your expression, Data, their security is INSANE, and totally justified!! No other airline comes close to El Al's security measures!
 
With the lack of connecting opportunities at either end there's little chance of filling the other ~120 seats on the plane.
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Why would there be a 'lack of connecting opportunities' at the Boston end?
 
Ron Newman said:
Why would there be a 'lack of connecting opportunities' at the Boston end?
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Because there isn't. El Al is not part of a major air alliance (Star, One World, Sky) and does not have any agreements with US carriers.

Lufthansa for example, would be able to connect passengers in Boston, which is does already, to say Chicago, or Los Angeles via United flights.

The flight would draw the birth right trips where people have to make the trek down to JFK or Newark to catch the El Al flights. There would also be some market stimulation with the introduction of a non-stop flight.
 
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