North Bank Bridge Pedestrian Walkway

underground said:
Someone might get hit? My word! Well, we should probably cover everyone in pillows to save them from the hooligan teenage scourge then.

/clutches pearls and thinks of the children.
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Undergr -- you've been watching too much of Downton Abbey
 
whighlander said:
No -- my idea of a well regulated pedestrian bridge is a bridge for all --- compatible with the least able -- much as the law of the sea governs how row boats, sailboats, motor boats and super tankers can in principle navigate the same harbor
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Earlier you were noy saying that skateboards should "navigate the same harbor" you were musing on how to keep skateboards off the bridge period.

If you want to use your anology correctly it woud be since rowboats are allowed on Lake Winnipesaukee, Jet skis shouldn't becasue they are faster and more dangerous and are usualy driven by younger poeople.

A "bridge for all" includes skateboarders.
 
found5dollar said:
Earlier you were noy saying that skateboards should "navigate the same harbor" you were musing on how to keep skateboards off the bridge period.

If you want to use your anology correctly it woud be since rowboats are allowed on Lake Winnipesaukee, Jet skis shouldn't becasue they are faster and more dangerous and are usualy driven by younger poeople.

A "bridge for all" includes skateboarders.
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Found$ -- I said that everything on the bridge needs to be compatible with the least able amongst us.

Basically that mean everything needs to accommodate someone walking with a cane, two crutches or someone who is unstable and wanders from rail to rail -- if you can skateboard or bike on that bridge -- then go for it.

My simple rule to ensure compatibility would be -- walk on the bridge -- and thus a No to:
a) riding of boards
b) riding of bikes
c) riding of motorcycles
d) in-line skating
e) powered Segways
f) riding of human or motor scooters
g) loose dogs
h) skiing in the winter?
i) row boating when flooded?
 
I can see it now...

"Welcome to the North Point Cycling & Pedestrian Overpass Bridge, adjacent to the Shred Zone Skatepark!

The following are not allowed on this bridge:
-Bicycling
-Skateboarding
-Walking faster than 2 MPH
-etc"
 
BostonUrbEx said:
I can see it now...

"Welcome to the North Point Cycling & Pedestrian Overpass Bridge, adjacent to the Shred Zone Skatepark!

The following are not allowed on this bridge:
-Bicycling
-Skateboarding
-Walking faster than 2 MPH
-etc"
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Urb -- you forgot:
Loose dogs
Segways
teams practicing for the "Hoyt Division" of the Marathon
individuals or teams practicing for the Mens' or Womens' Wheelchairs in the Marathon
individuals or teams practicing for the Modern Pentathlon
individuals or teams practicing for the Biathlon
Photographers riding in rickshaws
anyone in a sedan chair
.....etc.


By the way -- 2 MPH is kinda fast -- I think we need to make Vmax about pi/2 MPH
 
whighlander said:
Found$ -- I said that everything on the bridge needs to be compatible with the least able amongst us.

Basically that mean everything needs to accommodate someone walking with a cane, two crutches or someone who is unstable and wanders from rail to rail -- if you can skateboard or bike on that bridge -- then go for it.

My simple rule to ensure compatibility would be -- walk on the bridge -- and thus a No to:
a) riding of boards
b) riding of bikes
c) riding of motorcycles
d) in-line skating
e) powered Segways
f) riding of human or motor scooters
g) loose dogs
h) skiing in the winter?
i) row boating when flooded?
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you are either crazy or trolling, either way I am done.
 
found5dollar said:
you are either crazy or trolling, either way I am done.
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Found$ -- my point is that while is looks like discrimination to ban skateboarding on a bridge connecting to a skateboarding park

The vast majority of people on the bridge will benefit from not having to dodge skateboards and the pain for the skateboarders carrying the boards for a few minutes is minimal
 
Even if grinding does occur on the rails of the bridge, as long as it doesn't cause real damage, and if it's not done while pedestrians are walking across the bridge...who gives a shit. Likewise for skaters skating across.

Believe it or not, I think most of these kids know better.
 
briv said:
Even if grinding does occur on the rails of the bridge, as long as it doesn't cause real damage, and if it's not done while pedestrians are walking across the bridge...who gives a shit. Likewise for skaters skating across.

Believe it or not, I think most of these kids know better.
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Briv -- All I know is that if I was 9, 10, 11, 12, 13,.. -- that bridge would be an undeniable attractant for at least mildly crazy behavior. I would be there with some of my competitive friends trying stuff which in the absence of others might only be mildly damaging to us. However, mix-in someone who is unprepared to meet a speeding kid and unable to take effective protective measures and you could have a tragic accident.

I don't think that I was that wild and crazy compared to my compatriots -- but between 8 and about 14 I:
1) drafted behind vehicles while riding a bike down long hills to see just how fast you might be able to go with less air resistance
2) sprayed water on snow to make an icy launch ramp for sledding down hills
3) raced against my peers down paths in a park with primitive skateboards which we built

kids and the lure of speed are inseparably linked

So I would challenge your statement about kids knowing better -- they don't

Not that they mean to be dangerous -- they are just kids

And some of us are still kids at heart -- I for one still enjoy running along with my dog down a local hill in our park after / during the first snow of the season and often ending skidding and sliding on the snow together down the last few feet -- with a lot of barking and laughing
 
underground said:
It's not Nanny Stating if it's something you don't like. I guess...
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Underg -- With freedom to act comes the requirement to take responsibility for the action and its impact on other individuals and their property -- including public property

Unfortunately, we know from common experience that skateboarders, typically of the teenage male category will skate on any surface which is not vertical -- in a sense they act as the human equivalent of pigeons
 
So then, if behavior isn't responsible according to output standard, you want the all powerful state to step in. There is a word for that, one that is verboten in Germany.
 
Do the sk8rs here honestly think there won't be a *real problem* mixing access to a skatepark with the North Bank's "inverted-half-pipe" bridge?

Its laughable to call it fascism to ask skaters to walk their boards on the bridge.

Here's an analogy: In Arlington Center the Minuteman Bikeway is interrupted by sidewalks and crosswalks. They have a *real problem* mixing access to a cycling freeway with other things that *appear* great for cycling but aren't (the sidewalks and crosswalks). Its bad, its dangerous, and ultimately some mix of designers and cyclists are at fault.

Its not the fault of the pedestrians, and its not the fault of people who might have predicted trouble.

Hardly fascists, Arlington has posted a stop sign (for the cyclists) and a "No Biking on the Sidewalks" sign and they occasionally ticket. Cyclists (young and old) sometimes wrongly ignore the ban and mix badly with pedestrians. The scofflaws attract the anger of a mix of pedestrians and law-abiding cyclists (and skaters, for all I know).

Something like that will happen at the North Bank Bridge. Its not the fault of the pedestrians, and its not the fault of people who might have predicted trouble.
 
HenryAlan said:
So then, if behavior isn't responsible according to output standard, you want the all powerful state to step in. There is a word for that, one that is verboten in Germany.
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Henry -- somebody or something in its infinite wisdom or perhaps accidents of molecular collisions -- whatever -- led to the concept of a family - whereby irresponsible children would be managed and controlled by the adults until the children had acquired the requisite sense of responsibility for their actions

However the all-powerful state has diminished the role of parents and many parents have abdicated their parental responsibilities and the result is somewhat predictable -- kids running somewhat wild

But dump all that heavy stuff -- all that is needed is common sense rules -- no running, skating, skiing or biking -- just walking or wheeling for those unable to walk-- leave the bridge and have-at-it
 
Leaving aside the problems in Arlington Center, the Minuteman is not just a 'bicycle freeway'. It is also for pedestrians, dog walkers, and the occasional rollerblader and skateboarder.
 
Does anyone have the numbers for hefty teenage skateboarder related deaths? How many more need to die before we have a frank and honest discussion?
 
Justin7 said:
Does anyone have the numbers for hefty teenage skateboarder related deaths? How many more need to die before we have a frank and honest discussion?
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Justin -- be serious -- Boston is considered a safe place to drive - -why not because of the absence of collisions -- but because the numerous collisions are low velocity and hence rarely fatal

Two people having a low-velocity collision (say 15 mph relative velocity) with each driving a car have a lot of crush-able metal to absorb the kinetic energy in the collision. Take away the metal cans and two people colliding at say 15 mph -- easily achievable by a bike or a skateboard on a down-slope -- can do some significant damage to one or both. Throw in a wheelchair or someone using crutches and the collision can be very serious.

For example, a few years ago a well-known elderly gentleman was either rendered comatose or killed outright while crossing the street by a collision with a bicycle messenger -- I think it was on Comm Ave or Beacon St -- although I don't remember the details.

From a personal perspective I've been hit by a car on foot, and while on a bike and by a bike while on foot at roughly the same relative velocity -- none was pleasant -- but I think that the bike hitting the pedestrian actually hurt more. I also stopped once very abruptly to avoid a pedestrian who stopped in the middle of a street while I was speeding down a hill on my bike in Austin TX -- the bike never hit her -- but I went over the handlebars and landed on her in the equivalent of a open-field tackle -- she was well padded [ :=} ] and so neither of us were seriously hurt.
 
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found5dollar said:
your typo sums up your argument.
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Found$ -- you are so embedded in your mindset -- You didn't even do the readers the favor of finding it --

"From a personal perspective I've been hit by a car on foot, and while on a bile and by a bike while on foot at roughly the same relative velocity"

However -- i thank you for doing my proof reading as the spekk checker doesn't find typo errors which end-up as typical English words

I fixed it!

As for your contention -- well Nothing could be further from the truth

I'm all for pleasant, camaraderie among various users of parks, walks, etc. - everyone just has to be considerate of the others

dog walkers -- pick-up your waste
smokers don't drop buts
little kids and your parents -- don't pick the flowers
skateboarders -- carry your boards on pedestrian bridges
bike riders -- walk your bikes on a pedestrian bridge

It's really not hard-- at-all
 
briv said:
Even if grinding does occur on the rails of the bridge, as long as it doesn't cause real damage, and if it's not done while pedestrians are walking across the bridge...who gives a shit. Likewise for skaters skating across.

Believe it or not, I think most of these kids know better.
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I think that the issues with damage to granite at the park on the pier area by the aquarium speak volumes. It's also a noisy, loud, and obnoxious activity, just like motorcyles.
 
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